Chapter 2 of The Gathering Storm available

[pat5150]

I should finish it later today. . .

I'm sworn to secrecy, so I can't say much. All I can tell you is that TGS is much akin to WH and CoT, in that 2/3 of the book focuses on secondary plotlines. There are some good stuff in there, mind you. It's just that with Tarmon Gai'don so near, I'm wondering why they felt the need to do that. Basically, it's the WoT equivalent of Erikson's Toll the Hounds. I've already spoken to Sanderson about this, and will explain that in my review.

As for the writing, some things work, others don't. To my eternal chagrin, Sanderson can't really do Mat. . . :bawl:

More later. . .

Patrick

[Slick Mongoose]

TGS is much akin to WH and CoT, in that 2/3 of the book focuses on secondary plotlines.

But does it have a lot more action and plot progression?

Basically, it's the WoT equivalent of Erikson's Toll the Hounds.

I'm assuming you don't mean in terms of endless introspection?

[fionwe1987]

I should finish it later today. . .

I'm sworn to secrecy, so I can't say much. All I can tell you is that TGS is much akin to WH and CoT, in that 2/3 of the book focuses on secondary plotlines. There are some good stuff in there, mind you. It's just that with Tarmon Gai'don so near, I'm wondering why they felt the need to do that. Basically, it's the WoT equivalent of Erikson's Toll the Hounds. I've already spoken to Sanderson about this, and will explain that in my review.

Oh no! I don't know if our definitions of secondary plotlines will match, but this isn't a nice thing to hear. I'm trying hard to get a copy early by trawling through smaller bookstores. I hope 5 years of expectations aren't all dashed.

Really, the Egwene chapter gave me a lot of hope that this is going to be a great book. Your equating it with Toll the Hounds doesn't bode too well though. Is it because of the lack of action, or is it because there's more introspection and the probable descent to darkness of Rand? If the latter, than I'm reassured. The first chapters of Rand and Egwene were pretty good for me, and I like how BS was able to capture their thinking despite not using a style too similar to Jordan's.

I've always felt that these two would be the pivotal characters for the LB, and before they start working together, there will be a conflict between them. If tGS is about that, I'm going to be glad.

As for the writing, some things work, others don't. To my eternal chagrin, Sanderson can't really do Mat. . . :bawl:

That sucks! Mat was one of RJ's best, providing some of the best humour I've had the pleasure to read in epic fantasy. If BS screws that up, I'm not going to be too happy. :(

[pat5150]

No, not too much introspection, though there is a little. And way too many exclamation points, if you ask me.

It similar to Toll the Hounds in the way few events of importance in the greater scheme of things occur for about 2/3 of the book, and then the shit hits the fan.

Mat is gone, folks. It's like the character is being played by a new actor who tries too hard to be funny. A shame. . . :(

Can't really say more. Have about 50 pages to go now. . .

It's similar to WH and CoT because the books don't move the plot forward all that much for the better part of the novel, what with being bogged down with secondary storylines. And then, like the cleansing of saidin, something really cool and important happens. But there are also decidedly anticlimactic resolution to plotlines that we've been following since TGH. Think about how weird it was that the culmination of the entire Bowl of the Winds thread ended up being so quick and to a certain extent lame. . .

By splitting AMoL into three volumes, they turned the final novel into a trilogy. And in every trilogy, the first volume is a set-up book. Which is the case here. . . I would have thought that 11 WoT volumes provided enough of a set-up, but I guess some people didn't really feel this way. . .

More later. . .

Patrick

[Cot]

Hate to start my first post on these boards in troll-like fashion, but this isn't good to hear at all.

Have they started looking for a successor to Sanderson, I know he's still young but the way things are headed...

[MaesterLuwin]

Damn, that's too bad about Mat. I can't even blame Sanderson, really; I can imagine Mat would be the hardest character to write for, definitely more difficult than Rand and Perrin.

By secondary plotlines, do you mean non-Tarmon Gai'don related plotlines? Because I'll be happy if we get a book about dealing with the whole Seanchan mess, especially if it means they attack the White Tower.

Still, people have been waiting for the Black Tower to be rent in fire and blood since Book 8. I guess we'll have to wait a little while longer.

EDIT: I'm glad these foibles come out, at least, so I don't get my hopes up too much.

[Poobah]

No, not too much introspection, though there is a little. And way too many exclamation points, if you ask me.

It similar to Toll the Hounds in the way few events of importance in the greater scheme of things occur for about 2/3 of the book, and then the shit hits the fan.

Mat is gone, folks. It's like the character is being played by a new actor who tries too hard to be funny. A shame. . . :(

Can't really say more. Have about 50 pages to go now. . .

It's similar to WH and CoT because the books don't move the plot forward all that much for the better part of the novel, what with being bogged down with secondary storylines. And then, like the cleansing of saidin, something really cool and important happens. But there are also decidedly anticlimactic resolution to plotlines that we've been following since TGH. Think about how weird it was that the culmination of the entire Bowl of the Winds thread ended up being so quick and to a certain extent lame. . .

By splitting AMoL into three volumes, they turned the final novel into a trilogy. And in every trilogy, the first volume is a set-up book. Which is the case here. . . I would have thought that 11 WoT volumes provided enough of a set-up, but I guess some people didn't really feel this way. . .

More later. . .

Patrick

:(

And yeah, turning it into a trilogy was bloody stupid. Not sure I'll even bother buying it now, even more so than before. I certainly feel that my negative comments about this whole thing back last year or whenever are being justified now. Hopefully I can snag it from a library or something, just because I don't want to pay for it doesn't mean that I can bare to have gotten to book 11 and then not see the end.

[pat5150]

One thing about Brandon Sanderson: Tor knew what he brought to the dance when they selected him. Though I think that Sanderson is a good author, in terms of style I didn't think he was a great match for the WoT. Having said that, and now with only about 40 pages to go, I can tell you that Brandon Sanderson has given everything he has for TGS. He cares too much about the series, and this is nothing short of his best effort.

Whereas Frank Hebert must be turning in his grave when he sees what was done with Dune, I have a feeling that RJ would give Sanderson the thumbs up.

Still, Sanderson's different narrative voice doesn't always work well, and his ability to create more black or white characters means that he can't pull it off with certain characters that have more depth or are more ambiguous. No worries, Rand are Perrin are well-portrayed. But one is going mad and the other has never been the sharpest tool in the shed. He does Cadsuane and Nynaeve rather well, too. But Mat, he simply doesn't have it in him. I figure it will be the same with Lan, and a few others. . .

Say what you will, but Brandon Sanderson gave his all to write this. So this won't be another Dune travesty. . .

Patrick

[Maia]

How is Egwene? I mean, chapter 2 seemed good, but there were rumors that it was mostly written by Jordan.

Well, I guess that it is lucky for me that I am indifferent to Mat ;). As long as he isn't actively painful to read... As to Lan, him not having a PoV would make him easier to write. His PoV in New Spring was relatively black and white too.

I also wonder how you define primary and secondary storylines. For me, Tower unfication and purge, which countless previews stated is going to be one of the 2 focal points of the book, _is_ primary.

Hm... don't rightly remember what dangling plot-lines there were from TGH the resolution of which could disappoint.

Verin, her goals and her allegiance? Well, a pity if so, particularly since Sanderson is fully capable of writing ambiguous folks steepled in manipulation, but not that huge.

[pat5150]

Just finished TGS. . .

I'm not supposed to review it till the 27th, so we will have to wait and see if the powers that be at Tor Books permit me to put a review up sooner.

I can tell you that now that I'm done, The Gathering Storm is pretty similar to The Path of Daggers, Winter's Heart, and Crossroads of Twilight. Indeed, there is some damn cool stuff in the book, but the rhythm is bogged down by the focus on extraneous plotlines that don't necessarily have that much impact in the greater scheme of things.

I enjoyed the book, as I've enjoyed every WoT volume to one extent or another, but we are far from the quickened pace of Knife of Dreams, or the the heydays of the early WoT books.

Moreover, reaching the end of the book, you don't get the feeling that we are any closer to Tarmon Gai'don than we were at the end of Knife of Dreams. . .

Wish I could mention the cool stuff, but Tor will send ninjas to get me if I do!;)

Patrick

[Rhom]

Just finished TGS. . .

I'm not supposed to review it till the 27th, so we will have to wait and see if the powers that be at Tor Books permit me to put a review up sooner.

I can tell you that now that I'm done, The Gathering Storm is pretty similar to The Path of Daggers, Winter's Heart, and Crossroads of Twilight. Indeed, there is some damn cool stuff in the book, but the rhythm is bogged down by the focus on extraneous plotlines that don't necessarily have that much impact in the greater scheme of things.

I enjoyed the book, as I've enjoyed every WoT volume to one extent or another, but we are far from the quickened pace of Knife of Dreams, or the the heydays of the early WoT books.

Moreover, reaching the end of the book, you don't get the feeling that we are any closer to Tarmon Gai'don than we were at the end of Knife of Dreams. . .

Wish I could mention the cool stuff, but Tor will send ninjas to get me if I do!;)

Patrick

Well, that's certainly disappointing... but it won't stop me from reading it. I've got too much invested in it to give up now. I'm also not one to pray for a library either, in the scheme of things 20 bucks isn't a big enough impediment to keep me from reading it right away.

ETA: As I think more on why I'm disappointed, I think its because I had hoped that a writer with a tighter narrative structure like Sanderson has shown would be able to move the plot forward. Then again, Jordan had made such a mess of things that I could see how it very easily might take a full book to get the convoluted mess untangled enough to begin moving forward. I suppose I should just be glad if there aren't new plotthreads opening up now like the ghosts that started popping up for no reason in CoT.

[awesome possum]

Thirteen years ago when I first started reading this series and fell in love, I never thought I'd end up saying or even thinking this, but I'll probably just wait a few more years and then read the Wikipedia summary or something. I may read the last chapter of the final book at the library or in a bookstore, but this series stopped being worth the effort when Jordan still thought he'd live to finish it. And that's a goddamned shame.

[kcf]

It's my understanding that a shipment went out to various reviewers today. So, a lot of bloggers (including me) will get TGS tomorrow or Wednesday. I expect you'll start hearing bits about after that, though we've all been asked to withhold reviews until the 27th.

Also, more and more copies are getting sold to persistent fans early. Most bookstores have theis stock now (or will get it this week). It appears that some are a bit ignorant about the hard rules about waiting until the 27th before release.

[Humble Asskicker]

Mat is gone, folks. It's like the character is being played by a new actor who tries too hard to be funny. A shame. . .

That's the sole character I had concern for - Mat was one of the very few interesting non-caricatures who would be difficult to duplicate properly.

As I think more on why I'm disappointed, I think its because I had hoped that a writer with a tighter narrative structure like Sanderson has shown would be able to move the plot forward.

This was my hope as well. I guess Chapter 1 should have indicated for a more realistic perspective. Even as a tighter summary, it didn't move anything forward.

Well, I guess that is that. It's not enough to deter me from purchasing the book, but I do think I'll hold off on the reading until the other volumes come out. Then again, these discussions are a grave addiction to me, so I doubt I will hold out for long.

[Guest Ro_]

Pat, can you say if the focus on the side storylines is positive in a way that that may indicate a tying up of all that extra *stuff*?

[Werthead]

Someone on Dragonmoun disagreed with Pat's assessment:

I can't answer specifically without spoilers. But I will say that what's considered a major or minor plotline can be fairly subjective. In my opinion, there's one major plotline resolved and several smaller ones as well. And a major plot arc is advanced, but perhaps not as much as you'd wish. I'm perfectly content to wait for that resolution though.

Also, a count for the book was given. 49 chapters, prologue, epilogue and a new map, but we don't know what of.

[Guest Ro_]

I confess that after all these years, the large majority of the minor plotlines interest me more than the major. With RJ stating he wasn't going to close all...I find myself frustrated all over again thinking about it. :P

And Wert...to at least try to be delicate here...I think anyone who is still active enough at Dragonmount to receive an advanced copy may not be the most subjective person.

[Werthead]

Agreed, which is why Pat's more independantly-minded review is interesting. However, this other person at Dragonomount isn't one of those who slavishly thinks every book in the series is amazing (Jason, the main admin, does). I'm also not sure if there's much room for discussion on what a 'major' storyline is in the grand scheme of things.

I think this is one case where we'll have to wait and see what happens ourselves ;) People are going to be arguing about this one for some time to come, I can tell already.

[MaesterLuwin]

Yeah, I haven't trusted Dragonmount since their Crossroads of Twilight review...

I am intrigued that some plotlines that started in The Great Hunt finally get resolved. Do we find out what Verin's doing? Will Tuon reveal to all the Seanchan that sul'dam can channel? Will Hurin show up again?

If this installment ends with the Seanchan war over and dealt with, I'll consider that a decent amount of progression. The way I see it, Rand has three major issues left to deal with - the Seanchan, the Borderlanders, and the Black Tower split. I have a feeling the Black Tower is not going to fall apart until around the time of the Last Battle, and I have no idea what the Borderlanders want, but I can see the Seanchan stuff being tied up in TGS, both with Rand's offer of a truce, and their attack on the White Tower.

All I know that if readers get the sense that AMoL could have been done in anything less than three books, there will be even more pissed off ex-fans than there already are...

[Guest Ro_]

I think this is one case where we'll have to wait and see what happens ourselves ;) People are going to be arguing about this one for some time to come, I can tell already.

:rofl:

Then nothing will have changed. :D The wow wiki thing has a list of unfinished storylines, and perhaps tomorrow?? I plan on making my own master list of stuff I want to see closed.