78 replies to this topic

[ja4161]

Kermit, on 21 April 2011 - 06:32 PM, said:

So, what's the deal with the seasons? It sounds like they're unpredictably long ... is there a reason? And if that's so, what does it mean to say, for instance, that Bran is 10? Is there still a summer solstice every 365.25 days, that people use to mark the passage of time?

Other than the seasons (and dragons?) it seems the world follows the same rules as our own ... is there any magic, or other supernatural phenomena?

The varying seasons are not as unrealistic as one might think.  Earth is rather unique in having one very large moon by comparison that keeps the planet on a stable axis.  If a planet has no moon or multiple moons then it's much less likely to have a stable axis or tilt.  It's the Earth's tilt that results in seasons.  Stay tuned and you'll find out more about the moons in A Game of Thrones.  Not sure if Martin really thought much about the physics of it all, but the idea is plausible.  The lack of stable seasons wouldn't have anything to do with the planet's orbit around it's star.  Therefore, it would still have years in the traditional sense..., ie, how many days it takes a planet to orbit it's star.


Is there magic or other supernatural phenomena?  Without spoilers..., yes.  We see that in the first 15 minutes.  The first 15 minutes deviate significantly from the book which makes it a little less obvious, but that little wildling girl was, in fact, dead at the camp that Will discovered.  When Will sees her again in the forest, she's an undead creature called a wight.  Martin describes magic best in the HBO specials that led up to the premier.  Magic exists, but it exists at the fringes of the story.

Edited by ja4161, 27 April 2011 - 03:00 AM.

[Bronn Stone]

Hooded Man, on 25 April 2011 - 04:19 PM, said:

Hi, I'm in the lucky situation that i can't post spoilers since I haven't read the books. The rules are a little hard to understand, but I presume we can discuss openly the first two episodes. I come here because I don't want spoilers.

As stated, I haven't read A Song of Ice and Fire or anything about the story or the show before watching it last Sunday.

I enjoyed it. There was a lot of what is called Production Value there. The emphasize was on the story, the content, not the form, the superficial. So, it's a rare thing and i hope it will be produced for many years.

Welcome indeed!  This is the sort of thing that we who know the story as GRRM wrote it sometimes overlook.  We are busy looking for the familiar and it is very difficult for us to see how it is presented on its own merit.  Please continue to share your feelings.  We need to see this from your perspective.

[Areo]

ja4161, on 27 April 2011 - 02:55 AM, said:

Is there magic or other supernatural phenomena?  Without spoilers..., yes.  We see that in the first 15 minutes.  The first 15 minutes deviate significantly from the book which makes it a little less obvious, but that little wildling girl was, in fact, dead at the camp that Will discovered.  When Will sees her again in the forest, she's an undead creature called a wight.  Martin describes magic best in the HBO specials that led up to the premier.  Magic exists, but it exists at the fringes of the story.

Kermit,

The direwolves are also fantastical beasts, which is easy to forget as they are regular pups/wolves at this point. Although GRRM confirms that there were in fact such creatures on Earth, in Game of Thrones/ASoIaF they are much bigger and as we've seen so far they are quite intelligent and have some connection with the Stark children as Jon Snow suggested in the scene where Ned Stark's party found them (after all in episode 2 we see them attack twice to protect their masters).

We've already seen the Wall in both episodes which is nowhere near realistic (and in the books it's even bigger). There are other structures/castles that are extraordinarily big which is part of the fantasy world, but I wouldn't call them magical (if that is your question).

As the story progresses there is more magic introduced, but it never gets overwhelming. But, as a fan of the genre I'd say it's enough to keep you interested in this aspect also (with the character interactions and struggles being central of course).

[Throner]

I very much liked the opening scene and was wondering if there was any significance to the tunnel, if it represented a certain passageway to the kingdom. Also, I was kind of impressed with the center rider, as he had the look of possibly a main character, and was kind of surprised to see him exited so quickly.
I have yet to see Ep. 2 but I am liking it a lot.

[Dalfiatach]

Throner, on 29 April 2011 - 07:56 PM, said:

I very much liked the opening scene and was wondering if there was any significance to the tunnel, if it represented a certain passageway to the kingdom. Also, I was kind of impressed with the center rider, as he had the look of possibly a main character, and was kind of surprised to see him exited so quickly.
I have yet to see Ep. 2 but I am liking it a lot.

Well the Wall is the very northern edge of Robert's realm, everything beyond the Wall is seen as wild uncivilised lands and the home of mythical creatures from fairytales told to children. That's why in the scene (in episode two) with Tyrion and Jon on the way to the Wall in the second episode, Tyrion was sneering at the Night's Watch defending the realm from "grumpkins and snarks and white walkers". Grumpkins and snarks are just mythical monsters, like elves and trolls in our world, and at this stage the white walkers haven't been seen in thousands of years so most people now think they are just fairytale monsters too. And why Ned didn't believe the deserter and cut off his head - would you believe someone who ran away from his sworn duty cos he claimed he saw trolls and gnomes?

So while the Starks and northmen - who originally built the Wall thousands of years ago, and have more of a memory that the reasons it were built are true - still see the Night's Watch as being a noble calling, most of the rest of the Seven Kingdoms see the Wall and the Night's Watch as a bit of joke which is why it has become something of a penal colony where criminals are given the chance to "take the Black" rather than be executed for their crimes.

In the book that guy was Ser Weymar Royce, a minor younger son of minor aristocracy who wouldn't have anything to inherit but wanted to do something useful and meaningful, which is why he joined the Night's Watch. Not everybody on the Wall is a criminal! The actor did a great job of portraying an arrogant superior young lordling alright.

PS: loved the "Fezzes are cool!" response earier in the thread. Always nice to see another Doctor Who fan :-)

Edited by Dalfiatach, 29 April 2011 - 11:10 PM.

[ja4161]

Dalfiatach, on 29 April 2011 - 11:09 PM, said:

Well the Wall is the very northern edge of Robert's realm, everything beyond the Wall is seen as wild uncivilised lands and the home of mythical creatures from fairytales told to children. That's why in the scene (in episode two) with Tyrion and Jon on the way to the Wall in the second episode, Tyrion was sneering at the Night's Watch defending the realm from "grumpkins and snarks and white walkers". Grumpkins and snarks are just mythical monsters, like elves and trolls in our world, and at this stage the white walkers haven't been seen in thousands of years so most people now think they are just fairytale monsters too. And why Ned didn't believe the deserter and cut off his head - would you believe someone who ran away from his sworn duty cos he claimed he saw trolls and gnomes?

So while the Starks and northmen - who originally built the Wall thousands of years ago, and have more of a memory that the reasons it were built are true - still see the Night's Watch as being a noble calling, most of the rest of the Seven Kingdoms see the Wall and the Night's Watch as a bit of joke which is why it has become something of a penal colony where criminals are given the chance to "take the Black" rather than be executed for their crimes.

In the book that guy was Ser Weymar Royce, a minor younger son of minor aristocracy who wouldn't have anything to inherit but wanted to do something useful and meaningful, which is why he joined the Night's Watch. Not everybody on the Wall is a criminal! The actor did a great job of portraying an arrogant superior young lordling alright.

PS: loved the "Fezzes are cool!" response earier in the thread. Always nice to see another Doctor Who fan :-)

Yeah, but Stetson's are better!  

[Jaak]

Where could the officially published part of cast be found? The official "casting" threads seem to be defunct long ago...

[Dan489]

I noticed that many of the soldiers travelling with the royal family were carrying flags with the lion sigil of the Lannisters. I know the King's sigil is the stag, and would have expected his men to be flying the sigil of his house. Do the men carrying the lion flags  belong to the King, or to their native kingdom?

[Xenophon]

Dan489, on 05 May 2011 - 11:08 PM, said:

I noticed that many of the soldiers travelling with the royal family were carrying flags with the lion sigil of the Lannisters. I know the King's sigil is the stag, and would have expected his men to be flying the sigil of his house. Do the men carrying the lion flags  belong to the King, or to their native kingdom?

I was confused by that too, and someone here pointed out that if you look at the men surrounding Robert and Ned when they have lunch in ep. 2, you'll see that those guys have stag flags.  So, it seems like Cersei travels with her own Lannister guards, as well as Robert's Baratheon troops.

BTW, the Baratheon troops also can be identified by their Norman-style teardrop shields, IIRC.

[123prism]

The varying seasons are not as unrealistic as one might think. Earth is rather unique in having one very large moon by comparison that keeps the planet on a stable axis. If a planet has no moon or multiple moons then it's much less likely to have a stable axis or tilt. It's the Earth's tilt that results in seasons. Stay tuned and you'll find out more about the moons in A Game of Thrones. Not sure if Martin really thought much about the physics of it all, but the idea is plausible. The lack of stable seasons wouldn't have anything to do with the planet's orbit around it's star. Therefore, it would still have years in the traditional sense..., ie, how many days it takes a planet to orbit it's star.

changing the tilt would change the intensity of the seasons, but they would still all happen within a year and be the same length, so no not really.  At all times half the earth is light and half the earth is dark, during summer for the northern hemisphere the light/dark plane is perpendicular to the tilt axis projected onto the plane of revolution so the northern hemisphere spends more time on the light side than the dark side, during the middle of spring/fall its still tilted the same but the light/dark plane and the tilt axis's projection onto the revolution plane are parallel so the tilt doesn't matter since even with the tilt each point on the earth spends the same amount of time in light and in dark, and then during the winter the northern hemisphere spends more time on the dark side.  All of this would still be true if you increase the tilt.  3D pictures would really help to illustrate this but I don't really feel like making some.

[Queen in the North]

Quote

changing the tilt would change the intensity of the seasons, but they would still all happen within a year and be the same length, so no not really. At all times half the earth is light and half the earth is dark, during summer for the northern hemisphere the light/dark plane is perpendicular to the tilt axis projected onto the plane of revolution so the northern hemisphere spends more time on the light side than the dark side, during the middle of spring/fall its still tilted the same but the light/dark plane and the tilt axis's projection onto the revolution plane are parallel so the tilt doesn't matter since even with the tilt each point on the earth spends the same amount of time in light and in dark, and then during the winter the northern hemisphere spends more time on the dark side. All of this would still be true if you increase the tilt. 3D pictures would really help to illustrate this but I don't really feel like making some.

What the first poster was saying was that without its large moon, Earth would wobble on its axis, causing seasons of irregular length.

[ja4161]

Queen in the North, on 10 May 2011 - 09:07 PM, said:

What the first poster was saying was that without its large moon, Earth would wobble on its axis, causing seasons of irregular length.

That's exactly what I was saying.  Source:  http://www.rocketcit...moon-love-story

[citizenmilton]

Hello ASOIAF'ers,

Newbie here. From my initial explorations, this is a great online community with lots of smart people.

So far, I'm deciding to adopt a "watch it first, read it later" approach. Keeping it that way will be very difficult.

I don't know if this is the right kind of "orientation" but, instead of specifics about the fictional world of Westeros, I'm curious about the fan community's take on a couple things.

-Of the books that have been released so far, is there a general consensus on favorites? (and if so, what would the rankings/general receptions be?)

-I know it's difficult since the ages in the tv series have been changed, but, given the approach the HBO series has adopted, could it run as a sequential series like most tv shows without major re-castings? Or, are there major jumps in times or are any of the books prequels?

Thanks!

[Kosciuszko]

citizenmilton, on 07 June 2011 - 08:20 PM, said:

Hello ASOIAF'ers,

Newbie here. From my initial explorations, this is a great online community with lots of smart people.

So far, I'm deciding to adopt a "watch it first, read it later" approach. Keeping it that way will be very difficult.

I don't know if this is the right kind of "orientation" but, instead of specifics about the fictional world of Westeros, I'm curious about the fan community's take on a couple things.

-Of the books that have been released so far, is there a general consensus on favorites? (and if so, what would the rankings/general receptions be?)

-I know it's difficult since the ages in the tv series have been changed, but, given the approach the HBO series has adopted, could it run as a sequential series like most tv shows without major re-castings? Or, are there major jumps in times or are any of the books prequels?

Thanks!

1. A Storm of Swords is generally regarded as the best book. This would be the third novel of the series. A Feast for Crows, the fourth book, is seen as the weakest. Personally, I appreciate Feast more than the first two, but meh.

2. It should be able to run as a sequential series, yes.

[Robb_]

How much time does Season 1 take place over?

The Direwolfs grew very quickly over the season, and I noticed when watching episode 3 back that it was said Benjen "would be north of the wall for a month or two".

[Ingvarr Snow]

Approx one year. Maybe some month(s) less, but not much.

Edited by Ingvarr Snow, 10 June 2011 - 11:31 AM.

[Robb_]

Thanks for the fast reply

I was expecting it to be about 3-4 months, didn't think it would be almost a year!!

[King_In_The_North]

Robb_, on 10 June 2011 - 11:34 AM, said:

Thanks for the fast reply

I was expecting it to be about 3-4 months, didn't think it would be almost a year!!

Yes. Book 1 starts at the year 298 AL (After Landing) and ends in early 299 AL.

[Lord Mord]

Kosciuszko,

Kosciuszko, on 07 June 2011 - 08:40 PM, said:

1. A Storm of Swords is generally regarded as the best book. This would be the third novel of the series. A Feast for Crows, the fourth book, is seen as the weakest. Personally, I appreciate Feast more than the first two, but meh.

Oh?  Somehow I'd got the impression Clash was generally regarded as best.  Of course, there was plenty of dissension on almost every point in that thread, but insofar as there was unity, I mean.

I think most everyone was in agreement on the least-good of the lot, though ... Except for yourself, apparently  

[Robb_]

I have a question about the books-

Why is Robb not a POV character? It doesn't really make much sense to me because he is an important character in the show right now, and so far he has had a more important part to play than most of his brothers and sisters.