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[BOOK & TV SPOILERS] What was left out and what was left in.


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#41 Elrick

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 04:07 PM

I don't think anyone here is claiming that they want everything to be identical to the books, no-one is deluded enough to think that everything will survive a change of medium. This thread, at least as i judged it and it's how i structured my first reply, is about the differences more from curiosity than trying to hold the show to account. Obviously people are going to have opinions on how well the changes work and whether something is lost or added. For me it's a mixed bag. Some changes like Sansa scene and Cersei+Catelyn add to the show and the characterisation. Others, such as the Brothel scene weaken the show and make it seem puerile rather than adult. What i liked i think i'd like despite the books and same with what i disliked.


Well one thing I liked is I got to see more character interaction that I didn't see in the books. For example the way Jaime and Cersei talked to each other in the beginning. This was good and important because you saw some but not a lot in the first book.

#42 Bastard of Godsgrace

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 04:13 PM

Just finished watching it on Polish HBO. As for discussions of "rape scene", well, based on comments here, I was expecting something decidedly more brutal and explicit. At the first moment I thought it was censored on Polish TV (such shit does happen here from time to time), but after reading more of the threads I saw it probably wasn't. Having Drogo repeat "no", without Dany saying "yes" was somewhat confusing, and after consideration I admit it did make the whole scene more like rape than in the books.

Also, am I the only one who thinks the final scene was disappointing? It was one of the most dramatic scenes in the books and here, blah. Jamie just pushes Bran and that is all. Decidedly anticlimactic.

Edited by Bastard of Godsgrace, 18 April 2011 - 04:38 PM.


#43 The Bastard King

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 04:13 PM

As far as Ned goes, I'm not sure if there are 8 or 10 episodes in this season...I doubt Ned dies in the final episode, maybe not even in the second to last, but it wouldn't be as early as 3 or 4. There's actually not all that much going on after Ned dies in the first book. A bit, enough for at least one episode and probably 2, but I don't think any more than that.

As far as the Others, I'd bet it's due to Lost. The "bad guys" in Lost were called The Others. Doesn't matter to most people if the books came out first or not, people will see it as a ripoff if they're continuously called that. I'm just speculating there but I'd bet that's a big reason why they're calling them the White Walkers.


I'm thinking Ned attempts to take control of King's Landing at the end of episode 8. He's executed in episode 9 and all of the aftermath in the last episode.

#44 ingsve

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 04:13 PM

First of all I loved the first episode, I do agree that it didnt have enough of a hook for new viewers like my dad. He found it a bit confusing. I thought they should have added more of the scene where Jon and Tyrion first meet and talk as it is one of the best scenes in the series and it portrays more of Tyrion that wasnt shown in the episode. Master Luwin wasn't wearing a masters chain too. My dad at the end said he was a little disturbed with what I'm reading which i thought was pretty funny.


Maester Luwin was wearing his chain. You can clearly see it when he brings Cat the letter from Lysa. It's not a short collar around his neck or anything like that but rather a very long chain that goes all the way down to his waist.

#45 Bronn Stone

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 04:55 PM

I thought it was good! But one thing I didn't like was the the fact the entire dothroki wedding and stuff took place beside the ocean... Which they called poison water, they hate the ocean, makes no since why they wld be by it.


In the novel, Drogo does take possession of Illyrio's manse during his wedding. that presumably DOES have a view of the sea as Pentos is a port. But in truth, it mostly had to do with them not having the budget to costume, feed and pay 40,000 Dothraki extras.

#46 Tywin's bastard

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 04:59 PM

I hear ya, not trying to pick it apart just throwing in my two cents, and I think it important because a little later in GOT drogo won't take dany across the narrow sea because of the water and it's core to the dothraki beliefs, I just thought it was off is all, just like the whole time I was wishing the direwolfs were in it more...

I didn't intend my words to be that much of a criticism towards what you said, I meant it more as a friendly warning. That they don't want to sail is a part that I hope they still have included (and I think so because Drogo changes his mind due to a pretty significant plot event) but they can still refuse to sail on the sea while still accepting to be near the shore on land.

#47 Tywin's bastard

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 05:00 PM

In the novel, Drogo does take possession of Illyrio's manse during his wedding. that presumably DOES have a view of the sea as Pentos is a port. But in truth, it mostly had to do with them not having the budget to costume, feed and pay 40,000 Dothraki extras.

Khal Drogo has his own manse in Pentos in the novel. A gift to make sure the Dothraki don't try to attack the city.

#48 Mandurang

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 06:30 PM

One of the visually thematic complaints I have is that the Dothraki, with the exception of Drogo, looked more like Picts or Woads to me than the Eurasian equestrian nomads of real-life history I had in my mind. That is not to say that Dothraki can't look like that in the world of Westeros, I just had pictured them a little bit differently. A very slight complaint and one I'm guessing most people will not pick up, but still is there.

Also, I thought the inclusion of Robert's flirting with and fondling the serving girls at the feast in Winterfell was a little jarring at first. Why Cersei, who slammed her drinking horn in his face for not apologizing to her the day after for hurting her in bed, and who got up and left the table when the king yelled at her in another occasion, would just sit there and look while Robert fooled around with a serving wench seemed completely out of character to me. Until I realized, that is, that first-time viewers do not have the luxury of being presented with the backstory and POVs like the rest of us who read the books, so I guess it kind of makes sense. You can't have everything.

The same was true for Tyrion's introductory scene. First-time viewers cannot get the story with Tysha in the detail we got it, so some sort of introduction is required. Too bad the tone it sets for Tyrion is a little off the mark, in my opinion.

However, it was a good representation of the novels. My socks were not blown off, but I reserve the right to be amazed in the future.

#49 Tywin's bastard

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 06:38 PM

One of the visually thematic complaints I have is that the Dothraki, with the exception of Drogo, looked more like Picts or Woads to me than the Eurasian equestrian nomads of real-life history I had in my mind. That is not to say that Dothraki can't look like that in the world of Westeros, I just had pictured them a little bit differently. A very slight complaint and one I'm guessing most people will not pick up, but still is there.

I'm far from an expert of the Eurasian nomads but did that really include copper-skinned people? That's the skin color the Dothraki were said to have and I always took them as being inspired both by the Mongols and the North American Indians.

#50 Mandurang

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 06:58 PM

I'm far from an expert of the Eurasian nomads but did that really include copper-skinned people? That's the skin color the Dothraki were said to have and I always took them as being inspired both by the Mongols and the North American Indians.

I'm far from an expert myself, but the prevalent theory is that the two phyla are related since the Americas were first settled by humans from Asia crossing the Bering land bridge. And I believe, that certain Mongol or Turkic tribes did indeed exhibit such traits as the skin color Dothraki are said to have.

#51 Snow White

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:04 PM

It was mentioned that it was a whorehouse when Jaime came in. Something along the lines of "do you not know what a closed door in a brothel means?". I agree it didn't come across well and really did nothing more than establish his proclivities with none of the motivation or self-loathing that goes along with it. It's a really poor scene and i don't get why it was added let alone when.


Yes, it is mentioned but just that once. And Jaimie brings additional girls into the whorehouse? And Winterfell has a whorehouse? That really doesn't look like a whorehouse?

I've got a suspicion this was a last minute (or at least very late) addition.

Another small complaint was the Wheelhouse. It looks like a gaudy coach-and-four. I know they have a budget, and it's really not important, but I had heard rumors of some kind of large contraption that made me think it was going to be more impressive.

Edited by Snow White, 18 April 2011 - 07:05 PM.


#52 Skittles

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:14 PM

I'm thinking Ned attempts to take control of King's Landing at the end of episode 8. He's executed in episode 9 and all of the aftermath in the last episode.


Perhaps I'm misinformed...but I thought Sean Bean was only going to be in two episodes. We saw one so... either the information I heard is absurdly off, or the show makers are going to have to be very, very creative?

#53 Mandurang

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:18 PM

Perhaps I'm misinformed...but I thought Sean Bean was only going to be in two episodes. We saw one so... either the information I heard is absurdly off, or the show makers are going to have to be very, very creative?

I really don't see that happening. Probably your information is way off.

#54 依法 Yīfǎ

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:21 PM

Absurdly off, I believe. If you got that from IMDb, I really wouldn't rely on it. If nothing else, we know he's in the next episode based on previews, and he virtually has to be in at least one towards the end of the series, so....

Just thinking here about Ned:
Spoiler

Definitely more than 2, and probably the bulk of the episodes this season. I'd be surprised if there were many at all without him.

#55 Skittles

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:24 PM

Actually, I read it somewhere on this forum... but even when I read it, it seemed like it would be too hard to accomplish.

#56 Eponine

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:48 PM

Another small complaint was the Wheelhouse. It looks like a gaudy coach-and-four. I know they have a budget, and it's really not important, but I had heard rumors of some kind of large contraption that made me think it was going to be more impressive.

In the book, the wheelhouse is double-decked and pulled by forty draft horses. Probably could have been more impressive, but I think that following the literal description would have made the thing look ridiculous.

#57 Snow White

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 08:35 PM

In the book, the wheelhouse is double-decked and pulled by forty draft horses. Probably could have been more impressive, but I think that following the literal description would have made the thing look ridiculous.


No doubt. I wasn't expecting it to match the book exactly. I just figured something a bit more impressive than a coach. Still, if they're going to make budget that's the sort of thing I'm fine with them dialing down.

#58 CryFenril

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 09:02 PM

As enthusiastic as I am about the show so far, I was very disappointed in the Dothraki. No rings in the drooping moustachios (hardly any mustaches at all, comparatively speaking!), more like a hodge-podge of barbaric peoples than a single consolidated group. I, too, envisioned them much like Mongols or Huns, not like the remains of a diaspora.

#59 Trebla

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 09:19 PM

And no tinkly boys! That's gonna take away one of Strong Belwas' iconic lines!

#60 dylan

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 09:25 PM

Maester Luwin was wearing his chain. You can clearly see it when he brings Cat the letter from Lysa. It's not a short collar around his neck or anything like that but rather a very long chain that goes all the way down to his waist.

Oh i didnt notice that. I wonder why they made his chain so long instead. To me the fact that the masters had the size of chains they did showed me something about them. For example now are they going to have master pyrcell( check spelling) chain even longer or the same size