The Wise Man's Fear V [Spoilers and speculation within]

[Merihathor]

Ive read through the previous threads as they were written and don't remember if a couple things were brought up. I recently reread Herbert's Dune and noticed the word "ruh". It referred to the metaphysical side of Paul.

The second had to do with the pronunciation of Ademre and Edema Ruh. I'm thinking they are actually quite similar in pronunciation and have diverged in spelling similar to the way Loeclos and Lackless did. It would make sense if he borrowed yet another plot device from WoT and the Adem and Edema Ruh are descended from the same stock similar to the Tinkers and the Aiel.

Yeah, I personally think that they're probably descended from the Ruach. "Ruh" is spirit/wind in Arabic, and "Ruach" can mean the Spirit of God, intellect or wind, in Hebrew (Arabic and Hebrew are both Semitic languages, so thus the similarity). "Adem" is "Adam" in Arabic, incidentally. "Adam" in Hebrew (biblical, at least) means "man/earth/red" (from the word "adamah").

[Merihathor]

Some thoughts on the mirror painted on the vase at Haliax's feet:

Mirrors have a long history in the world, starting from polished pieces of obsidian (volcanic glass), then to metals like copper, bronze, tin/mercury and now as silvered glass (originally silver was used, but now aluminum compounds have replaced silver, as silver tarnishes). A certain people in India have a secret method to create mirrors out of an alloy, thought to be tin and copper, called the aranmula kannadi.

Several myths surround mirrors. In Chinese myth, "...at the beginning of time there were two kinds of people. These people were constantly at war, fighting each other forever in never-ending battles. The enjoyment of life had reached zero-point and a wizard (these existed at the time) decided to cast a spell: he banned the most gruesome people to the reflecting inside of the mirror; they were doomed to imitate physical appearance, movement and facial expression to the end of time.

At last there was peace and man lived in prosperity as he admired himself in the reflecting surface of the mirror. Spellbound by narcissistic urges, he soon forgot about the mirror people, trapped behind the silver coating. Yet, a wizard's spell, as powerful as it may strike, never lasts forever: it gradually loosens and frays at the edges at a vexingly slow rate. The mirror people find their revenge in deception." (Source)

Some superstitions:

• 
  
• A broken mirror leads to seven years of bad luck, as the mirror is thought to capture the soul, which takes seven years to grow back. Some remedies to prevent the broken soul from reflecting through the pieces: tapping the mirror pieces to a gravestone or grinding the pieces into powder and then burying the powder.
  
• A Buddhist belief: hanging a round mirror in front of triangular doors will prevent evil spirits from entering.
  
• It's bad luck to have two mirrors facing each other
  
• It's also bad luck to leave a mirror uncovered during a wake, as they capture souls and even reflect the deceased's face
  
• Vampires do not show in mirrors, as they've already lost their souls
  

Mirrors are also seen as sources of knowledge (scrying), deception (as in "smoke and mirrors"), protection, self-knowledge, and as doorways to another reality (i.e. Alice and the Looking Glass, and peat bogs).

Chirality is a term used in sciences like physics and chemistry, means that two items/molecules might look/seem the same, but they are not super-imposable reflections of each other.

All of these make me think that the mirror is an apt symbol for Haliax: he is Iax's chiral counterpart. Perhaps a mirror was used to banish Iax, as well.

[Thaykora]

I have two quick questions that might be easier to ask here.

1.) Has Rothfuss ever cited any works that were inspirational to his writing career, or his style?

2.) Are there any books that might have been a source behind specific elements in Rothfuss' world or story?

I doubt there's any official information for the latter, but I'd like to know any ideas that people may have. As an example, I know there's a book that shares a similar magic system to PR's.

Just the title, or a few thoughts, is enough. If I read it, I don't wanna know too much.

[TheValyrianDragonlord]

I have two quick questions that might be easier to ask here.

1.) Has Rothfuss ever cited any works that were inspirational to his writing career, or his style?

2.) Are there any books that might have been a source behind specific elements in Rothfuss' world or story? I doubt there's any official information, but I'd like to know any ideas that people may have. (For example, there's a book that shares a similar 'real physics' magic system.)

Just the title is enough. I may read it, so details may spoil my fun.

Cyranno De Bergerac and Casanova's memoirs. It's from one of his q&as . Hope this helps.

How did you create him?

I got the idea for Kvothe after I finished reading Cyranno De Bergerac for the first time. I was completely knocked over by that character. He was passionate, arrogant, witty, clever, a fighter, a poet, a philosopher. He was compelling and interesting, and a bit of a bastard, but you loved him and felt sorry for him. I remember thinking, "Why haven't I ever read a fantasy novel with a character this good?"

Shortly after that I read Casanova's memoirs. That's when I realized that autobiography could be really compelling so long as the person's life is exciting, and their personality is interesting.

Those two things might not have been the seed for the book, they were certainly around when the seed was sprouting....

[RobMRobM]

I just finished WMF and immediately have begun a re-read of Name of the Wind. Really fun works. Looking forward to diving into spoilers et all. I've already gone into Jo Walton's posts on Tor.com

Rob

[thistlepong]

Chronicles and Cobblestones: Part II

I’ve Got a Feelin’ – Painful Memories

The following quotes, in order, made me wonder just how bad things where.

“To the King?” Aaron Said.

“No,” the innkeeper said, his voice surprisingly firm. He held up his glass. “To old friends who deserved better than they got.”

-WMF hc p.141 (kl2935)

That night, and for many to come, Wil and Sim took turns watching over me as I slept, keeping me safe with their Alar. They were the best sort of friends. The sort everyone hopes for but no one deserves, least of all me.

-WMF hc p. 198 (kl4128)

I saw Fela turn her head to look at Simmon, almost as if she were surprised to see him sitting there.

No, it was almost as if up until that point, he’d just been occupying space around her, like a piece of furniture. But this time when she looked at him, she took all of him in. His sandy hair, the line of his jaw, the span of his shoulders beneath his shirt. This time when she looked, she actually

saw

him.

Let me say this. It was worth the the whole awful, irritating time spent searching the Archives just to watch that moment happen. It was worth the blood and the fear of death to see her fall in love with him. Just a little. Just the first faint breath of love, so light she probably didn’t notice it herself. It wasn’t dramatic, like some bolt of lightning with a crack of thunder following. It was more like when flint strikes steel and the spark fades almost too fast for you to see. But still, you know it’s there, down where you can’t see, kindling.

-WMF hc p. 225 (kl4665)

It read like three strokes paring the range of possibilities down to a single individual. Maybe everyone he’s ever known is dead. Maybe he feels responsible for many lives. But there’s a special sorrow for one in particular.

Rothfuss has said, “That’s my job as an author. It’s to sometimes break your heart. Joss Whedon knows this.” It appears in print and was repeated at the signing I attended. You can hear it for yourself in Sword and Laser Podcast #54 (@28:45.)

Understanding what he means, of course, depends on familiarity with Whedon’s work. The emotional stakes are always high, but rarely manipulative. The worst kind of tragedy in the story thus far is the fatal end to a perfect friendship. Paired, they pound at you.

[Banjo Fiend]

Yeah, I personally think that they're probably descended from the Ruach. "Ruh" is spirit/wind in Arabic, and "Ruach" can mean the Spirit of God, intellect or wind, in Hebrew (Arabic and Hebrew are both Semitic languages, so thus the similarity). "Adem" is "Adam" in Arabic, incidentally. "Adam" in Hebrew (biblical, at least) means "man/earth/red" (from the word "adamah").

They probably are descended from the Ruach but so are all the other peoples. I thinking more along the lines of the Modegans are descended from one of the original cities, the Caeldish another, and so on, and the Edema Ruh were originally from the same original city as the people who settled Ademre. Rothfuss made quite a point of explaining all the variations of Loeclos, Lackless, Lockless, etc. I think it was a hint towards the similarites/divergence of the Ruh/Adem.

[Spaßvogel]

On the Chandrian business:

The fact that their purpose is somehow linked with the moon is obvious, so I won't bother putting all the quotes showing that, unless anyone needs convincing.

When I read the part about the drawings of the pot and the presence of the phases of the moon, it made me go back and re-read appearances by Denna and/or Bredon to see if there was detail in the flavor text about what phase the moon was in. There are several, but I didn't discern any pattern on my quick skim through. Might be easier with an electronic version of the book.

[unJon]

@Thistle, two ways to take your first quote. The King is someone Kvothe won't drink to or the king is an old friend of Kvothe's that deserved better than he got. Hmmmm....

[thistlepong]

@Thistle, two ways to take your first quote. The King is someone Kvothe won't drink to or the king is an old friend of Kvothe's that deserved better than he got. Hmmmm....

The former seems more likely. He's not a fan of the war, and he doesn't want to see anyone die for it. I'm still pretty sure the frame takes place in Vintas. IIRC Basil's the only Vintish student he's on friendly terms with. He'd be a surprising hat rabbit of a king. The court folks - Alveron, Stapes, and Bredon - aren't really friends.

Do you have someone in mind?

[Gaston de Foix]

I'm still pretty sure the frame takes place in Vintas

Do you have someone in mind?

So am I. Bast's room is full of rings of grass and horn, i.e. lovers rings and rings of enmity.

I think the crucial detail you are all missing is Kvothe has stolen princesses back from sleeping barrow kings. I think if we find the princess we will find the King.

[thistlepong]

So am I. Bast's room is full of rings of grass and horn, i.e. lovers rings and rings of enmity.

I think the crucial detail you are all missing is Kvothe has stolen princesses back from sleeping barrow kings. I think if we find the princess we will find the King.

That might be "The Road to Levinshir." And I'm sliding more and more toward the "Heart's Desire" story being about the Archives. At any rate, I won't be disappointed if they are.

"The truth about Princess Ariel" is still a mystery, though, so you're likely right.

[unJon]

@Thistle, I do not (unless Sim is someone in disguise . . . other than Manet). It's just the kind of line that has the flavor of foreshadowing. When the final book comes out and we do a re-read we might say: Wow PR layed thefoundation for this one subtly.

[Gaston de Foix]

That might be "The Road to Levinshir." And I'm sliding more and more toward the "Heart's Desire" story being about the Archives. At any rate, I won't be disappointed if they are.

"The truth about Princess Ariel" is still a mystery, though, so you're likely right.

Yep. Princess Ariel is King Roderic's daughter. You heard it here first. I had a long post about this but I can never get it finished. Suffice it to say Renere is near where the sleeping barrow kings are. We will see the capital of Vint.

[thistlepong]

Yep. Princess Ariel is King Roderic's daughter. You heard it here first. I had a long post about this but I can never get it finished. Suffice it to say Renere is near where the sleeping barrow kings are. We will see the capital of Vint.

You really must elaborate on that. Break the argument into bits if you have to.

[Kettricken]

I am again reminded of Fela's dream about the 4 plate door..."Valaritas" was the name of an old dead king, his tomb was on the other side of the door - Barrow King, right?

And Auri (princess Ariel) is also on the other side, sort of, in the Underthing...

People's thoughts about Kvothe killing a poet who is also a king aren't taking into account his ability to kill large #'s of people (aka the tax bandits, the fake Ruh). I'm thinking high body count in the next book again.

Also, the shattered cobblestones in Imre "by the fountain"; this was also where he called the wind on Ambrose in TNotW. Return to the scene, perhaps?

[chrispin]

I'm still pretty sure the frame takes place in Vintas.

Is there other support besides the coins that indicates the frame takes place in Vintas?

Newarre is 2 miles from an Oldstone bridge (NotW Ch1). The other Oldstone bridge we know of is on the Great Stone Road at Imre. Newarre is likely on the Great Stone Road, which doesn't go through Vintas. The king who is recruiting could be the king of Vintas and is paying in Vintish coin, but the closest section of the Great Stone Road to Vintas goes through Modeg north of Tinue. The war may have expanded the Vintas lands so Newarre is now in Vintas, but on our map the country would be labeled something else.

My theory is that Newarre is by the University and the two bridges are the same. It fits with Kote saying "They can't have made it this far west yet," and "I'd thought the mountains..." about the scrael. He speaks as if Newarre is far west of the mountains.

[peterbound]

Yep. Princess Ariel is King Roderic's daughter. You heard it here first. I had a long post about this but I can never get it finished. Suffice it to say Renere is near where the sleeping barrow kings are. We will see the capital of Vint.

Really? I thought she was King Titon's Daughter. How the fuck have I been wrong all these years!?!?! Damn you Disney for lying to me!

[AverageGuy]

My theory is that Newarre is by the University

The University and Imre are in the Commonwealth, no? Does the Commonwealth even have a king?

[thistlepong]

The University and Imre are in the Commonwealth, no? Does the Commonwealth even have a king?

No. It's a Commonwealth. The governing body's located in Tarbean, but there's no king.