100 replies to this topic

[unJon]

Why is Pat referring to himself in the third person?

[Renasko]

Not expecting much from this book, at all. More sex. Kvothe is awesome. Woo.

We may get an actual epic fantasy trilogy the second time 'round.

[kaythetall]

The only prediction I'll make offhand is that Kvothe/Kote will be tested with music and pass. Maybe it will be enough to restore him. The arguments that he's changed his Name are convincing.

Besides his memory, Kvothe has essentially three talents: music, his Alar, and physical dexterity.

There's the recurring statement 'third time pays for all'.

In NotW, Kvothe was challenged by a demon, tried to use his Alar, and failed.

In tWMF, he was challenged to a physical confrontation, and failed.

In DoS, he'll be challenged with music, and pass.

Whether it will literally be some sort of dueling-banjo challenge, or more likely have a lute put in his hands somehow, I don't know. I missed the observations made by others that Kvothe's left hand was crippled, but agree that's clearly happened. It probably goes along with an inner emotional pain of some sort. Whether it is healed, or he learns to play drums or something I don't know.

It does make sense to me that the Chronicler being a Namer, with the entirety of Kvothe's story in front of him (combined with a live musical performance, perhaps) will Know Kvothe well enough to change his Name back (that's a lot of capitals, apologies). A lot of the things said in jest turn out to be true, and the Adem idea of burning words for power makes sense. The whole manuscript goes up in flames, consumed in the re-Naming.

It would restore Kvothe's Alar, let him open the thrice-locked chest where I assume Caesura, his shaed and lute are. He hits the road and and a tree falls on him and kills him.

Edited by kaythetall, 27 May 2011 - 12:12 PM.

[kaythetall]

Oh, and Denna will kill herself.

She said something to the effect of 'I run away, you see. One moment I'm just gone.' in a really sad and forlorn way talking about herself.

I think Kvothe will accuse her of being a whore, she'll freak out and poison herself. He'll find out later that she was a secret agent for the Amyr, and everything she did was on their behalf. BOOM. Tragedy. Done.

Edited by kaythetall, 27 May 2011 - 12:14 PM.

[Spaceman Hobbes]

kaythetall, on 27 May 2011 - 11:51 AM, said:

It does make sense to me that the Chronicler being a Namer, with the entirety of Kvothe's story in front of him (combined with a live musical performance, perhaps) will Know Kvothe well enough to change his Name back (that's a lot of capitals, apologies). A lot of the things said in jest turn out to be true, and the Adem idea of burning words for power makes sense. The whole manuscript goes up in flames, consumed in the re-Naming.

Thats's.....goddamn. That's brilliant. I always thought there was more to Chronicler than being just a story teller. Maybe Skarpi sent him to change Kvothe's name?

[Kzad-bhat]

Dune, on 27 May 2011 - 03:02 PM, said:

Thats's.....goddamn. That's brilliant. I always thought there was more to Chronicler than being just a story teller. Maybe Skarpi sent him to change Kvothe's name?

Chronicler knows the name for iron at least... He probably has interest in getting Kvothe back to being Kvothe and not just his story... maybe he's Elodin in disguise! He would have been at the University earlier (and able to write his dragon book) and heard the stories of Kvothe. I'm sure he's talented enough to disguise himself, especially to Kote and Bast likely has no idea what he looks like.

[pat5150]

kaythetall, on 27 May 2011 - 12:02 PM, said:

Oh, and Denna will kill herself.

If that happens, I just might do a little jig to celebrate!!!

Patrick

[kaythetall]

Dune, on 27 May 2011 - 03:02 PM, said:

Thats's.....goddamn. That's brilliant. I always thought there was more to Chronicler than being just a story teller. Maybe Skarpi sent him to change Kvothe's name?

That's very kind, thanks.

I'd be surprised (if it does happen) that it will be planned, frankly. Chronicler wasn't a great Namer at the University, and hiding a high degree of control at Naming as part of a long con doesn't seem likely. Naming seems to be something that is very ephemeral and hard to control, at least since the age of Shapers.

I imagine it as more of a spontaneous HOLY SHIT I SEE YOU.

Edited by kaythetall, 27 May 2011 - 09:50 PM.

[Zizoz]

Chronicler is Manet.

[Kylar Stern]

It will be interesting to see when Kvothe meets Skarpi.

One from NotW that bugged me was the fact Skarpi knew Kvothe's name without being told.  He was pinned by the priests and said to Kvothe (without looking at him), get out.

There's got to be more to come from him.

[Gaston de Foix]

kaythetall, on 27 May 2011 - 11:51 AM, said:

The only prediction I'll make offhand is that Kvothe/Kote will be tested with music and pass. Maybe it will be enough to restore him. The arguments that he's changed his Name are convincing.

Besides his memory, Kvothe has essentially three talents: music, his Alar, and physical dexterity.

There's the recurring statement 'third time pays for all'.

In NotW, Kvothe was challenged by a demon, tried to use his Alar, and failed.

In tWMF, he was challenged to a physical confrontation, and failed.

In DoS, he'll be challenged with music, and pass.

Whether it will literally be some sort of dueling-banjo challenge, or more likely have a lute put in his hands somehow, I don't know. I missed the observations made by others that Kvothe's left hand was crippled, but agree that's clearly happened. It probably goes along with an inner emotional pain of some sort. Whether it is healed, or he learns to play drums or something I don't know.

It does make sense to me that the Chronicler being a Namer, with the entirety of Kvothe's story in front of him (combined with a live musical performance, perhaps) will Know Kvothe well enough to change his Name back (that's a lot of capitals, apologies). A lot of the things said in jest turn out to be true, and the Adem idea of burning words for power makes sense. The whole manuscript goes up in flames, consumed in the re-Naming.

It would restore Kvothe's Alar, let him open the thrice-locked chest where I assume Caesura, his shaed and lute are. He hits the road and and a tree falls on him and kills him.

I agree in general terms that Kvothe won't be whole until he gets his chance to get his music back, that his music is the most important part of him and this resolution has to happen in Book 3.

I have two specific reservations with your theory otherwise. Chronicler has already admitted the extent of his Naming Power is the Name of Iron. Grasping Kvothe's true name, well let's just say that it's hard to foresee his Naming abilities extending that far.

The Adem notion of burning words for power is specifically disparaged as not even worthy of consideration in WMF and is generally presented as descriptive of a huge cultural gulf between the Adem and pretty much the rest of the Four Corners.

[Spaceman Hobbes]

Gaston de Foix, on 01 June 2011 - 03:40 AM, said:

I have two specific reservations with your theory otherwise. Chronicler has already admitted the extent of his Naming Power is the Name of Iron. Grasping Kvothe's true name, well let's just say that it's hard to foresee his Naming abilities extending that far.

And he can't be lying why? If Chronicler is part of some greater plot(he's associated with Skarpi after all, who most definitely is more than an old story teller), why would he tell Kvothe the full extent of his power? C could be anything from what he says he is, to the leader of the Amyr, we really don't know. All we know about him is that his name is Devan and he wrote a nice little book about dragons.

[Gaston de Foix]

Dune, on 01 June 2011 - 03:19 PM, said:

And he can't be lying why? If Chronicler is part of some greater plot(he's associated with Skarpi after all, who most definitely is more than an old story teller), why would he tell Kvothe the full extent of his power? C could be anything from what he says he is, to the leader of the Amyr, we really don't know. All we know about him is that his name is Devan and he wrote a nice little book about dragons.

well if he's lying about everything else, I think he might well be lying about his name being Devan or being Chronicler. If you remember his reaction to Bast's prank, that's not really behaviour I would expect from the Amyr.

I think Chronicler succeeds as a very important bridge between Bast and Kvothe despite his very human limitations.

[Spaceman Hobbes]

Gaston de Foix, on 01 June 2011 - 04:45 PM, said:

well if he's lying about everything else, I think he might well be lying about his name being Devan or being Chronicler. If you remember his reaction to Bast's prank, that's not really behaviour I would expect from the Amyr.

I think Chronicler succeeds as a very important bridge between Bast and Kvothe despite his very human limitations.

I'm saying that he could be lying, not that he necessarily is. There is a vast difference between 'could lie about anything', and 'definitely lying about everything'. We're talking about a book where the protagonist is chasing 7 people wildly regarded to be a myth, and his only potential source of aid was allegedly destroyed 300 years before. But it's completely outside the realm of possibility that a central character could have a hidden agenda and/or might have lied about the full extent of his abilities?

[dcon]

Dune, on 01 June 2011 - 06:48 PM, said:

I'm saying that he could be lying, not that he necessarily is. There is a vast difference between 'could lie about anything', and 'definitely lying about everything'. We're talking about a book where the protagonist is chasing 7 people wildly regarded to be a myth, and his only potential source of aid was allegedly destroyed 300 years before. But it's completely outside the realm of possibility that a central character could have a hidden agenda and/or might have lied about the full extent of his abilities?

Sidetrack, I'm drawing a blank on this

[Spaceman Hobbes]

dcon, on 01 June 2011 - 07:49 PM, said:

Sidetrack, I'm drawing a blank on this

The Amyr were supposedly wiped out 300 ago. In all likelyhood they just went underground, but it's not like they're readily available to help Kvothe.

[dcon]

Dune, on 01 June 2011 - 08:29 PM, said:

The Amyr were supposedly wiped out 300 ago. In all likelyhood they just went underground, but it's not like they're readily available to help Kvothe.

Thanks, couldn't remember

[unJon]

Guys, remember we get a Chronicler PoV.  Need to filter any Chronicler lies / hidden powers through the fact that we had some pages from his perspective.

[Yallow]

unJon, on 01 June 2011 - 09:22 PM, said:

Guys, remember we get a Chronicler PoV.  Need to filter any Chronicler lies / hidden powers through the fact that we had some pages from his perspective.

Aren't all the pages in the books from his perspective, since he is the one writing the story

[kaythetall]

Gaston de Foix, on 01 June 2011 - 03:40 AM, said:

I agree in general terms that Kvothe won't be whole until he gets his chance to get his music back, that his music is the most important part of him and this resolution has to happen in Book 3.

I have two specific reservations with your theory otherwise. Chronicler has already admitted the extent of his Naming Power is the Name of Iron. Grasping Kvothe's true name, well let's just say that it's hard to foresee his Naming abilities extending that far.

The Adem notion of burning words for power is specifically disparaged as not even worthy of consideration in WMF and is generally presented as descriptive of a huge cultural gulf between the Adem and pretty much the rest of the Four Corners.

I'm not really disagreeing with you. Chronicler's Naming is only iron, but the way Naming of individuals is presented it's so rare an occurrence that it takes an extraordinary set of circumstances to occur. Whether it will/would be enough, it's entirely conjecture.

And you're absolutely right about the Adem story. It's treated with contempt. But seriously, every time a character espouses a 'silly' story, it turns out to have some underlying serious truth to it. The 'fable' of the existence of the Chandrian, the  'fable' of Iax chasing the moon, the children's rhyme about Lady Lackless.

I'm not saying that the Adem will literally burn their words, but that an ongoing theme is silly things having a serious reality to them, and the idea of 'burning words' when there's a big paper stack of them at the end of this story, well that's just asking for a burning.

Plus, it doesn't really seem like Rothfuss would like the idea of Kvothe's literal story being out there for his peers to read. Better that only the myth and rumour would survive. As a dramatist, of course. Clearly Kvothe disagrees, since he's telling the story.