[ADWD SPOILERS] Reek 1

[Malcatraz]

Guys! F Theon! He had this coming, and then some. No sympathy here.

[Lord Qorgyle]

Guys! F Theon! He had this coming, and then some. No sympathy here.

:agree: The fact that Reek is suffering should inspire pity or compassion at most (I'd say nobody deserves to go through this hell he's in), but never sympathy. It's not like he was innocent and has been caught by a psycho. He would never had had to endure torture if he hadn't decided to betray the Starks and take Winterfell by the force or arms.

[JD44Irish]

Isn't that "Whorebane" Umber, one of the Greatjon's uncles?

I supposed one of these could be an Umber, but would they both go to the Dredfort? Wouldn't that leave the last Hearth completely undefended?

One of the Umbers has a glass eye, thats Crowsfood, I think he's the one that wanted to marry Lady Hornwood. I don't recall Theon describing the man as having one eye or a glass eye.

As for the Bear pelt... who are the bears... thats house Mormont isn't it? Is there any chance this is what happened to Jorah Mormont? Jorah Mormont was in exile in Essos and spying to find a way back. Once he was banished by Dany, where else does he have to go but back home? Winterfell is gone, Ned Stark, the man who banished him is gone and Lord Bolton rules the North. His family is in shambles and looking for heirs... I think theres a good chance one of these men was Jorah Mormont.

Just a guess, I'll have to re-read Reeks chapter.

[malarky1231]

I'm pretty sure it's Arnolf Karstark as the twisted man and Whoresbane Umbar with the bear coat

[Windchaser]

Ugh, I'd feel absolutely horrid if one of those two men was Jorah. He seemed so...sorry and heartbroken when Dany found out and banished him, it would seem wrong for him to be back in Westeros and plotting with some other lordling just like that.

I did feel sorry for Theon. (I also had a meal rather spoiled by this chapter's disgusting content.) While I hated what he did, no one deserves that kind of treatment. (Well, no one I can think of right off the bat. :P) Boltons be scary people, I'd much rather have them as allies than enemies.

(Which might be why Tywin made himself all buddy-buddy with them.)

[JD44Irish]

I re-read it... if its Jorah, he's in a good disguise. I think one could be Whoresbane but I don't think its Crowfood, again b/c of the eye. Maybe it is a Karstark and Reek doesn't know starburst from sunburst?

[wolverine]

As for the Bear pelt... who are the bears... thats house Mormont isn't it? Is there any chance this is what happened to Jorah Mormont? Jorah Mormont was in exile in Essos and spying to find a way back. Once he was banished by Dany, where else does he have to go but back home? Winterfell is gone, Ned Stark, the man who banished him is gone and Lord Bolton rules the North. His family is in shambles and looking for heirs... I think theres a good chance one of these men was Jorah Mormont.

Just a guess, I'll have to re-read Reeks chapter.

I think there is almost no way that one of them is Jorah. Aren't both of them described as being rather lean/skinny and kind of decrepit old men? Jorah was balding but he was always described as rather robust. The bear skin did make me think of Mormont's and Bear Island. Aren't there any other Mormont's it could be?

[JD44Irish]

I think there is almost no way that one of them is Jorah. Aren't both of them described as being rather lean/skinny and kind of decrepit old men? Jorah was balding but he was always described as rather robust. The bear skin did make me think of Mormont's and Bear Island. Aren't there any other Mormont's it could be?

Yeah I have re-thought the Jorah idea. Maybe it is Arnolf Karstark, I'm convinced one is Whoresbane and that the other is not.

He doesn't fit the description of a Manderly or any of the other houses either. Karstark and Whorsebane are the best bets given the descriptions and the "starburst" which is probably a Sunburst.

Is it possible that Bolton does not know that Karstark has gone over to Stannis and Arnolf is a spy? Or is Karstark playing both sides? I have a feeling the Reek/Theon chapters will need to be read very carefully to figure out the mystery GRRM likes to hide all over his stories.

[iheartseverus]

I'm convinced one is Whoresbane and that the other is not.

Good thing. It'd be really weird if they both were...:lol:

[malarky1231]

Yeah I have re-thought the Jorah idea. Maybe it is Arnolf Karstark, I'm convinced one is Whoresbane and that the other is not.

He doesn't fit the description of a Manderly or any of the other houses either. Karstark and Whorsebane are the best bets given the descriptions and the "starburst" which is probably a Sunburst.

Is it possible that Bolton does not know that Karstark has gone over to Stannis and Arnolf is a spy? Or is Karstark playing both sides? I have a feeling the Reek/Theon chapters will need to be read very carefully to figure out the mystery GRRM likes to hide all over his stories.

Keep on reading. It gets more complicated than that.

[JD44Irish]

Keep on reading. It gets more complicated than that.

I got a hint from an upcoming Jon chapter where he speaks w/ Stannis, but political alliances aren't anything if not difficult.

[JD44Irish]

Good thing. It'd be really weird if they both were...:lol:

Ha ha ha... its probably good for the whores too!

I meant to say one is an Umber and one probably not.. I gotta get more specific with this stuff!

[TehipiteTom]

If this is the comeuppance that Theon gets for messing with the Starks, then I can only imagine what cosmic punishment the Freys will get for the Red Wedding.

From your lips to the Seven's ears...

[witless chum]

If this is the comeuppance that Theon gets for messing with the Starks, then I can only imagine what cosmic punishment the Freys will get for the Red Wedding.

Once the old man dies, they're going to tear themselves apart and the house will end up extinguished for lack of a male heir when Big Walder and Little Walder are the only two left and they kill each other.

[Mjolnir]

Independent of whether or not either of the two visiting lords looks like Jorah -- which I don't think either does -- even though Dany's plot thread in ASoS takes place chronologically fairly early I imagine Jorah would've had trouble getting back all the way across Essos and to the North in time for this scene. He'd've had to be moving pretty quickly and with purpose. I don't think it can possibly be him.

GRRM has a great power to make me not comfortable but at least happy to be inside the heads of people I despise. There are not a lot of major characters left in this series that I straight up think are dipshits but Theon is on that short list. And yet, while we're actually in his head here I'm totally with him; I'm on his side. It's incredibly immersive, all the more so for being gross. Then again, my feeling for Theon is largely born out of him being very much in the powerless position here, and my opinion of Ramsay Bolton, which is not high.

Even so, props. I know this is the story that turned a man who tried to kill a kid by throwing him out a window into one of its most fascinating and sympathetic figures and I should stop being surprised, but the story's ability to inhabit a character so completely that the world as they see it makes total sense -- with appropriate adjustment for the more blatantly batshit castmembers -- never ceases to amaze me. We're talking here about a dude who killed two kids in A Clash of Kings because it made his job easier; in the abstract sense he can fuck right off. But when we're actually presented with him getting -- not what's coming to him because noone deserves the Boltons, but getting paid for what he did, I'm totally there with him. Justice. Never easy in Westeros.

[Vavavoom]

When I saw the chapter heading, I thought "what! Now he's making Reek a POV character?!" and when I found out this Reek was Theon... oh man. I felt sick! Although he messed up big time and was traitor to Robb, he didn't deserved this! Theon's story has gotta be the most tragic in this series.

[Myrddin]

When reading this chapter, I wondered if I had picked up an Abercrombie book by accident. A prequel for Gloka (sp?) or something.

Yeah, I was never a Theon fan, but I wouldn't wish Reek's fate on anyone.

[Lady Snark]

When I saw the chapter heading, I thought "what! Now he's making Reek a POV character?!" and when I found out this Reek was Theon... oh man. I felt sick! Although he messed up big time and was traitor to Robb, he didn't deserved this! Theon's story has gotta be the most tragic in this series.

Same here. When I finally realized Reek is Theon, I actually felt for the guy.

I have been on an emotional roller coaster with Theon. I felt bad for him when he returned to the Iron Isles and he was treated like crap by his father and everyone else. I was hoping he would wise up and go back to being loyal to Robb and realizing that the Starks were good to him, even if they weren't his real family. Then I hated him when I thought he killed Bran and Rickon. When I found out they were still alive, I didn't hate him, but still disliked him since I think he would have killed them if he found them.

I would have been satisfied with Theon getting beheaded, hanged or other relatively quick death. I never thought he deserved what Bolton is doing to him. The only person right now that I think deserves the "reek treatment" would be old man Frey. That old bastard better not die of old age, he needs to suffer. :angry2:

[Tammy]

Same here. When I finally realized Reek is Theon, I actually felt for the guy.

I have been on an emotional roller coaster with Theon. I felt bad for him when he returned to the Iron Isles and he was treated like crap by his father and everyone else. I was hoping he would wise up and go back to being loyal to Robb and realizing that the Starks were good to him, even if they weren't his real family. Then I hated him when I thought he killed Bran and Rickon. When I found out they were still alive, I didn't hate him, but still disliked him since I think he would have killed them if he found them.

I would have been satisfied with Theon getting beheaded, hanged or other relatively quick death. I never thought he deserved what Bolton is doing to him. The only person right now that I think deserves the "reek treatment" would be old man Frey. That old bastard better not die of old age, he needs to suffer. :angry2:

I agree. Even though he did what he did, I couldn't actually bring myself to "hate" Theon. Not that he was good or anything, but I always got the sense that there was a part of him that hated what he was doing while he was doing it. He kept wondering to himself how he ended up where he was when he was on the path to helping Robb secure the north.

This well, he doesn't deserve this. I hope one day he's able to get vengeance on the Boltons for it, but I don't want to read about it when he does. And I hate that that monster shares a last name with Jon :tantrum:

[MJasper]

The line that most upset me in this chapter was when Theon thought that Ned might wed him to Sansa and claim him for a son. Too Stark to be a Greyjoy and too Greyjoy to be a Stark... He did horrible things, but I can't help sympathizing with him. Ramsay Bolton is terrifyingly awesome. I cannot wait to see him get his comeuppance. It must happen!