401 replies to this topic

[ebevan91]

I just read this chapter for the first time. I had a feeling something would happen when reading Jon's earlier chapters. Something I didn't feel before the Red Wedding.

In all honesty, I hope Jon is dead. I like him but I want to see what happens without him.

[KingOfTheRats]

Howdyphillip, on 16 July 2011 - 08:44 PM, said:

Sick... I am just sick...  I could rant for hours here, but it isn't the place to do so.

THEY KILLED MY NIGGA JON !!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=owf6D2vfZqM

this is the greatest video ever, thank you.

[ManyFacedOne]

KingOfTheRats, on 06 December 2012 - 03:11 PM, said:

this is the greatest video ever, thank you.

  "I don't play that shit!"

Just don't get him started on Sansa!

[wolfmaid7]

KingOfTheRats, on 06 December 2012 - 03:11 PM, said:

this is the greatest video ever, thank you.

That was hilarious

[Mother of Mini Dragons]

I just finished this last night and I'm still a little devastated. I don't think I can let myself believe Jon was actually killed.

There just has to be more to it.

And it is made all the more frustrating that we have to wait for whenever the next book will be published.  

[K1T]

I bet there was Melisandres plan behind this. John had to leave the wall, but he knew they couldn't break his vows. I'm pretty sure there must be something to do with Karstark. The red priestess must be swapped them like she did with Mance and the Lord O'Bones.
I'm pretty sure about that cause Jon is not stupid and he couldn't die under such circumstances.
What do you think?

Edited by K1T, 16 January 2013 - 12:20 PM.

[Anth]

That's not how I expected it to end.
Oh Jon Snow. I've only recently began to really appreciate you.

[Stevewpg]

Black Crow, on 28 October 2012 - 03:39 PM, said:

As to Jon; when GRRM was asked in an interview why he had killed him off, he responded: "Oh, you think he's dead do you?"

dude WTF? this place is supposed to be safe from that shit.

[Noelle Snow]

Stevewpg, on 08 February 2013 - 11:34 AM, said:

dude WTF? this place is supposed to be safe from that shit.

Honestly, if you're reading this thread, it's assumed you've at least finished that chapter if not the whole book. Very few on this board think that Jon is actually dead so that quote was no big deal.

[Stevewpg]

Noelle Snow, on 08 February 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

Very few on this board think that Jon is actually dead so that quote was no big deal.

that's irrelevant. this is a still reading thread.

There must be countless threads in the forum where the GRRM spoiler quote could've been posted instead.

[Stevewpg]

Noelle Snow, on 08 February 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

Honestly, if you're reading this thread, it's assumed you've at least finished that chapter if not the whole book.

Honestly, if your replying to this thread, it's assumed you got at least the reading ability of an 8 year old.

Edited by Stevewpg, 08 February 2013 - 07:47 PM.

[Kasrith]

K1T, on 16 January 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

I bet there was Melisandres plan behind this. John had to leave the wall, but he knew they couldn't break his vows. I'm pretty sure there must be something to do with Karstark. The red priestess must be swapped them like she did with Mance and the Lord O'Bones.

I can't see a swap taking place, because it is his POV chapter, he is the one telling us what is going on. I like to think he warged into Ghost and that for the first time we encounter him again it will be a Ghost POV

[Noelle Snow]

Stevewpg, on 08 February 2013 - 07:36 PM, said:

Honestly, if your replying to this thread, it's assumed you got at least the reading ability of an 8 year old.

Sorry you're so pressed about it. But this is the internet. People have been spoiled way worse than this from a quote from the author himself. If he's ok with pretty much letting you know Jon most likely isn't dead (and that statement wasn't at all a guarantee that he's not), then I think you'll be just fine knowing what he said.

If you feel it's irrelevant, smart thing to do is stay offline altogether until you finish the book. Then maybe you won't have these problems.

[rjpraider]

There seems to be alot of hate for this chapter but IMO i think it was one of the best chapters GRRM wrote. I believe there were some posts that kind of touched on this but this chapter peeled the layer of honor that the NW has hidded behind purely on reputation.

Just like Jaime (where at first we thought he was a complete douche but later showed there is much more to him) the wildlings have been heavily portrayed as being bad guys and the NW the good guys but we as readers know better. Jon emphazised that most of the current brothers who are on the wall did not want to be there willingly. What stuck with me the most that i have not seen written on here that much was the hall where the old brothers use to hang their shields that Jon gave his speech. It was an honor (and very patriotic) for someone to give their life to the greater cause of the realm and those brothers did it willingly. Now everyone in westeros would rather play "the game of thrones". Janos Slynt even brought some of that mentality to the wall and it seems to have stuck a bit. How is it that 2 back to back LC's were killed by their own men? It really shows the quality of recruits they bring in who never wanted to be there in the first place (unlike the men who came before them to hang their shields in the hall and give their lifes to the realm).

The current batch "believes" they are like the men before but their actions speak otherwise. All these chapters have led up to show that wildlings are not all that bad and they are only treated that way based on reputation (just like the current NW believes they are good/honorable based on reputation). Wun Wun was one of the best examples. How many times did Jon ask him to help them out and he did without any complaint? Did he ever mistreat anyone of the NW? Yet we are set to believe that he is bad?

To me this was the only way that Jon can see what the NW has turned into. I do believe he is alive and will eradicate all the garbage on the wall and replace with "real" good people regardless of their reputation (wildlings/giants etc...).

[lionhead]

Just read this and throwing another theory (which i don't believe myself).
Only read the first couple and last couple of pages in this thread so not sure if its already been covered.

Was Jon, Jon at that point?
OK its from his POV but a lot of things he did later on in the chapter is out of character for Jon......

Ok don't think so myself. I am assuming it will go down the route of revive a version of Jon/Warg into something/someone/mels magic or the possibility that he stays dead.

[dttljs123]

This was the saddest chapter GRRM has written so far. The bastards letter was interesting but the last two pages really just blew. If anyone saw that coming then you are sick and twisted.

[finger]

We knew of daggers in the night, "beware your friends", and so on,... something had to happen. But I couldn't suspect this.

I'm pretty sure Jon is not dead, with two possibilities.

1. The wounds are not deadly. We are told of a scratch, a stab in his belly and another stab between the blades of his back. It sounds serious.
On the other hand, Wun Wun was about, wielding half a corpse. Enough to sweep the attackers, if he fancies.

2. The book is rather long but, do you remember the prologue? I didn't find it too much sense, but now, it is different.
Varamyr was a warg, and he tells us that Jon himself is another warg. Nobody knows, not even any character of the story.
Varamyr tells as well that wargs die many times, until they really die.
This one could be just Jon's first death.
I only hope that he won't go dying again and again in next books.

As for Ramsay's letter, it's BS. Sure he has discoverd Mance, once two of her spearwives have been shot dead, but all the rest in unbearable.
To start with, why is he writing instead of his father?
Then, a seven day battle? WTF!
Then, that shit of "give my bride back". He recognizes she's flown and, should she be with Jon, he'd know she's not Arya. It's nonsense.
And, what about the customary piece of person that he's so fond to send with the letters?
We can guess what's behind that letter.

Edited by finger, 12 April 2013 - 07:36 AM.

[Athenian117]

God I nearly cried after reading that Jon chapter why does bad stuff happen to the good guys

[A_S]

I don't think that Jon is dead, but if he is, then I think I'm done with reading. I know all men must die, but if it happens like this then I just feel cheated. And I also think that this last Jon chapter was so not like him at all, ignoring Ghost totally.

[Harry the Heirry]

Jon had better be dead. GRRM has used his "get out of jail free" cards way too often recently. If Jon is resurrected, I'm simply skipping the rest of his chapters. The Wall's story goes nowhere if there isn't something to shake up everything, Jon's getting everything set up so that the castles are manned and fixed, but what then? The Wall has to fall, and maybe Jon's death has something to do with it.

As for the letter: It doesn't add up, not one bit. If Stannis was "crushed", they'd certainly have Theon and Jeyne back, or would have been informed by someone that they were among Stannis's forces. No way, Ramsay's bluffing and trying to get Jon to go South.

And has no one even paused to consider, what the heck did Ser Patrek do to piss off Wun Wun like that?