72 replies to this topic

[Mista C]

Just finished reading AGoT and have also watched Season 1 three times now.  What are some of your favorite parts from the book that did not make it into the show?

My favorite book scene that did not make it into the show was Tywin Lannister's rant in the final Tyrion chapter of the book.  Yes, that scene was in the show in Episode 10 when he tells Tyrion that he is to go and rule at Kings Landing, but I liked in the book how he rips on everyone at Kings Landing for getting rid of Ser Barriston Selmy and for making Janos Slynt a lord.  He also gives a nice "State of Westeros" speech in the book as well, explaining each party that is trying to claim the crown and how they are trapped on all sides and are going to have to head to Harrenhal to re-group.  These things are mentioned briefly in that scene in the show, but they are just kind of glossed over.  I thought that the book did a much better job of conveying Tywin's dislike of pretty much everyone at King's Landing, and it also made their current situation seem much more grim than conveyed in the show.

[LyannaMormont]

The Tower of Joy scene.

[Jutah the Juggler]

LyannaMormont, on 21 July 2011 - 08:48 AM, said:

The Tower of Joy scene.

seconded

[Mattyp]

Meeting of the 'Blackfish'.

[Robb_]

Shaggydog attacking Tyrion when he is bringing the instructions about Bran's horse.

[aikonus]

Yeah the Tower of Joy scene was quite awesome, i agree.

I also enjoyed more of the detail in the river run battle.

[Caladan]

Easily the Tourney of the Hand, for me. Just a good intro to a lot of the knights of the kingdoms.

[Elenya Westerling]

Sandor telling Sansa about his burns.

[GBL]

bran dreaming before he wakes up

[strifed169]

When Jaime Lannister tries to get to Robb, slaying a number of men including Kastark's two sons, all the while screaming Robb's name

[Weasel_Soup]

GBL, on 23 August 2011 - 07:47 AM, said:

bran dreaming before he wakes up

I thought we see this?  Bran is shown a few times having the three eyed crow dream.  Is that after he wakes up I honestly can't remember.

[lyvyathan]

Mista C, on 14 July 2011 - 09:41 AM, said:

Just finished reading AGoT and have also watched Season 1 three times now.  What are some of your favorite parts from the book that did not make it into the show?

My favorite book scene that did not make it into the show was Tywin Lannister's rant in the final Tyrion chapter of the book.  Yes, that scene was in the show in Episode 10 when he tells Tyrion that he is to go and rule at Kings Landing, but I liked in the book how he rips on everyone at Kings Landing for getting rid of Ser Barriston Selmy and for making Janos Slynt a lord.  He also gives a nice "State of Westeros" speech in the book as well, explaining each party that is trying to claim the crown and how they are trapped on all sides and are going to have to head to Harrenhal to re-group.  These things are mentioned briefly in that scene in the show, but they are just kind of glossed over.  I thought that the book did a much better job of conveying Tywin's dislike of pretty much everyone at King's Landing, and it also made their current situation seem much more grim than conveyed in the show.

I preferred the HBO version - because in that one, they showed Tyrion being for once flabbergasted that his Father has deigned to call him "My Son" and acknowledged his status for the first time. It made Tyrion more human to me.

It made more sense than Tyrion's cynical "I know everything" attitude in the book.

I personally thought the HBO show did a good job in informing the audience that the Lannister position was dire. They knew they were caught out and even Kevan hysterically wanted to sue for peace.

[lyvyathan]

strifed169, on 25 August 2011 - 01:59 AM, said:

When Jaime Lannister tries to get to Robb, slaying a number of men including Kastark's two sons, all the while screaming Robb's name [img]http://asoiaf.wester...iggrin.gif[/img]

Yeah HBO should have shown at least one part of that fight rather than the silly canter across the snow with Robb running back to mommy.

[Warlock Vetolgar]

The one thing I never expected HBO to show, but I still missed dearly, was Catelyn climbing all her way to the Eyrie. Just reading about it gives me gooseflesh.

[Lord Barristan]

Lyvyathan, on 22 October 2011 - 10:02 AM, said:

I preferred the HBO version - because in that one, they showed Tyrion being for once flabbergasted that his Father has deigned to call him "My Son" and acknowledged his status for the first time. It made Tyrion more human to me.

It made more sense than Tyrion's cynical "I know everything" attitude in the book.

I personally thought the HBO show did a good job in informing the audience that the Lannister position was dire. They knew they were caught out and even Kevan hysterically wanted to sue for peace.

Tyrion is definitely flabbergasted in the book as well... It was stupid not to include the scene from the book. Kevan should have stayed because it shows the importance of Kevan to Tywin and vice versa. Did they even name Kevan in the tv series? I know he was cast and was in the scene, but he was very important to Tywin and the show didn't portray this.

I also think it is important for Tywin to tell Tyrion about Janos Slynt and the other small council members... It would have taken 45 seconds for Tywin to say that. It shows that Cersei and Joffrey are really in over their heads and that even Lord Tywin sees this.

I also thought they should have mentioned Rhaegar a bit more. I understand that they didn't want to show flashbacks, but IMO Rhaegar is one of the most fascinating characters and the opinions we are fed from different POV characters make him more intriguing. I think Robert mentioned him once or maybe twice, Ned I don't believe said his name once.

Edited by Francesco Totti, 26 October 2011 - 03:50 PM.

[lyvyathan]

Francesco Totti, on 26 October 2011 - 03:47 PM, said:

Tyrion is definitely flabbergasted in the book as well... It was stupid not to include the scene from the book. Kevan should have stayed because it shows the importance of Kevan to Tywin and vice versa. Did they even name Kevan in the tv series? I know he was cast and was in the scene, but he was very important to Tywin and the show didn't portray this.

I also think it is important for Tywin to tell Tyrion about Janos Slynt and the other small council members... It would have taken 45 seconds for Tywin to say that. It shows that Cersei and Joffrey are really in over their heads and that even Lord Tywin sees this.

I also thought they should have mentioned Rhaegar a bit more. I understand that they didn't want to show flashbacks, but IMO Rhaegar is one of the most fascinating characters and the opinions we are fed from different POV characters make him more intriguing. I think Robert mentioned him once or maybe twice, Ned I don't believe said his name once.

Yes but Tyrion was flabbergasted in the book in a negative sense. I'm rushing now for work so I don't have the time to quote it.

I found the book version actually disappointing. Because well to me imho it didn't read very well. It didn't make sense. Here's a son that been rejected and put down by his father since he was born - "a dwarf is always a bastard in the eye's of his father - and then in this important meeting Tywin
1. acknowledged Tyrion's intelligence
2. admitted partially that he was smarter than his glamorous older sister
3. and most importantly - he called Tyrion "his son"!!! It is possibly the first time that Tywin has ever done this in the positive sense of the word.

To Tyrion - it should have been an extremely positive moment. I felt the HBO did the scene justice - and ironically not the book.

As for not mentioning Janos et al - did they? - I can forgive HBO for not talking about that - the main essence was that Ned Stark was executed and Tywin disapproved of that - and blamed Cersei for the fiasco.

Well, in defense of HBO - there was a hell of a lot of detail to plow through. Still - it would have been good to have seen a flashback of that battle scene though.

[Warlock Vetolgar]

Lyvyathan, on 26 October 2011 - 07:43 PM, said:

Yes but Tyrion was flabbergasted in the book in a negative sense. I'm rushing now for work so I don't have the time to quote it.

I found the book version actually disappointing. Because well to me imho it didn't read very well. It didn't make sense. Here's a son that been rejected and put down by his father since he was born - "a dwarf is always a bastard in the eye's of his father - and then in this important meeting Tywin
1. acknowledged Tyrion's intelligence
2. admitted partially that he was smarter than his glamorous older sister
3. and most importantly - he called Tyrion "his son"!!! It is possibly the first time that Tywin has ever done this in the positive sense of the word.

To Tyrion - it should have been an extremely positive moment. I felt the HBO did the scene justice - and ironically not the book.

As for not mentioning Janos et al - did they? - I can forgive HBO for not talking about that - the main essence was that Ned Stark was executed and Tywin disapproved of that - and blamed Cersei for the fiasco.

Well, in defense of HBO - there was a hell of a lot of detail to plow through. Still - it would have been good to have seen a flashback of that battle scene though.

I prefer the book version, actually. The thing to keep in mind is that Tyrion is by now a very cynical individual, and has learned to mistrust the hand that reaches out to him, no matter how friendly it may seem. He can't afford to trust anything or anybody, no matter how temping it may be. Besides, it is painfully obvious that Lord Tywin speaks kindly to his son because he has no other choice. Deep down, Tyrion must know that as soon as his father can find anybody more suitable, he has no choice but to trust the son he has always despised (and surely continues to do so). Plus, the fact there's a war going on further paints Tywin into this unpleasant corner. I don't know if you have read all the books, so I won't say much, only that book Tyrion knew his father a lot better than HBO Tyrion.

[lyvyathan]

Warlock Vetolgar, on 27 October 2011 - 04:32 PM, said:

I prefer the book version, actually. The thing to keep in mind is that Tyrion is by now a very cynical individual, and has learned to mistrust the hand that reaches out to him, no matter how friendly it may seem. He can't afford to trust anything or anybody, no matter how temping it may be. Besides, it is painfully obvious that Lord Tywin speaks kindly to his son because he has no other choice. Deep down, Tyrion must know that as soon as his father can find anybody more suitable, he has no choice but to trust the son he has always despised (and surely continues to do so). Plus, the fact there's a war going on further paints Tywin into this unpleasant corner. I don't know if you have read all the books, so I won't say much, only that book Tyrion knew his father a lot better than HBO Tyrion.

Well, Tyrion isn't so cynical as to not fall in love with Shae.

And no, Tywin did not speak kindly to Tyrion. But he did give him one thing - respect. The thing that Tyrion has been craving from his father since birth.

Tywin could have just as easily appointed Kevan to be the Hand of the King. But for him to choose his despised dwarf son - the child he blames for killing his beloved wife - to be the Hand of the King and to rule in his stead above golden girl Cersei and all the rest of the jackasses at court - was a very big deal.

Tywin was no fool - if he appointed someone who was only half as capable as Tyrion the whole Kingdom could have fallen - and Tyrion knew that.

I've read all the books, save ADWD which I'm reading now. But the events in AFOC can not be used retroactively to hang Tyrion's view of his father. Just my opinon.

For me, the book tends to go to extremes and paint caricatures - Cersei and Catelyn being the worse examples. It still makes for fun reading though.

[ManyFacedOne]

A lot of the Arya and Sansa scenes and a lot of their lines (e.g. he didn't hurt you... much). Tower of Joy. And so many more small little scenes I loved.

[Warlock Vetolgar]

Lyvyathan, on 27 October 2011 - 06:48 PM, said:

Well, Tyrion isn't so cynical as to not fall in love with Shae.

And no, Tywin did not speak kindly to Tyrion. But he did give him one thing - respect. The thing that Tyrion has been craving from his father since birth.

Tywin could have just as easily appointed Kevan to be the Hand of the King. But for him to choose his despised dwarf son - the child he blames for killing his beloved wife - to be the Hand of the King and to rule in his stead above golden girl Cersei and all the rest of the jackasses at court - was a very big deal.

Tywin was no fool - if he appointed someone who was only half as capable as Tyrion the whole Kingdom could have fallen - and Tyrion knew that.

I've read all the books, save ADWD which I'm reading now. But the events in AFOC can not be used retroactively to hang Tyrion's view of his father. Just my opinon.

For me, the book tends to go to extremes and paint caricatures - Cersei and Catelyn being the worse examples. It still makes for fun reading though.

Good points, but allow me to build on mine. I believe Tywin was thinking of what his sister once told him (as she tells Jaime in AFFC), namely that Tyrion is more like Tywin than he cares to admit. Kevan is a good man, but he's a follower, not a leader; a builder, not an architect. Unless he has someone to tell him what to do, he's pretty much clueless and unsure of what he should do. By the time you're done with ADWD you'll see what I mean. Cersei is too hot headed, impetuous, and immature to serve as a suitable leader, and Tywin knows this. You're right, Tywin was no fool. He was also without a choice. For the time being, while he still had a war to fight, he would have to delegate to Tyrion. When the war was over though, things changed. ASOS pretty much makes this clear from the get-go. And in my view, in Shae's case...well, there's a difference between not being cynical and being delusional.

BTW, I do believe HBO's Shae is a much more interesting character and I wouldn't blame either HBO Tyrion or book Tyrion for falling in love with her. Makes me wonder how their romance is gonna play out in the show. I do believe some characters are more human in the show than in the book, but that's a different story.