The Wedding At The Twins

[Ned'sHead]

AFFC is rated lower than the other books on Amazon because:

A. Not much of a spoiler, but better safe than sorry.

It changes up the POVs and you don't hear much about the usual favorite characters.

B. People were bitter about the oft-delayed Dance release.

A Storm of Swords is arguably the most 'bleak' book in the series and it's also the best reviewed.

[Mattyp]

AFFC is rated lower than the other books on Amazon because:

A. Not much of a spoiler, but better safe than sorry.

It changes up the POVs and you don't hear much about the usual favorite characters.

B. People were bitter about the oft-delayed Dance release.

A Storm of Swords is arguably the most 'bleak' book in the series and it's also the best reviewed.

Now it seems that Dance with Dragons is the worst reviewed now anyway...which doesn't bode well :(

[areowin]

I CANNOT BELIEVE THIS HAPPENED!

I am shocked. I actually re-read the chapter because I swore I had to of read it wrong. He was my favorite king in the running nad I always thought he was going to end up as the final king. If he kills Jon I will be heartbroken.

[iheartseverus]

I CANNOT BELIEVE THIS HAPPENED!

I am shocked. I actually re-read the chapter because I swore I had to of read it wrong. He was my favorite king in the running nad I always thought he was going to end up as the final king. If he kills Jon I will be heartbroken.

LOL, GRRM is brutal, no question... There's a running 'joke' out there in his fandom for years, that every time somebody complains about how long its taking for the next book, he kills another Stark. But for sure, this chapter, the Red Wedding, was a gob-smack punch in the gut for every Stark fan alive. Lots of readers threw their book across the room, swearing never to read another word. But eventually, we all came back for more. No question though, this one was tough.

[The Anti-Targ]

Of course if one reads closely Dany's visions in the House of the Undying in A Clash of Kings you will have been expecting this for a while. Probably thinking that it would be at Robbs wedding, the only curveball being that it ends up being Ed's wedding.

Naturally I didn't read Dany's visions too closely and it was 3 years between reading aCoK and aSoS so it came as a bolt out of the blue for me, albeit with that sense of dread once Robb had married that Westerling girl. Nothing good comes from marrying westerners.

[areowin]

Of course if one reads closely Dany's visions in the House of the Undying in A Clash of Kings you will have been expecting this for a while. Probably thinking that it would be at Robbs wedding, the only curveball being that it ends up being Ed's wedding.

Naturally I didn't read Dany's visions too closely and it was 3 years between reading aCoK and aSoS so it came as a bolt out of the blue for me, albeit with that sense of dread once Robb had married that Westerling girl. Nothing good comes from marrying westerners.

Hmm, I gotta dig out the other book and read her visions!

[lezboyd]

Of course if one reads closely Dany's visions in the House of the Undying in A Clash of Kings you will have been expecting this for a while. Probably thinking that it would be at Robbs wedding, the only curveball being that it ends up being Ed's wedding.

Naturally I didn't read Dany's visions too closely and it was 3 years between reading aCoK and aSoS so it came as a bolt out of the blue for me, albeit with that sense of dread once Robb had married that Westerling girl. Nothing good comes from marrying westerners.

Please share with us which part of her visions you are talking about. Since everyone here would have read ACoK, it won't be a spoiler.

[Maester Joergensen]

Please share with us which part of her visions you are talking about. Since everyone here would have read ACoK, it won't be a spoiler.

Here you go.

Farther on she came upon a feast of corpses. Savagely slaughtered, the feasters lay strewn across overturned chairs and hacked trestle tables, asprawl in pools of congealing blood. Some had lost limbs, even heads. Savaged limbs clutched bloody cups, wooden spoons, roast fowl, heels of bread. On a throne above them sat a dead man with the head of a wolf. He wore an iron crown and held a leg of lamb in one hand as a king might hold a scepter, and his eyes followed Dany with mute appeal

[Lucreel]

Here you go.

Yeah, now that you mention it, I remember that. I remember thinking to myself at the time that "the head of a wolf and an iron crown" sounded like it was symbolism for the Starks. I wasn't expecting it to be fulfilled so literally though. I took that to be a symbolic prophecy lol.

I kind of put out of mind pretty quickly the visions that Dany saw, because it was never clear that all those visions weren't just a lot of lies? I mean, why on earth would the palace of a bunch of life-sucking necromancers be filled with actual, true prophecy? I just took those visions as being meant to confuse and frighten Dany, not to actually reveal anything to the reader. Darn George! :spank:

[zmflavius]

Yeah, now that you mention it, I remember that. I remember thinking to myself at the time that "the head of a wolf and an iron crown" sounded like it was symbolism for the Starks. I wasn't expecting it to be fulfilled so literally though. I took that to be a symbolic prophecy lol.

I kind of put out of mind pretty quickly the visions that Dany saw, because it was never clear that all those visions weren't just a lot of lies? I mean, why on earth would the palace of a bunch of life-sucking necromancers be filled with actual, true prophecy? I just took those visions as being meant to confuse and frighten Dany, not to actually reveal anything to the reader. Darn George! :spank:

Some of them are, of course, and some won't occur (the Rhaego one for example), and others are unfulfilled.

[BloodRider]

I'll just leave this here:

http://img615.imageshack.us/img615/2112/wtmnmv.jpg

[Maester Joergensen]

Yeah, now that you mention it, I remember that. I remember thinking to myself at the time that "the head of a wolf and an iron crown" sounded like it was symbolism for the Starks. I wasn't expecting it to be fulfilled so literally though. I took that to be a symbolic prophecy lol.

I kind of put out of mind pretty quickly the visions that Dany saw, because it was never clear that all those visions weren't just a lot of lies? I mean, why on earth would the palace of a bunch of life-sucking necromancers be filled with actual, true prophecy?

That is a very good question. Trying to interpret the variuos prophesies, found in the house of the undying and other places in the books, is just such a fun little corner of aSoIaF-fandom, that I haven´t really considered that. Maybe the house itself is magic, and automatically aligns to the person walking there and show them things relevant to their life. And the warlocks build it to use themself to predict their future, or to show real prophesy to people that paid them, or people they wanted to impress. Or they thought that visions containing some truth in them would cut deeper, and they didn´t know that Dany knew so little abouy Westeros and her past that it didn´t hit home. It did give George a way to add yet another layer to his story. But this is getting OT very fast.

[Malcolm Reynolds]

I'll just leave this here:

http://img615.imageshack.us/img615/2112/wtmnmv.jpg

You made my day, sir. :laugh:

[twistedlittlemonkeydemon]

Just reached this chapter myself; from reading some of the subject titles in the forums here, I knew that something big was going to happen and had my suspicion that time was up for Robb Stark ... so was shocked to see Catelyn being killed off too though.

Whereas some posters seem to be p***ed off with GRRM, I think it is a brilliant piece of storytelling... in so many novels/movies/etc. there is always a clear 'hero' who is damn near invincible.. killing off Ned in GOT, Renly in COK, and Robb in SOS shows that those rules don't apply in Westeros... GRRM has done a great job of leaving it just-long-enough between these deaths that you get lulled into a false sense that the hero is going to win through. And though it seems like the Lannisters are untouchable at the moment, I am sure there time is coming too...at this rate, its hard to see how any of the main characters are going to make it to the end of book 7!

I've also just read the next chapter,

where it seems like Arya also gets killed... I found this even more shocking and I can't quite believe that she's been killed off ... particularly given that she hasn't done a great deal since leaving King's Landing expect wander from one place to the next. It doesn't explicitly say that Arya gets killed, so hoping that we haven't seen the last of her.

[Sylver]

I just finished this one last night and, over the whole book, this is the one scene that sticks with me. I got SO FREAKIN MAD about this chapter that I actually put the book down for the rest of the day LOL!! I mean, Arya was SO CLOSE and Robb was finally starting to behave like a king. I was ok with Robb's death (although I like that each of the children think they're the last and Cat thinks most of them are dead), but when he killed off Catelynn it was like 'well, there went the story!' But it is interesting how he saved face over it in the end... still I was upset for the night over it :)

Guess that's not such a bad thing since it's a rare author who can stoke my fires like that, and I applaud GRRM for his storytelling skill, but I can't get it out of my head! It was perfectly written and just drives home the point that this story isn't about happy endings; it's closer to the truth than that.

Anyway, four other friends besides myself are working through the series so I may go mad as Aerys before I get the next one lol. In which case, happy reading!!

[Seanathan]

How do folks know chapter numbers? None of my chapters are numbered - I'm reading a recent paperback edition, and the chapters just have character names as titles, so you know what character's viewpoint you are seeing the world through. I suppose I could count the chapters but that seems tedious. Perhaps other editions have them numbered?

My Nook Color numbers them if you go to the table of contents.

[Don't_call_me_Ser]

I was so upset and shocked by it i stopped reading for the night. Jon & Arya are the last Starks left, fingers crossed! (I'm not counting Sansa or Rickon as one is pathetically lame and the other is just a child)

[Slychd]

I was so upset and shocked by it i stopped reading for the night. Jon & Arya are the last Starks left, fingers crossed! (I'm not counting Sansa or Rickon as one is pathetically lame and the other is just a child)

What about Bran? lol

[Don't_call_me_Ser]

What about Bran? lol

Ha, i forgot about Bran for a sec there. The dream/warg things are a bit trippy for my liking. It's all a bit odd. Plus, like someone else said, all he seems to do it moan, i find myself wanting his chapters to end quickly so we can go see what the more fun characters are up to!

[Urien the Ragged]

i thought it was funny that catelyn thought that robb was the last, but was actually the first and only to die, up until now.