Why does everyone hate Catelyn Stark?

[Frey Pies]

Hi, this my first post, and I haven't been on this forum too long, so I am sorry if this has already been discussed, but why does everyone hate Catelyn Stark? In all the threads I have read, I have found some one or other bashing her, and that has concerned me a bit, cause I quite like her.

Sure, she is not nice to Jon (which is understandable considering it's Westeros), and has made a lot of mistakes, but so has everyone, and she normally blames herself for them too (like when she sent Ned and the children south).

I have also heard a lot of people say that Catelyn is only concerned about her own, which I disagree with. In aCoK, she was praying in the sept for her own and everyone else affected by the war.

And why is she blamed for the Red Wedding? Shouldn't it be Walder Frey, Tywin Lannister, Roose Bolton, and to a lesser extent, Robb, who were responsible for it?

[Frey Pies]

Anyone?

[Valamway]

It's probably the fact she hates Jon who seems to be most peoples favourite and how she raised Sansa. Personally i didn't mind her.

[RAAM]

people blame her for the red wedding?no one ive talked to about seems to think so

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

ned"i shouldnt got to KL"

cat"you must"

ned"okay"

ned dies

cat"im going to arrest the dwarf in plain sight using tully bannermen"

tyrion"wtf?you know my father is going to get pissed"

cat"whatever"

tyrion escapes anyway, tywin attacks riverlands

cat"im going to free you so you can free my daughters, despite the fact that neither you nor your brother would do say without tywins leave"

jaime"okay, its not like im a valuable hostage or anything"

she loses robbs most valuable hostage with no gain for robb

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

[Boy and Girl Wadish]

Well, she's rather impulsive, isn't she? She makes bad decisions that pretty much cost people their lives. At least that's what I think.

[Valamway]

people blame her for the red wedding?no one ive talked to about seems to think so

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

ned"i shouldnt got to KL"

cat"you must"

ned"okay"

ned dies

cat"im going to arrest the dwarf in plain sight using tully bannermen"

tyrion"wtf?you know my father is going to get pissed"

cat"whatever"

tyrion escapes anyway, tywin attacks riverlands

cat"im going to free you so you can free my daughters, despite the fact that neither you nor your brother would do say without tywins leave"

jaime"okay, its not like im a valuable hostage or anything"

she loses robbs most valuable hostage with no gain for robb

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

Hmmm when you put it that way i like her less now :(

[Gurkhal]

I for one like her because she's a symphatic character even if no superwoman by any chance. She's got alot of flaws but I also see that she's got alot of virtues like dutiful, loyal, hardworkinig, loving (with the exception of Jon but she would be right to treat him alot worse than she did, in my mind). Therefor I for one don't hate Catelyn and I know there are a few on the forum who share my sentiments.

[Frey Pies]

people blame her for the red wedding?no one ive talked to about seems to think so

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

ned"i shouldnt got to KL"

cat"you must"

ned"okay"

ned dies

cat"im going to arrest the dwarf in plain sight using tully bannermen"

tyrion"wtf?you know my father is going to get pissed"

cat"whatever"

tyrion escapes anyway, tywin attacks riverlands

cat"im going to free you so you can free my daughters, despite the fact that neither you nor your brother would do say without tywins leave"

jaime"okay, its not like im a valuable hostage or anything"

she loses robbs most valuable hostage with no gain for robb

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

How would she have known that Ned would have died? After all, Robert was Ned's best friend, and they both trusted each other. How would she have known that Robert would have died so the Lannisters could kill Ned.

With Tyrion, she acted upon what she knew. True, it wasn't the smartest decision. Someone who was almost like her brother had told her that the dagger was Tyrion's, so why wouldn't she trust him?

Letting Jaime go was pretty stupid, but Bran and Rickon had died thaat day, and she must have been smitten by grief and wouldn't have wanted to lose her remaining children.

And Bran

[eyeheartsansa]

I like her.. she is a mother who has made rash decisions that she thought were the right things to do at the time. I thought arresting Tyrion was a courageous display of cool headed assertiveness and hutzpah. At the time I cheered for her (despite knowing Tyrion was innocent). Letting Jaime go, under care of Brienne... well, not quite so much.

It's easy to sit and judge, but honestly, what would you do if a Kingslayer pushed your nine year old son out of a window? Hell hath no fury like a vengeful mother cub. As a new parent, I can relate!

[The hairy bear]

No, not everyone hates Catelyn Stark. Some do. Some love her. ASOIAF fans are far from unanimous when to choosing their favorite or most hated POVs.

[bronnxtyrion]

Robb Stark and the Northerners lost the war because they came south of the neck to protect the riverlands. As long as they remained north of Deepwood Motte they would have survived. The riverlands cannot be defended from the Lannister power. So it is the Tully alliance from Cat's marriage that cost them their lives. Again by arresting Tyrion she dragged the Tullys into a war not their own and then dragged Robb to fight a battle in disadvantage. Even if Tyrion was the true culprit what she did was a colossal blunder.

[Podrick + Arya = Win]

Robb Stark and the Northerners lost the war because they came south of the neck to protect the riverlands. As long as they remained north of Deepwood Motte they would have survived. The riverlands cannot be defended from the Lannister power. So it is the Tully alliance from Cat's marriage that cost them their lives. Again by arresting Tyrion she dragged the Tullys into a war not their own and then dragged Robb to fight a battle in disadvantage. Even if Tyrion was the true culprit what she did was a colossal blunder.

They went South to King's Landing to save Ned. They needed to fight and get at least some valuable hostages, if not lay siege to KL itself.

Anyway, I'm tired of discussions on Catelyn. I don't really like her and blame her for Jaime's escape and Karstark's execution at the very least. She is very selfish when it comes to saving her own children, but did not understand Karstark's grief before the RW. Karstark saw his sons die in front of him, Catelyn eventually found out what it was like to be in his place at the RW.

Besides, now she justifies taking revenge on her son's killers? What if Thoros or the other members of BWB release Jaime and Brienne or a Frey or a Bolton?

[tyrions sliced nose]

I dont like her because of Rickon. I mean what mother treats her youngest child the way she did. Ignores him when Bran got hurt and then just leaves him at Winterfell so she can go to KL to find out about the dagger when a crow or a trusted servent couldve told ned about it. I mean Rickon is totally deserted by everyone but Bran whos crippled.

[guad]

Why does everyone hate Catelyn Stark?

Because people know what Jon knows, aka nothing. ;)

Let's just blame Cat for the war of the 5 Kings, for Ned's death, for the Others rising, for Jon's chronical emo, for the Red Wedding, global warming, baby seals dying, conflict in middle east, you get the picture.

Cat is a great character, and my personal theory is that most of the Cat hate comes from hardcore Jon fans.

[Zeromus]

She was very mean to Tyrion and Jon, who are probably the most popular characters in the series. Plus she wants to hang Jaime - another very popular character.

[MyDogIsNamedDanerys]

Cat is probably the most unlucky character in the series. Every decision she takes, while usually rational at the time (Jon notwithstanding) ends up turning out just about as bad as it possibly can.

Readers of these books don't seem the see any distinction between decisions that are good but turn out bad, and decisions which are bad and turn out bad which is... well downright silly. The reader has more knowledge than Cat, and hindsight is 20-20.

Finally, I personally don't love Catelyn. I will defend her against the most vitriolic haters, but I find her not terribly sympathetic or likable. Which is fine. Not everyone should be equally likable.

[Ser Pistus]

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

(...)

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

This is ridiculous. Try and blame Catelyn for the Great Spring Sickness and the Mad King's madness as well, these are missing from your list.

[Greywolf2375]

There are a litany of threads of similar topics, unfortunately with the search down it's hard to find them.

It's probably the fact she hates Jon who seems to be most peoples favourite and how she raised Sansa. Personally i didn't mind her.

Catelyn doesn't hate Jon - aside from the single time she snapped at him when Bran was recovering, what evidence is there of her hatred?

[Mark Ryswell]

I liked Cat, not too thrilled with zombie-Cat.

[David Selig]

people blame her for the red wedding?no one ive talked to about seems to think so

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

ned"i shouldnt got to KL"

cat"you must"

ned"okay"

ned dies

cat"im going to arrest the dwarf in plain sight using tully bannermen"

tyrion"wtf?you know my father is going to get pissed"

cat"whatever"

tyrion escapes anyway, tywin attacks riverlands

cat"im going to free you so you can free my daughters, despite the fact that neither you nor your brother would do say without tywins leave"

jaime"okay, its not like im a valuable hostage or anything"

she loses robbs most valuable hostage with no gain for robb

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

See, this is the kind of posts which makes it really hard to take the "I hate Catelyn" crowd seriously.

It was Ned's decision to go to KL. He's the Lord, he doesn't have to do what his wife suggests. Not only that, but after Bran's fall Catelyn asked him not to go and he ignored her.

Tywin started the war. If you think having a son arrested is a justifiable reason to start a war...:rolleyes: Not to mention that the first hostile act between the Starks and Lannisters was the push of Bran, and then the attempt to kill him with the dagger.

And the Red Wedding was planned before Jaime was released. The plan was to get Edmure, Cat and a bunch of other high nobles as hostages - more than enough to exchange with Jaime.