61 replies to this topic

[grandmazter3]

Is it wrong to like him a bit?

I like Sam as much as anyone but you gotta see it from his father's POV, that's his heir and he can barely do anything, his house would have fallen if Sam had been named Lord.

Everything I've read about Randyll Tarly seems pretty fair to me. He protects his people, punishes thieves and rapist and with the exception of being sexist he seems like a pretty good Lord compared to the others we have read about.

Aside from his treatment of Brienne and giving  up on Sam, i like him.

[Slychd]

I don't think it is wrong to like him a bit.  I enjoyed his character, he was well written, just a man doing his job, even if he was a bit stern.  He is a military man and he runs things as they should be in a military setting.  I think he is an example of an effective leader, he is strict, but doesn't appear to take any joy out of the punishments he inflicts.

I can also see why he would have thrown Sam over as his heir, even if he did it in a terrible way.  Sam would be very ineffective as a lord, and would have made a great maester.

I also found it interesting that he interacted with Brienne, who was everything he might have desired in a son, except she was discounted because she was a female.

[Tammy]

I agree.  One of my friends hates him, but I actually liked him.  He's cold and without compassion, but he seems just and honorable.  (Well, except for how he treated his son, but that's another story.)

[Lady Snark]

I grudgingly like Randyll Tarly, too.  Aside from how he dealt with Samwell, he seems like a wise and fair military type man.  He seems like a very effective leader, easily commanding respect.

As much as I like Samwell and sympathize with him, there are times when Samwell goes on his wimpering and whining stretches that go on way too long and I think I can kind of understand why Randyll did what he did.  

[Jory's Shade]

grandmazter3, on 18 August 2011 - 07:07 PM, said:

Is it wrong to like him a bit?

I like Sam as much as anyone but you gotta see it from his father's POV, that's his heir and he can barely do anything, his house would have fallen if Sam had been named Lord.

Everything I've read about Randyll Tarly seems pretty fair to me. He protects his people, punishes thieves and rapist and with the exception of being sexist he seems like a pretty good Lord compared to the others we have read about.

Aside from his treatment of Brienne and giving  up on Sam, i like him.

So aside from threatening the life of his heir and bestowing his birthright to his younger son and telling Brienne he hopes she is raped hard, he is a great guy.  Riiiiiiiiiiiiigggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhht.  Not to mention, Do I follow Renly, Stannis, Mace, Tywin.... hmmmmmmmmm  

He's a pure arse IMHO

[The Missing Link]

I thought he was a bit of a dink, but he's in a tough spot with all the bandit activity around his grounds. Although I bet you he's never killed a White Walker.

[grandmazter3]

Jory, on 19 August 2011 - 09:23 AM, said:

So aside from threatening the life of his heir and bestowing his birthright to his younger son and telling Brienne he hopes she is raped hard, he is a great guy.  Riiiiiiiiiiiiigggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhht.  Not to mention, Do I follow Renly, Stannis, Mace, Tywin.... hmmmmmmmmm  

He's a pure arse IMHO

He doesn't mean Brienee any harm, hes just a sexist who wants her in what he things is her place. The talk about her being raped, I think he just said it so she would go home.

As for Sam, I can't defend threatening his life but I also think he knew he would take the Wall. He has other children to think about, how long do you think they would have survived with Sam as Lord of Horn Hill? Lords need to lead in battles and Randyll saw that Winter was Coming

[Jory's Shade]

grandmazter3, on 19 August 2011 - 03:05 PM, said:

He doesn't mean Brienee any harm, hes just a sexist who wants her in what he things is her place. The talk about her being raped, I think he just said it so she would go home.

As for Sam, I can't defend threatening his life but I also think he knew he would take the Wall. He has other children to think about, how long do you think they would have survived with Sam as Lord of Horn Hill? Lords need to lead in battles and Randyll saw that Winter was Coming

Then why did he refuse to allow Sam to go to Oldtown to become a maester?  The guy's a prick and I wont shed a tear when he is food for crows.

[Don't_call_me_Ser]

Jory, on 20 August 2011 - 06:43 AM, said:

Then why did he refuse to allow Sam to go to Oldtown to become a maester?  The guy's a prick and I wont shed a tear when he is food for crows.

He was right to take the Lordship from Sam, i want to slap Sam half of the time, he's so utterly weak it's frustrating. Randyll has done many things that make him an arse. I won't miss him when he's gone.

[Fournaridis]

I can understand completely why people dislike him.

I like him, for what it's worth. He has his faults, sure - but, he's not half so bad as the other Lord's that are in control of respectable houses.

All the same, he handled the Sam situation terribly. You can't punish you're children if they're not who you want them to be, especially if they're not evil and vindictive.

If he wanted to pass Sam up on the birthright, that's FINE - but, there was a way to go about it. Instead, he should have encouraged Sam's good points. His ability to read, his mind, etc, etc. ENCOURAGE the kid to be a maester and be glad of it.

However, Lord Tarly is a little too short sighted and stubborn for something like that.

[Bronn is God]

If Samwell Tarly was my son, I would see him drowned. And not Ironborn style.

[Moshtradamus]

i can't say i don't completely understand why he did what he did to Sam. i mean, honestly. think about it. when you die, you have to pass down everything you own to someone. it's all about being strong, tough, and smart. would you really want your heir to be Sam? someone who eats and sings and can't do anything. i love Sam, but i totally understand Randyll's logic with having to send Sam away like he did. although he *could* have done it nicer, i won't dispute that.


as for Brienne, i've not yet finished the book. i'm a little more than halfway, so a lot can happen still, but i'm not sure how i feel about her. but from Randyll Tarly's perspective, she's a girl and not at all doing the things girls should be doing.

[Jory's Shade]

Fournaridis, on 20 August 2011 - 12:41 PM, said:

I can understand completely why people dislike him.

I like him, for what it's worth. He has his faults, sure - but, he's not half so bad as the other Lord's that are in control of respectable houses.

All the same, he handled the Sam situation terribly. You can't punish you're children if they're not who you want them to be, especially if they're not evil and vindictive.

If he wanted to pass Sam up on the birthright, that's FINE - but, there was a way to go about it. Instead, he should have encouraged Sam's good points. His ability to read, his mind, etc, etc. ENCOURAGE the kid to be a maester and be glad of it.

However, Lord Tarly is a little too short sighted and stubborn for something like that.

That's my biggest gripe with him.  Sam is noble, kind and (although he does not know it) brave.  Sam is probably one of the purest protagonists in the story, and his better attributes would have been more thoroughly developed if it were not for Tarly. Yet... unless Same took the black he would not have been able to bring back the Old Bear's tale and learn the value of dragonglass.  Isn't destiny/fate neat!

[Kate Poem]

Slychd, on 18 August 2011 - 09:36 PM, said:

I can also see why he would have thrown Sam over as his heir, even if he did it in a terrible way.  Sam would be very ineffective as a lord, and would have made a great maester.

I am sorry, but You are wrong. Did'nt You remember Sam's words? He asked his father for permission, he wanted go to Citadel and learn there.
And what did this most wonderful from fathers, Randyll Tarly?
He chained his son to wall in dungeons by hand and leg.
Three days without food and water.
He forbid his son ever think about maestery.

[Mattyp]

I always wondered why Randyll didn't try to remove his son from being his successor in another way. Make him becoming a Maester in the first place would have done that. Or perhaps Randyll just couldn't face the shame that Sam spawned from his own loins?

Either way we'll never know whether Randyll actually felt terrible after he did what he did or not!

[Howlin' Reed]

Remember that when you talk about the Sam that's brave, or loyal, that's the Sam who is part of the Night's Watch. Without that rigorous development, I doubt he'd be as admirable as he is now. And given that, he probably wouldn't have made a great maester without being blooded first...

[Tammy]

Mattyp, on 23 August 2011 - 05:11 AM, said:

I always wondered why Randyll didn't try to remove his son from being his successor in another way. Make him becoming a Maester in the first place would have done that. Or perhaps Randyll just couldn't face the shame that Sam spawned from his own loins?

Either way we'll never know whether Randyll actually felt terrible after he did what he did or not!

Hmm.   I can't imagine that he felt terrible about it.  He probably just viewed it as necessary and moved on from there.  The Sam we first met definitely wasn't someone who could hold lands and have people be loyal to him, especially in this treacherous world.

[Jory's Shade]

Howlin, on 23 August 2011 - 05:22 AM, said:

Remember that when you talk about the Sam that's brave, or loyal, that's the Sam who is part of the Night's Watch. Without that rigorous development, I doubt he'd be as admirable as he is now. And given that, he probably wouldn't have made a great maester without being blooded first...

I agree with that for sure.  His destiny was at the Wall, no question. However, Sam's destiny begining to become fulfilled by taking the black does not absolve Tarly of his cruelty.

Edited by Jory's Shade, 23 August 2011 - 10:38 AM.

[Lady Snark]

I give Tarly a pass on his treatment of Sam.  Until he had a second son to whom he could name his heir, Sam was all he had and to me it seems that Randyll was engaging in some serious tough love with Sam.  He HAD to toughen Sam up or Sam would have been doomed as the heir.  And Randyll not only has Sam to think about but also his people.  

Chaining Sam up for 3 days is really cruel if it were our times.  However, I think that Randyll's methods to try to toughen up Sam are really not that bad in the scheme of things in Westeros.  Better for Randyll to be a hard ass towards Sam to prepare him for the real world where people will ride in and rape and pillage if you cannot handle things.  

There is a chance that if Sam were not the eldest and were not the only heir until a second son was born, Randyll may have treated Sam differently.  If he were the second born, it probably wouldn't have bothered Randyll so much and he would have agreed Sam should go the route as a maester.

[dragginstoned]

Lets see.

1)  Child abuse --- chains his son to a wall
2)  Child abuse --- threatens to murder his son if he doesnt go to the wall
3)  Slays envoys
4)  Tells a highborn woman on a mission from the Iron Throne that she could use a good raping.
  
Nah... He's a dick.  

Considering what you know about him, you think more interaction is going to turn him into rainbows and puppydog kisses?