95 replies to this topic

[kissdbyfire]

Hi guys

I've been thinking about this for a while now...
I know Gwendoline Christie is great but she is too pretty. Do you think they will make her ugly? I cannot stress enough how important I think this is,  Brienne hast to be very ugly.
She is, in a way, the exact opposite of Cersei - in appearance, character etc.
It is important not just in ACoK but in all the books/future series.
It is very important as it helps us understand her character,
and for Jamie's character arc as well.

[boojam]

Kissdbyfire, on 08 October 2011 - 04:49 AM, said:

Hi guys

I've been thinking about this for a while now...
I know Gwendoline Christie is great but she is too pretty. Do you think they will make her ugly? I cannot stress enough how important I think this is,  Brienne hast to be very ugly.
She is, in a way, the exact opposite of Cersei - in appearance, character etc.
It is important not just in ACoK but in all the books/future series.
It is very important as it helps us understand her character,
and for Jamie's character arc as well.

Remember Charlize Theron in the movie MONSTER?
And I don't even think they have to go that far.

[kissdbyfire]

Sure I remember! Good example, by the way. I know it can be done. My concern is, will it be done?
On one hand, I think there is a tendency in American television/cinema to pretty up everything. On the other hand, HBO is a lot more gutsy than anyone else making TV in the US. Also, David Benioff and D.B. Weiss clearly know very well what they are doing... I don't know, I think it is just something I've been thinking about a lot. Because it is so important, in my opinion. If they don't make Gwendoline ugly, Brienne becomes a 6 ft blonde top model, and that would just ruin everything pertaining to the character.

[ZacharyB]

Reading grrm's blog about Brienne's casting (http://grrm.livejour...com/227044.html) it seems that she's going to look the part.

[kissdbyfire]

Thank you, ZacharyB.
Yes, from what he says we can assume she'll look the part.
*relief*

[Paladinmesser]

I don't know. I don't think they will make her ugly as in the books. From what I took from reading his blog was that they'll probably dye her hair, muss it up and no lipstick/model make up. If you look at Jorah he's played by a handsome reagle actor and doesn't look like the hairy unattractive dude in the books. Arya as well, when the books described Arya Horseface Maisie Williams isn't who I pictured. But they do pretty well in the shows so I don't think it will be that bad if Brienne isn't so ugly.

[Damar]

Why is it so necessary for the actors to be as ugly as described in the books? The only one who bothered me was the Hound's scars and even that was done to be practical for the actor.

[kissdbyfire]

Damar, on 15 October 2011 - 03:42 PM, said:

Why is it so necessary for the actors to be as ugly as described in the books? The only one who bothered me was the Hound's scars and even that was done to be practical for the actor.

In Brienne's case it's important that she looks the part (ie, ugly, really ugly). It's important not only to understand her character and her motivations/dreams, but very important to understand Jaime's character arc as well.

[Spidey]

Or they pull a Tyrion on her and not make her ugly at all...

[Padraig]

Its very likely that they will make her at least.  But however ugly she will be, people will moan about her not been ugly enough but what can you do.  You can't please everyone.

[boojam]

Kissdbyfire, on 15 October 2011 - 04:06 PM, said:

In Brienne's case it's important that she looks the part (ie, ugly, really ugly). It's important not only to understand her character and her motivations/dreams, but very important to understand Jaime's character arc as well.

Having just read COK again, I now don't have the impression that Brienne was pug ugly, just really homely.
There is an artists interpertation of her on the web, maybe more than one, but one I know of, that seemed to me close to what George describes.
Wasn't she supposed to have beautiful eyes? Regardless of the rest?
The way George wrote her, most of her personality came from her awareness of her looks and her fierceness to not let it get her down.
I liked her and thought her one of the few real sympathetic characters.

[kissdbyfire]

boojam, on 03 November 2011 - 06:30 PM, said:

Having just read COK again, I now don't have the impression that Brienne was pug ugly, just really homely.
There is an artists interpertation of her on the web, maybe more than one, but one I know of, that seemed to me close to what George describes.
Wasn't she supposed to have beautiful eyes? Regardless of the rest?
The way George wrote her, most of her personality came from her awareness of her looks and her fierceness to not let it get her down.
I liked her and thought her one of the few real sympathetic characters.

From what I remember, she is described as being really ugly. I may be wrong, it's been a while. But I remember different characters thinking about this, not only her (Catelyn, Jaime etc). True about the eyes, I remember that well. And I thought it made sense as to how her dynamic with Jaime works. I'll pay close attention during my current re-read. :-)

[boojam]

Kissdbyfire, on 03 November 2011 - 06:38 PM, said:

From what I remember, she is described as being really ugly. I may be wrong, it's been a while. But I remember different characters thinking about this, not only her (Catelyn, Jaime etc). True about the eyes, I remember that well. And I thought it made sense as to how her dynamic with Jaime works. I'll pay close attention during my current re-read. :-)

It will be a while yet, but after her encounter with Biter I wonder , if HBO gets there, what they will do?
I mean they could make her hideous.
(Actually George surprised me by having her turn up at the end of ADwD.)
I think just a really bad scar.
Just as I can't see the show having Tyrion lose almost his whole nose, I am not sure how they are going to do that, I am thinking a real BAD scar. I could go with the image in the books but would seems distracting visually on the TV screen.

[Abstractharmony]

I was at the Royal Exchange Theatre in Manchester on Monday getting Miltos to put his squiggle on a few things (he's started rehearsals for 'You Can't Take it With You') when I was chatting to the Theatre Manager who is good friends with Gwendoline (she appeared in Faust earlier in the year at the venue) and he was telling me that she's signed a firm multi-season deal for GOT with HBO.

Sounds like they are definitely planning on the long gterm...

[MyDogIsNamedDanerys]

George has a tendency to describe his ugly characters as like...  ridiculously, inhumanly ugly.  Like so ugly that there aren't actually any people that ugly out there.  He tends to get quite repetitive in his descriptions and so I think we start to get this idea that these ugly people are COMPLETE MONSTERS...  

Like Brienne's face was sooo ugly, it uglied up all the ugly!  ANd there was extra ugly on top.   Oh and by the way her nose was HUGE and her mouth was ugly and her teeth were crooked and overall just... yuck so ugly!   And Did I mention the ugly?  and BTW Jorah is covered in black hair.  Everywhere.  Except his head.  Because he's bald.  Because bald people are ugly, too.  Oh, and did I mention that he's ugly and hairy?  And has back hair?  And black hair on his arms.  Because, yes, ugly, hairy, balding Bear-man.  

So yeah I think it was literally impossible to cast someone ugly enough to match GRRM's description of Brienne unless it was someone with a genetic disorder or who'd had a terrible accident involving a chainsaw to the face.    Gwen will do fine.

[mediocre cheese]

Does Brienne have a genetic disorder? Or maybe a hormone growth issue. I mean she is 6'6, which would put her in the 99th percentile of height for women. Most women that tall would have odd facial features, just like most men who are 7'0 would, because its rare for a women to be that tall without having some sort of hormonal issue. The actress is substantially shorter than the character (which is true for half the cast, so its no big deal).

[Verboten]

AverageCheese, on 13 November 2011 - 10:59 PM, said:

Does Brienne have a genetic disorder? Or maybe a hormone growth issue. I mean she is 6'6, which would put her in the 99th percentile of height for women. Most women that tall would have odd facial features, just like most men who are 7'0 would, because its rare for a women to be that tall without having some sort of hormonal issue. The actress is substantially shorter than the character (which is true for half the cast, so its no big deal).

I've met women who were over six foot six and perfectly normal in regards to facial features. I'm six feet so I shop at a store for tall women and I'm actually among the shortest people there. Being tall is more common among certain ethnicities, I think, but all it really means in regards to physical defects is that it's really hard to get dress pants that don't come up over your ankles.

[Crackclaw]

I agree that it's important she be unambiguously unattractive. This doesn't necessarily mean freak show, but it's important you're not looking at Brienne and thinking "You know if she combed her hair and put on a little make-up, I'd hit it."

Brienne needs to be the ultimate example of "....ummm, she has a really nice personality..."

[mediocre cheese]

Verboten, on 13 November 2011 - 11:12 PM, said:

I've met women who were over six foot six and perfectly normal in regards to facial features. I'm six feet so I shop at a store for tall women and I'm actually among the shortest people there. Being tall is more common among certain ethnicities, I think, but all it really means in regards to physical defects is that it's really hard to get dress pants that don't come up over your ankles.

Fair enough, just with brienne I always pictured her as looking like Ulyana Semjonova (who in her youth would have been genuinely stronger than all but a small handfull of men ala brienne) than Gwendoline Christie (who looks just like a women whose taller than average, no one would ever say she's anything other than pretty)

Edited by AverageCheese, 16 November 2011 - 06:41 PM.

[Verboten]

AverageCheese, on 16 November 2011 - 06:40 PM, said:

Fair enough, just with brienne I always pictured her as looking like Ulyana Semjonova (who in her youth would have been genuinely stronger than all but a small handfull of men ala brienne) than Gwendoline Christie (who looks just like a women whose taller than average, no one would ever say she's anything other than pretty)

My biggest problem with Gwendoline Christie is her build actually. I am built like my father, I have broad shoulders, a thin waist and a muscular frame, I could bench press over 100 pounds by the time I was fifteen. I've always imagined Brienne as being built like me but taller, whereas Gwendoline is quite willowy and frankly more traditionally feminine, which I am not. You are right about Ulyana Semjonova, though she would be the perfect Brienne. (here's a close up of her face http://www.wbhof.com/semjonova.html )