171 replies to this topic

[ZacharyB]

OH MY GOD LOOK AT THAT EDDARD STARK HAHAHA HE DOESN'T HAVE A HEAD LOOK AT HIM I MEAN REALLY WHO WOULD WANT TO WALK AROUND HEADLESS HAHAHAHA BUT SERIOUSLY GUYS CMON NED IS A GREAT GUY HE'S PROBABLY THE BEST CHARACTER OF ASOIAF BUT HE WAS WAY TOO HONORABLE DON'T TRUST ME SAID LITTLEFINGER AND WHAT DOES NED DO HE TRUSTS LITTLEFINGER THAT WASN'T VERY SMART RIGHT BUT OH WELL IT WAS ALL FOR THE PLOT I'M SURE IF NED WASN'T UNDER THE CONSTRAINTS OF GRRM HE WOULD HAVE PWNED LITTLEFINGER RIGHT GUYS HAHAHAHA.

cough sneeze sneeze.

Seriously though, Eddard is probably the best character in terms of honor but...like I said, it's what killed him in the end.

[lyvyathan]

AverageCheese, on 22 November 2011 - 08:36 PM, said:

Um no. He and ser rodrik fought bronze yohn two on one and still lost.

Ned wasn't a swordsmen.

That was in the Hand's Tourney?

You're overstating your case by more than a head. Ned and friends did fight against the King's Guard in the Tower of Joy and managed to kill them, albeit he had extra help - but it wasn't overwhelming support.

While Ned the Hand may not be as good a swordsman as Jamie. That does not mean that he wasn't a good swords fighter.

Edited by lyvyathan, 23 November 2011 - 05:40 AM.

[Raksha the Demon]

daenerys snow, on 22 November 2011 - 11:14 PM, said:

given that jojen has the greensight it is possible that before he left greywater watch that a warning may have been left in regards to something about ned and howland reed, being the intelligent fellow he is, is holding ned's remains for after the conflict. [/wishing]

i'm not entirely sure lady dustin means to do what she has told reek/theon.


i especially like the part where cersei the brother fucker practically throws herself at him and is denied. very nice. the man has standards and she don't meet them.

Yes, Cersei offering her charms to Ned - the irresistible (at least in her own mind) force meets the immovable object.  I sometimes wonder what would have happened if Robert had married Lyanna as planned - would Tywin have latched onto Ned as a husband for Cersei?  Would Ned and Cersei have been good for each other; or would the Wolf and the Lioness have killed each other?

Cersei's reflex often was to offer her sexual favors as an incentive; and Ned's reflex was to do his honorable duty.  So far, honor has not, sadly, assured prosperity any more than sexual persuasion.  Ned is dead (sob!) and I doubt that Cersei will live to a ripe old age either.  

[Indigocell]

I love Eddard Stark.  I named my Skyrim character after him, because he kinda looks like a Stark, heh heh.   I think my favorite quote from DWD was one of his, it was "In this world, only winter is certain. We may lose our heads, it's true ... but what if we prevail?"

I think it's weird that anyone thought it looked like Eddard was matching Jamie in the show.  To me, it looked like Jamie had the upper hand the entire time and was just toying with Eddard, enjoying every moment.  The guard that speared his leg probably saved his life, temporarily anyway.

I like them both as characters (Eddard and Jamie) two of my favorites in the whole story, I would say.

[mediocre cheese]

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I appreciate The Ned - the second greatest of the Starks, the frozen faced fool, unyielding as ice, but that's what I love about him. He had a set of morals that he wouldn't betray for anyone no matter what the price. Even after five books his presence is still felt throughout the land. Oh and I hate Lady Dustin purely for wanting to desecrate The Ned's sacred bones. I hope he's laid to rest safely in the end and wolves eat Lady Dustin and her dogs.

Actually she has a legitimate grievance against him. Ned loved lyanna and wanted her bones to rest in winterfell, in her family crypt. The same is true for his companions and their relatives. Failing to return Lord Dustin's bones while making sure to do so for lyanna was really thoughtless of him. Why ned did this is never explained, he may have had a decent reason for it, but from lady dustin's perspective it was incredibly rude and heartless. Returning lord's dustin's bones would have been no trouble to him, but instead burying him in dorne, thousands of miles from his family crypt would be seen as disrespectful toward a loyal bannerman.

But whatever, sorry for failing to appreciate ned and his sacred bones. (what is he jesus now, that his decomposing corpse is sacred?)

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Tournaments weren't limited to just jousting. There's really nothing absurd about it.

No it is absurd. What "a man" does in a joust has nothing to do with what he'll do in a battle. That is what was shown in both the bronn-stokeworth fight and the belwas-meereenese guy fight. No warrior is going to do what they do in a tourney in a real battle, the first thing you'd do is use your lance to stab the other guys horse (in a tournament that gets you disqualified). What's equally absurd is giving this idiotic machismo-laden line to Ned, who it doesn't fit at all. Ned was a thoughtful guy who didn't brag about "fighting for real" he almost never mentioned combat. Ned's dislike of tournaments was related to its expenses, and its frivolity, not any stupid "when I fight a man for real" reason. Ned practices swords with other men, plenty of times.

Actual fitting dialogue
Ned: I don't fight in tournaments
Jaime: Why not, getting to old for it?
Ned: I don't fight in tournaments, because as someone who has seen the horrors of war, I find playing at war to be distasteful. I spend my time actually working on governing my lands, not knocking men off horses with a stick. Maybe when your older, you'll understand that.

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No it doesn't. It was one small aspect of his character, every other aspect that makes him who he is was still there.

Whatever, its opinion. I thought a pretty big aspect of Ned was that he wasn't a superficially impressive person. He was an average looking guy who was somewhat shy and not particularly charismatic or a notable fighter. He didn't inspire loyalty in the way jaime or robert did (by being famed warriors), but by being just dutiful and decent. A key aspect of him was that catelyn was initially disappointed in him because he was a smaller plainer less socially commanding version of Brandon, but that once she got to know him she found out he had a good heart (in perhaps a way brandon didn't) and appreciated that. Instead in the TV show you have LF say how Ned is even more manly than Brandon. I thought it was a fairly major change, and turned Ned into a swaggering warrior (barristan telling him how many men he killed was lame).

Edited by AverageCheese, 22 November 2011 - 11:29 PM.

[House Martell]

AverageCheese, on 22 November 2011 - 08:36 PM, said:

Um no. He and ser rodrik fought bronze yohn two on one and still lost. Ned wasn't a swordsmen.

How do we know Bronze Yohn wouldn't have wiped the floor with Jamie? Jamie was named a member of the KG and not entirely for his skill (it was also a political move by Aerys). Being a KG member automatically increases your street cred by 100x. Plus the golden armor and prototypical "knightly" looks. Contrast that with humble Ned Stark. We are told about all the battle Ned leads and wins, and Ned was not the type to lead from the rear. Plus Ned has a superior sword (The Lannisters coveted Valyerian steel). Now am I going to say without a doubt Ned would crush Jamie, No. But I would give him a fighting chance.

[daenerys snow]

ZacharyB, on 22 November 2011 - 11:19 PM, said:

OH MY GOD LOOK AT THAT EDDARD STARK HAHAHA HE DOESN'T HAVE A HEAD LOOK AT HIM I MEAN REALLY WHO WOULD WANT TO WALK AROUND HEADLESS HAHAHAHA BUT SERIOUSLY GUYS CMON NED IS A GREAT GUY HE'S PROBABLY THE BEST CHARACTER OF ASOIAF BUT HE WAS WAY TOO HONORABLE DON'T TRUST ME SAID LITTLEFINGER AND WHAT DOES NED DO HE TRUSTS LITTLEFINGER THAT WASN'T VERY SMART RIGHT BUT OH WELL IT WAS ALL FOR THE PLOT I'M SURE IF NED WASN'T UNDER THE CONSTRAINTS OF GRRM HE WOULD HAVE PWNED LITTLEFINGER RIGHT GUYS HAHAHAHA.

cough sneeze sneeze.

Seriously though, Eddard is probably the best character in terms of honor but...like I said, it's what killed him in the end.

he didn't trust him until his wife gave him that crap story of petyr's love for her and how true it was. yadda yadda yadda.

[ARYa_Nym]

Until proven otherwise I believe that he had a thing with Ashara Dayne. Even if she was dishonored 2 years before at Harrenhal that doesn't eliminate her from having something with him later on. I love the potential tragic story there.

[CrownedStag]

^{I don't think Eddard had a thing with Ashara Dayne, hopefully Martin will give us some answers if he ever addresses the nature of their relationship (if any).}

[seanbean4lyfe]

Aww Ned. I miss him so much. In my mind he will always be sean beanie and that makese it 10x worse.

Ned was so cool. He had wise words for his kids, was one honorable son of a bitch, loved his bastard...he was just awesome. He is probably one of the only people in the series i would actually wanna know.

He's the good guy greg of Westeros, TBH.

TO NED!

[Milkman34]

daenerys snow, on 22 November 2011 - 11:17 PM, said:

this is why i say he was one of the best human beings. being the best player at the game of thrones isn't as cool as being a good person who stays true to himself and his values. one is a whore the other is a man.

One is dead and the other is alive.

[Grail King]

ManyFacedOne, on 22 November 2011 - 10:52 PM, said:

I appreciate The Ned - the second greatest of the Starks, the frozen faced fool, unyielding as ice, but that's what I love about him. He had a set of morals that he wouldn't betray for anyone no matter what the price. Even after five books his presence is still felt throughout the land. Oh and I hate Lady Dustin purely for wanting to desecrate The Ned's sacred bones. I hope he's laid to rest safely in the end and wolves eat Lady Dustin and her dogs.



Tournaments weren't limited to just jousting. There's really nothing absurd about it.



No it doesn't. It was one small aspect of his character, every other aspect that makes him who he is was still there.

[/font]

They know.

Yes they do!!

[daenerys snow]

Milkman34, on 22 November 2011 - 11:51 PM, said:

One is dead and the other is alive.

and the dead one left behind a lasting legacy while the other will be forgotten (whores usually are).

as for ashara dayne, i'm one of those folks who thinks brandon was the one who "dishonoured" her and ned was the good guy who tried to set things right and possibly her shoulder to cry on. ned was too much of a big teddy wolf to have done anything else in regards to a lady.

[Milkman34]

daenerys snow, on 23 November 2011 - 12:07 AM, said:

and the dead one left behind a lasting legacy while the other will be forgotten (whores usually are).

as for ashara dayne, i'm one of those folks who thinks brandon was the one who "dishonoured" her and ned was the good guy who tried to set things right and possibly her shoulder to cry on. ned was too much of a big teddy wolf to have done anything else in regards to a lady.

Whatever you say, Game of Thrones Sansa.

[Lord of Bones]

Thank you for starting this thread - definitely long overdue. Props to one of the true decent people in the series!

And for the record, just because Jaime was a better fighter than Ned didn't mean Ned lacked badass qualities of his own. For example, he:
1) served as his own headsman, and pretty much always took the heads off with a single stroke
2) was a key leader in the rebellion that overthrew an almost 300 year old dynasty, winning many battles in the process
3) was one of the first over the walls in the charge that took out the famously fierce ironborn, on their home turf nonetheless

Not sure how you can read the books, know those facts, and come away thinking he was some kind of wuss.

[Grip]

lyvyathan, on 22 November 2011 - 11:21 PM, said:

That was in the Hand's Tourney?

I think it is when Sansa in the Vale, in AFFC, reflects on whether Bronze Yohn would recognise her..IIRC she thinks back on when Yohn came to visit Winterfell and how he defeated first Eddard and then Ser Rodrik...

Ah, found the quote:
"She could see him in the yard, a practice sword in hand, hammering her father to the ground and turning to defeat Ser Rodrik aswell"

AFFC paperback page 480.

Edited by Grip, 23 November 2011 - 12:39 AM.

[Sevumar]

Lord of Bones, on 23 November 2011 - 12:20 AM, said:

Not sure how you can read the books, know those facts, and come away thinking he was some kind of wuss.

I don't think anyone can honestly call him a wuss. He had his faults, but on the whole, he's one of the best, most honest people in the books. He was also a hard and uncompromising man from a hard land, and it's difficult to garner sympathy for that in a world where we don't have many of the concerns his character must deal with.

[daenerys snow]

Milkman34, on 23 November 2011 - 12:16 AM, said:

Whatever you say, Game of Thrones Sansa.

the name is snow. daenerys snow.

and ned is still a great man who will win the game of thrones by way of the legacy he leaves behind in the forme of his surviving children and the northmen who practically worship him.

[ManyFacedOne]

AverageCheese, on 22 November 2011 - 11:26 PM, said:

Actually she has a legitimate grievance against him. Ned loved lyanna and wanted her bones to rest in winterfell, in her family crypt. The same is true for his companions and their relatives. Failing to return Lord Dustin's bones while making sure to do so for lyanna was really thoughtless of him.

Not really. It's not like he was trying to be heartless. Lyanna was his sister after all and the main reason any of them went there in the first place. He was going to bring her back, dead or alive. Ned couldn't bring Dustin's bones back because if he did he'd have to bring back everyone else's as well. It really just wasn't practical.

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Returning lord's dustin's bones would have been no trouble to him.

It very well could've been. They were seven going there and two coming back.

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But whatever, sorry for failing to appreciate ned and his sacred bones.

You are forgiven.

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No warrior is going to do what they do in a tourney in a real battle, the first thing you'd do is use your lance to stab the other guys horse (in a tournament that gets you disqualified).

Unless of course, one tries the deadlier approach of using that lance to stab the other guy.

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I thought it was a fairly major change, and turned Ned into a swaggering warrior (barristan telling him how many men he killed was lame).

I forget. When did Barristan tell him this?

[voodooqueen126]

daenerys snow, on 23 November 2011 - 12:36 AM, said:

the name is snow. daenerys snow.

and ned is still a great man who will win the game of thrones by way of the legacy he leaves behind in the forme of his surviving children and the northmen who practically worship him.

He is saying that you are naive and idealistic like Sansa was in A Game of Thrones.