145 replies to this topic

[Arkantos]

Aemon, he had the weight of the world on his shoulders at many points in his life, he could've saved so many lives and had to live with that guilt for so long (he was friggin old) and just when he found something to live for, he died.
Sucks to be Aemon.

[Grip]

Another contender gotta be Lady Hornwood who got locked in a tower and starved to death. After she tried to eat her fingers..I felt so sorry for that poor woman. She also lost her son and husband to the war, but still remained loyal and came when called upon. I liked the flirting between her and Rodrik, well atleast she went for it, so what Ramsay did to her was somehow even more cruel. I thought things would turn out better for her. Another reason I guess for why I want to see Roose, admittedly not a saint, kill Ramsay..

[Alia of the knife]

Raksha the Demon, on 24 November 2011 - 09:45 AM, said:

The one thing that keeps me from liking Jon Connington is his plan to "end the Usurper's line for good and all"; which sounds to me like a desire to do to Tommen and Myrcella (and possibly Robert's bastards as well) what was done to Rhaenys and the infant presumed to be her brother.  He could at least get the Iron Throne before making up his mind to murder innocent children.  

Well, if he lives long enough to ever lay eyes on Arya, he'll probably have a heart attack since at that point, she'll be about the same age as Lyanna was, and is said to look like her.

Edited by Alia of the knife, 24 November 2011 - 02:08 PM.

[Buckwheat]

I pity most of those already mentioned: Brienne, Shireen, Theon, Jeyne Poole, Gilly, Catelyn, Brandon, Lady Hornwood, Gared, Penny etc.

Tris Botley, his family was killed by Euron and he lost his lands because of him, the girl he loves despises him and he is an overall pitiful figure.

Doran Martell, he is in constant pain because of his gout.

Lady, because she died so young, executed for attacking Joffrey which she has not done.

I even pitied Cersei in her last ADWD chapter.

Edited by Buckwheat, 24 November 2011 - 04:20 PM.

[Ser Tom]

Theon, He deserved a trip to the block after what he did to Winterfell but Ramsey's treatment of him is just inhuman. If you'd have told me before I read dance that I'd think that I wouldn't have believed it. When Bran talks to him through the weirwood it kills me, felt so sorry for them both.

[Ice Turtle]

Elia and Rhaenys
Lady Hornwood
Rickard Kastark for some reason

[The Oncoming Storm]

Oh, seconded Cressen. Poor, loyal old man, and Stannis let him be humiliated. I totally cried. Maybe the only prologue guy who I felt sorry for.

Quentyn. He just needs a hug.

Theon and Jeyne. They're really beyond repair.

Doran. He keeps losing his family members in awful ways while he's constantly is pain.

Jorah. With all his flaws, he's not a bad man and fate just slapped him through ADWD.

Bowen. I think he hated what he had to do, and he'll end badly.

Ilyn Payne. He lives in horrible circumstances and he's completely lonely. I kinda began to like him in AFfC.

Poor little Shireen.

Sandor. He suffered so much, I really hope he can at least kill UnGregor. He'd even deserve a happy ending after all the shit he went through.

Stannis. He denies himself any joy and all he wanted was to get some love and respect, and his brothers spent their life trolling him. And then he's married to Selyse. Good that at least he has Davos.

And Davos. He lost four sons in the most horrible way imaginable and since then he keeps getting in dark jails. A wonder he's still alive, it's not easy to be an honourable man on Westeros...

[Val the Wildling Princess]

Theon, I hated him with a passion, then I felt so sorry for him, now I kinda love him.

Davos, he's one of my favorite characters and it breaks my heart the way he is losing his family

Jon, but that's because he is my favorite, my spoiled child and I hate it when someone treats him bad or calls him bastard.

Brienne, being remembered how ugly she is every freaking time.

Viserys, can't exactly explain why I liked him but the golden crown scene made me hate Daenerys for not doing anything at all.

Edited by Val the Wildling Princess, 24 November 2011 - 07:15 PM.

[Glyn Tarvoke]

2661eire, on 23 November 2011 - 11:41 PM, said:

By the way, what real disease or malady is "greyscale" supposed to represent?  I tried to find something similar on the Internet, but there's too much medical jargon.

My guess is that its a tweaked version of leprosy.  The grey plague?  A tweaked version of the black plague.

[Glyn Tarvoke]

Characters I feel sorry for:

Harrion Karstack--Keeps losing battles and being captured.

Jon Snow

Quentyn Martell--sent to a) enforce a contract which does not mention him or Dany; and to woo a beautiful young princess, a job for which his father should know he is not well suited.  Thought it was a bad idea the first QM POV chapter I read.

[The King in the South]

Besides the obvious (Theon, the Starks, etc)

I'd say Viserys. Grew up his entire life being mocked, and delusioned (but not necessarily by his own fault) that something was his, and then never being able to gain that something. He was used, betrayed, and yes he was mad, but can you blame him? It didn't help that he probably has incestual defects

[ZacharyB]

SeanF, on 24 November 2011 - 07:29 AM, said:

I think that's hard to sustain.  He loved Daenerys so much that he beat and tormented her;  sold her to Khal Drogo at the age of 13;  told her he'd happily see Drogo's warriors and horses fuck her if it gave him an army; attempted to rape her the night before her wedding to Drogo, and disregarded every bit of advice she gave him about how to survive among the Dothraki.  And, Daenerys was far from pitiless when he got "crowned".  There was just nothing she could do.

ADWD, Daenerys's final chapter (can't be bothered to find the actual number), pg 937-938 if you want specifics:

"Viserys looked just as he had the last time she'd seen him. HIs mouth was twisted in angish, his hair was burnt, and his face was black and smoking where the molten gold had run down across his brow and cheeks and into his eyes."
'You are dead," Dany said.
Murdered. Though his lips never moved, somehow she could hear his voice, whispering in her ear. You never mourned me, sister. It is hard to die unmourned.
"I loved you once."
Once, he said, so bitterly it made her shudder. You were supposed to be my wife, to bear me children with silver hair and puple eyes, to keep the blood of the dragon pure. I took care of you. I taught you who you were. I fed you. I sold our mother's crown to keep you fed.
'You hurt me. You frightened me.'
Only when you woke the dragon. I loved you."

A powerful passage. I never felt sympathy for Viserys until it. He's a twisted man, as I said, but you can't say he didn't love her.

ETA: While I agree there was nothing Dany could do for Viserys, if you read the scene, Dany shows no remorse or pity for Viserys whatsoever. I'm not going to put the whole thing up (don't have any of the books on PDF for quick copy/paste unfortunately), but the last sentence of the chapter pretty much says it all. "'He was no dragon,' Dany thought, curiously calm. 'Fire cannot kill a dragon.'"

Edited by ZacharyB, 25 November 2011 - 02:04 AM.

[Ser Gei]

Raksha the Demon, on 24 November 2011 - 09:45 AM, said:

The one thing that keeps me from liking Jon Connington is his plan to "end the Usurper's line for good and all"; which sounds to me like a desire to do to Tommen and Myrcella (and possibly Robert's bastards as well) what was done to Rhaenys and the infant presumed to be her brother.  He could at least get the Iron Throne before making up his mind to murder innocent children.  

You're right, but I kind of forgive him here, after all Robert did kill his beloved prince and stole the throne for himself. No wonder the man has some bitterness towards Baratheons. And I don't think Jon C. means - or even has to - pull off something that would result in "The Rains of Baratheon". If he gets Aegon in the game, and the truth about Tommens and Myrcellas parenthood is revealed, Usurper's line constists merely of black-haired bastards, scattered all over Westeros, and only Edric is acknowledged as Roberts bastard.

But, of course, Jon C. does not know that, and his words could then mean he plans to kill Tommen and Myrcella. Actually, in a way that kind of shows how much he cared for Rhaegar, and makes me feel more sorry for him. That poor old fruitcake, stirring in his closet full of bitterness and hate, plus the greyscale.

[Reekrhymeswithgeek]

One of the best things about ASOIAF is the way that almost any character can be a figure of pity at different moments. I never thought I'd be shedding tears for Theon or even Cersei in ADWD! Can't imagine anyone has or will weep into their pillows for Ramsay Bolton though... He's just misunderstood!

[Bear Grylls of Skagos]

Rickon Stark :-/ The most obvious answer IMO.
Doran
Arya Stark
Sansa.

[SeanF]

Zachary B, but in fact Viserys' reproaches in ADWD don't actually match the events of AGOT.  If that really is Visery's spirit talking to Daenerys, then he's as delusional in death as he was in life.  If it's Daenerys having a hallucination, then it's a misleading one.

Viserys certainly lusted after Daenerys, but there's no evidence he loved her.  And it's certainly not true that she never mourned him either.  Indeed, AGOT says specifically that her memory of Viserys rejoicing at being offered a golden crown remained a poignant memory for the rest of her life.

[Evamitchelle]

SeanF, on 25 November 2011 - 05:24 AM, said:

Zachary B, but in fact Viserys' reproaches in ADWD don't actually match the events of AGOT.  If that really is Visery's spirit talking to Daenerys, then he's as delusional in death as he was in life.  If it's Daenerys having a hallucination, then it's a misleading one.

Viserys certainly lusted after Daenerys, but there's no evidence he loved her.  And it's certainly not true that she never mourned him either.  Indeed, AGOT says specifically that her memory of Viserys rejoicing at being offered a golden crown remained a poignant memory for the rest of her life.

He did take care of her all her life, even if he was far from being the perfect brother. Since Dany barely has any memories of her time with Willem Darry besides the fact that the door was red and that there was a lemon tree he most likely died when she was 3-5 years old, meaning that Viserys was 12-14 himself when they were thrown out of Darry's mansion and forced to beg for food and lodging. I doubt Dany could help in any way so Viserys had to do everything by himself while being mocked by everybody because of it.

So when he says "I took care of you. I taught you who you were. I fed you. I sold our mother's crown to keep you fed." it's entirely true. He kept them both fed and lodged for over 10 years and Dany remembers that he was the one who told her stories about the Seven Kingdoms and their family.

Dany definitely killed him, though she had (somewhat) valid reasons to do so, and didn't mourn him much beyond naming one of her dragons after him "so he could be everything Viserys wasn't (paraphrasing here), what a nice sentiment !

Everything Viserys says in that passage Zachary B quoted is entirely correct.

Edited by Evamitchelle, 25 November 2011 - 11:03 AM.

[Alexia]

I don't think it is at all accurate to say that Dany killed him.  She and Jorah panicked and tried to stop him from what he was doing.  She begged him to put away his sword and come sit next to her.  She couldn't stop Drogo from what he did, after Viserys publically declared his intention to cut out the bastard and leave it for Drogo when he takes her back because Drogo didn't pay for her.

How did she kill him, by accurately translating his words into Dothraki?

[Evamitchelle]

While she tried to prevent Viserys from doing something stupid at first she didn't do anything to stop Drogo from killing him. In a show it's rather clear that they make some sort of agreement to carry out with Viserys' execution but there are some indications in the books too. "When the sun of her life reached her, Dany slid an arm around his waist" doesn't really seem to indicate any kind of opposition on her part. She doesn't say anything when his bloodriders break Viserys' arm and beat him into submission, or when Drogo starts melting the gold of his belt to burn her brother alive. He's already been convinced to go to war with the Seven Kingdoms by her, crossing a sea that he considers cursed/unlucky/evil but he won't try and save her brother if she asks him ?

Edited by Evamitchelle, 25 November 2011 - 11:16 AM.

[SeanF]

Evamitchelle, on 25 November 2011 - 11:02 AM, said:

He did take care of her all her life, even if he was far from being the perfect brother. Since Dany barely has any memories of her time with Willem Darry besides the fact that the door was red and that there was a lemon tree he most likely died when she was 3-5 years old, meaning that Viserys was 12-14 himself when they were thrown out of Darry's mansion and forced to beg for food and lodging. I doubt Dany could help in any way so Viserys had to do everything by himself while being mocked by everybody because of it.

So when he says "I took care of you. I taught you who you were. I fed you. I sold our mother's crown to keep you fed." it's entirely true. He kept them both fed and lodged for over 10 years and Dany remembers that he was the one who told her stories about the Seven Kingdoms and their family.

Dany definitely killed him, though she had (somewhat) valid reasons to do so, and didn't mourn him much beyond naming one of her dragons after him "so he could be everything Viserys wasn't (paraphrasing here), what a nice sentiment !

Everything Viserys says in that passage Zachary B quoted is entirely correct.

Viserys did look after her, because he saw her as his ticket back to Westeros.  He beat her and abused her;  sold her to a barbarian warlord at the age of 13 in return for an army; threatened her with dire punishment if she failed to please Drogo; told her that he'd happily let every one Drogo's men (and their horses) rape her;  had to be prevented by Illyrio from raping her on the night before her wedding; tried to assault her out on the Dothraki Sea;  tried to assault her when she invited him for dinner and set out various gifts for him;  disregarded every bit of advice that she and Jorah gave him to survive among the Dothraki;  tried to steal her dragon eggs; threatened her life in front of Drogo, Drogo's men, and the other Khals.

She in turn did everything he asked of her, prior to her marriage; stopped Qharo from cutting his ear off; talked Drogo into giving him a horse again; invited him for dinner, to offer him gifts and advice; frantically tried to dissuade him from threatening Drogo; offered him the dragon eggs; repeated his demand to Drogo after he'd threatend her life and that of the unborn child.

She displayed the patience of a saint towards Viserys, and he threw his own life away.

I haven't seen the HBO series, so I can't comment on their portrayal of it - but I think it's clear in the book that Daenerys didn't kill him.  I do think she thought she'd done everything she could to save him.  Drogo might have forgiven his threats towards him, her, and the unborn child had they been made in private, but never after they'd been made in front of his men and fellow Khals.

Edited by SeanF, 25 November 2011 - 12:02 PM.