The greatest comic writers?

[Sci-2]

Just curious about comic writers people think have made great strides in the medium. Right now my thinking is Grant Morrison is at the top for current Western writers, followed by Alan Moore.

Morrison I think has more risk taking in his body of work, tries to see what the medium can accomplish. Moore I think writes really good books, but I at least don't know if his use of panels is all that innovative.

(Obviously there is a challenge here as sometimes we don't know if the writer or artist is suggesting layout.)

I feel the need to include Gaiman somewhere in there, but I do think of him largely as a one-hit wonder with Sandman.

I'll try to write more reasons later today, but I am really curious about manga that people might have read as I've watched a lot of anime but have little manga exposure.

[Errant Bard]

Significant for the medium itself?

Well, for manga, there clearly is a before and after Tezuka, just as there is before and after Hergé. However the medium stays within the codified boundaries for everyone, nowadays, or so it feels.

[Rob B]

Frank Miller did some really interesting things before he went batshit insane (His Batman stuff of course, but not be overlooked is a fine little SF series Martha Washington with Dave Gibbons).

Mark Waid is very good and when hes good, he is superb. He had great long-term runs on The Flash, Captain America, and Fantastic Four, plus the superb Kingdom Come and Empire (The premise-If Doctor Doom defeated superman and took over the world)

Brian K. Vaughan wrote one of the absolute best apocalyptic SF comics, if not ever, then in recent years: Y: The Last Man.

Kurt Busiek has written some terrific superhero (Marvels, Avengers, Superman: Secret Identity, Astro City) and non superhero stuff (Arrowsmith World War I with dragons and magic).

Lets not forget some of the older guard like Stan the Man and Gardner Fox.

[polishgenius]

It's a shame that Grant Morrison seems to have lost the concept of writing discipline. He seems to just pile as many ideas as he can into a given work now, leading to them drowning each other out.

Anyway; Warren Ellis. He (along with Bryan Hitch) pretty much invented the widescreen method of superhero comics which pretty much dominates the genre now. He's also a major pusher of science fiction in the western non-superhero canon; there's loads and loads of fantasy of various stripes, but SF has been quite rare until Bryan K Vaughan and Jonathan Hickman rolled up.

Also, he tailors his writing very carefully to the artist, an underrated aspect of his work that I think is quite brilliant and other writers could do more of. Hence compare the more straightforward, often freeze-frame imagery Hitch deals with in the Authority, and things like conversations often taking place on the move amongst spectacular backgrounds, to Thunderbolts with Deodato Jr; a similar case of an action-heavy widescreen comic but, because Deodato is more comfortable mixing things up, there's a lot more opportunity for him to do clever things with the panels and images and conversations often take place in rooms, with heavy use of meaningful closeups and out-of-panel backgrounds and things.

As a result, both artists produced maybe the best work of their careers... certainly the defining one for Hitch.

Hickman, by the way, is going to be truly major. If you think Morrison is doing strange new things with the format of the medium you haven't read The Nightly News (which, I'm guessing by sciborg's comment in the post below this, you have)

Btw, I think you're under-estimating Moore's cleverness in manipulating the medium. Sure, the images of his artists are often panelbound and that, but Watchmen for example is written in a way that could not viably be done in another medium without majorly distracting from the flow of the work - the way key elements are hidden in the background, the text inserts, the quick-flicks through story threads, panel-to-panel - sure, you could recreate them on screen, but you'd end up either having to be really obvious or lack clarity.

[Sci-2]

great post polishgenius! -> sadly I think part of it got cut off. I agree with you about Hickman.

Part of me wants to argue that Morrison's JLA led the way for widescreen, but memory is faulty here and I might be inaccurate. I do agree Ellis has done some great things and you've inspired me to go back and see this harmonizing with the artist. I think single issues of Planetary and some of his other series mark him as a great, sort of Borges of comics, but I've had problems with Planetary and Gravel as a narrative whole.

I'm curious what work you are thinking of when you say Morrison is just piling ideas and has lost discipline. If it is Final Crisis I'd argue the opposite -> It is a "failure" but only that it reached so high. What impressed me was the way that the final issue reads like a comic poem in its myriad shifts and that the story justifies this via the shattering and recreation of Time.

Don't get me wrong, Moore and Morrison often switch in my head. I think with Morrison we see more original work rather than adaptation, and I think things like We3 make such good use of panels and the breaking down of time into discrete moments.

There is also something to be said, as you point out, for the disciplined craftmanship Moore brings to the table.

[Sci-2]

The Nightly News

Been awhile, need to reread. I may have missed an issue here or there in the...six?

[polishgenius]

I haven't read Gravel. My big problem with Planetary is that the last volume is clearly a rush-job to finish the comic that various issues with both Ellis and Cassaday timetables disrupted, and while it's okay there's things in there that were clearly meant to take much longer to develop (like the petal/flower thing).

I think you're right in Morrison's being the leader for widescreen, looking at the dates; The Authority really pushed the boat out though and is generally credited with being the instigator of the decompressed comic in American publishing.

Final Crisis is indeed one of the things that I'm talking about; a specific example is the moment when

Lex and Superman team up to fight Darkseid. This should have been a BIG moment. Instead it's thrown away on a handful of panels in the bottom corner of a page.

There's quite a few moments like that; could have been awesome, but are blown by because Morrison has to fit everything into x number of pages. Even that final issue; I agree that it's a brilliant idea and atmosphere, but it could have been three or four times as long. He's built up so many plot threads through the Crisis that he virtually has to bullet point it; almost no aspect gets more than a page.

He told virtually the same story in JLA: Rock of Ages, and imo, because it focuses on less characters and doesn't have all that stuff about the monitors, I thought it was much better. And less unclear.

Seven Soldiers suffers from a similar issue though; each of those could pretty much have been a miniseries on its own (I was also irked by Morrison basically hiding the Final Crisis lead-in there, rather than it being Countdown like it was supposed to be- and then weaving in plot strands from other comics of his that you wouldn't understand if you hadn't read them, some of them downright obscure; like a plot he did on JLA Classified that introduced the sentient universe which I read completely by accident). I'd have loved to have read the Zatanna plot on its own, for example.

Some of his Batman stuff also has the issue, though much less and I do like him allowing his insanity into the mainstream like that. Although I thought Batman Inc. was a dreadful idea... that's a separate issue.

[polishgenius]

Been awhile, need to reread. I may have missed an issue here or there in the...six?

Six, yeah.

I really need to read more of his stuff. Not really had the chance to yet.

[Chise]

I feel the need to include Gaiman somewhere in there, but I do think of him largely as a one-hit wonder with Sandman.

no love for his Marvel 1602 book? It was a fun lil X-men trip that wasn't a generic reboot of zombies and clones

I read too much manga, so my vote goes to Rumiko Takahashi. Her stuff is hilarious, serious for 5 seconds when need be, and boy can she turn out chapters weekly!

[Jaxom 1974]

Anyway; Warren Ellis. He (along with Bryan Hitch) pretty much invented the widescreen method of superhero comics which pretty much dominates the genre now. He's also a major pusher of science fiction in the western non-superhero canon; there's loads and loads of fantasy of various stripes, but SF has been quite rare until Bryan K Vaughan and Jonathan Hickman rolled up.

Ellis should be pretty much amongst the top five in the modern pantheon.

I don't argue that some of Planetary at the end had that rushed feeling, and that's a shame, but it is stil, as a whole, one of the better things to see the light of day in the last 10-15 years.

I've started a re-read of Bendis' Powers from the start and it's remarkable how much I really did like his noir stuff before he got his hands on Marvel and re-set everything there like he did.

Terry Moore, especially with Strangers in Paradise, is also a favorite of mine and I think he's underrated overall.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Anyway; Warren Ellis. He (along with Bryan Hitch) pretty much invented the widescreen method of superhero comics which pretty much dominates the genre now. He's also a major pusher of science fiction in the western non-superhero canon; there's loads and loads of fantasy of various stripes, but SF has been quite rare until Bryan K Vaughan and Jonathan Hickman rolled up.

Seconded. If you haven't read Transmetroplolitan by Ellis and Darick Robertson, do yourself a favor and run out and grab it. Extremely funny and moving stuff.

I'd also throw Garth Ennis's hat into the ring. His stuff on HellBlazer is unparalleled in the Horror genre. Also enjoy his early work on The Boys and The Punisher.

He probably doesn't belong on the alltime greatest list, but I've really been enjoying Jason Aaron's work of late, particularly on the book Scalped.

[peterbound]

Bendis, fuck ya

And how the fuck can you call Gaiman a one trick pony? Even if it was just his Sandman run, that's a helluva fucking run.

I'll jump on the Moore/Ennis bandwagon. Great shit. I love me some Swampthing and Preacher.

[Sci-2]

And how the fuck can you call Gaiman a one trick pony? Even if it was just his Sandman run, that's a helluva fucking run.

I like his other stuff, but I meant in discussion of the greatest writers in the medium. Sandman is his only work that I would posit even his mention in the top five to ten.

ETA: I'm also not sure how much Sandman's greatest is reliant on its being a comic, as opposed to Watchmen and varied Grant Morrison works which I think combine use of panels as well as narrative. That doesn't detract from Sandman's storyline though.

But yes, it is an incredible work in lots of ways, though I found Seasons of Mists resolution a little too gimmicky...to the point I think it guts the grandeur of the entire narrative.

ETA II: I am ignorant of magna save for brief mentions in Understand Comics by Scott McCloud. What makes Tezuka so important? Thanks!

[dornish prince]

no love for his Marvel 1602 book? It was a fun lil X-men trip that wasn't a generic reboot of zombies and clones

I read too much manga, so my vote goes to Rumiko Takahashi. Her stuff is hilarious, serious for 5 seconds when need be, and boy can she turn out chapters weekly!

i was reading some ranma 1/2 just the other day. a little repetitive over the long haul but who cares...i love the stuff. i'll also agree with the mention of warren ellis. he's prolific, has great range, works pacing very well and just overall spins one helluva yarn. i've been planning to reread ocean and black summer and recently reread fell. top notch.

[Garlan the Gallant]

My top 5 is a mixed bag (in no particular order):

Alex Robinson (Box Office Poison, Too Cool To Be Forgotten, Tricked)

Warren Ellis (Planetary, Transmetropolitan, The Authority, Freakangels, Gravel, Scars, Crecy, No Hero, Black Summer, Global Frequency, SVK, Newuniversal, Orbiter, Jack Cross, Fell, Ministry of Space, DV8, Stormwatch, Desolation Jones, Ocean, Switchblade Honey)

Hiroki Endo (Eden: It's an Endless World)

David Mazzucchelli (Asterious Polyp, Rubber Blanket, City of Glass)

Tom Siddell (Gunnerkrigg Court)

[The Imp's Advocate]

Tom Siddell (Gunnerkrigg Court)

Certainly. I don't see him mentioned around here very often, but what he has done with Gunnerkrigg Court is really quite astounding. He's developed such a personal and immersive world. Writing and drawing it himself for so long takes stamina, and if we're basing our judgements on "risk-taking", "trying to see what the medium can accomplish", and especially "innovative use of panels", Tom has a case.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

David Mazzucchelli (Asterious Polyp, Rubber Blanket, City of Glass)

Loved his run on Daredevil. Beautiful work.

[Kalbear]

Waid, Ennis, Ellis, Whedon, Vaughn, Bendis,

Distinctly not: Millar.

On the fence: Morrison; his work where he can do whatever is awesome (Invisibles), but when he's restrained by having to do superhero stuff (JLA, X-men) it's pretty crap.

honorable mention: I love Matt Fraction, especially when he can do his own thing like 5 fists of science.

[LuisDantas]

Call me old-fashioned, but I enjoy Roy Thomas more than Morrison, perhaps even Moore. Steve Englehart at his peak is also among the best there are. The Avengers/Defenders War of the 1970s is very hard to surpass. Roy Thomas was in a class all of his own when it comes to Conan stories or golden age revivals - and his 1960s Avengers are all too unfairly overlooked, despite being perhaps the best the team ever had.

[Galactus]

No love for Christin, Goscinny, etc.?