53 replies to this topic

[Dracarya]

This has been driving me absolutely nuts tonight, so I just had to get it out there. Possible ASOS spoilers, and sorry if this has been discussed before, couldn't find anything.

So, who the hell is she?
On my reread of ASOS, Aryas' chapter where she goes to Stoney Sept with the outlaws really jumped out at me. I missed it the first time round, no change there. Anyway, here's why I'm asking this:

1. Hoster Tully mentions a Tansy and forgiveness in his pain-and-milk-of-the-poppy-induced sleep. Catelyn hears him, but doesn't know of a Tansy, and Hoster no longer seems to be capable of a coherent conversation. She asks the maester (whose name escapes me) if he had heard of her, but he says no. Did he go on to ask anyone else and give Catelyn an answer? I didn't think he did.

2. In the Arya chapter of ASOS (about mid-way through the first book, damn UK paperbacks), we meet a Tansy. I can only assume it's the same one, right? She is described several times as "red-haired", which to me seems a blatant drop-in, now I noticed it. Catelyn and Lysa are both red-haired, so could Tansy be a daughter or relation of Hosters?

3. From the way she is, I assume Tansy is around 30 years old, so being Hosters daughter is a possibility. Do we learn more about her in later books, anything I've yet to come across on my reread? She seems like the madam of the prostitutes, though she's described as a serving wench.

4. This brings me onto Bella, a prostitute in the Peach where we meet Tansy. She tells Gendry and Arya that she might be Roberts' bastard, and the wiki says that she is an unacknowledged bastard of his. She claims that her mother was a favourite of Roberts' before/during the Battle of the Bells. So my question is, who is her mother? Do we know? Is it Tansy?

Again, sorry if this has been hashed out already, and if all my questions are answered in the later books, but I failed to see it the first time round, I'll shut up and just read on patiently. I don't know if Tansy is even significant, but you know what it's like to have burning questions

[Maester Hodor]

Tansy is a plant or something used to induce abortions.

Hoster Tully is saying Tansy because he regrets making Lysa take it to abort Littlefingers kid.

And afterward we know that Lysa isn't good at giving kids anymore, so the tansy potion might have had something to do with that, which would make Hoster Tulley even more remorseful

[Ryjacork]

^ This

[Guynemer]

Thirded.

[ServantOnIce]

Fourthed . .

[Arch-MaesterPhilip]

Even though it's not on topic does anyone else think Littlefinger is Sweet Robin's father and not Jon Arryn?

[The King in the South]

Arch-MaesterPhilip, on 20 February 2012 - 08:28 PM, said:

Even though it's not on topic does anyone else think Littlefinger is Sweet Robin's father and not Jon Arryn?

One of the theories I support the most

[Jadiecat]

Storm of Swords is full of tansies!

The "tansy" of Lord Hoster Tully's death chatter does appear to refer to the plant, like the other posters said, which can help induce a miscarriage when ingested. (It sounds like it's more effective for that purpose in their world than it is in ours). 

Lysa says as much, before littleFinger gives her the moon door heave-ho. She tells Sansa and Petyr that she was given an abortion inducing cocktail that included tansy to terminate her pregnancy (LF being the presumptive father; the pregnancy would have occurred shortly before she married Jon Arryn).

Tansy is mentioned in the prologue as one of the flowers Chett picked for Bessa, before he stabbed her. The plant is mentioned again, in a Samwell chapter, as part of a maester's arsenal. And Lady Smallwood chides Tom Sevenstrings that all the maids he seduces are drinking tansy tea.

I think it's funny that Tansy, the proprietess we're introduced to at the Peach/Stoney Sept Inn, has red hair (is that a little red herring joke?).

Tansy the innkeep may show  up again. Another Tansy appears (in A Feast for Crows) as an orphan at the Cross Roads Inn.
 
But I'm going to be especially attuned to "Tansy" as a girl's name because of Tanselle Too-Tall. Tanselle is a character in the Dunk and Egg tales, and it seems clear that she'll play an even bigger role in tales to come. And plenty of stuff that happened back in those days is still rippling in the "present" day of ASoIaF. One of these or future Tansies might be somehow related.

So I will keep my eyes open for Tansy as a name OR a plant.

And by the way, Maester Vyman was SO BS'ing Catelyn with his lame false brain racking that Tansy might have been an old cobbler widow. He's a maester, he knows exactly what the Hoster was raving about.  

[Dracarya]

I know what tansy is, but Tansy is also a name. I just find it funny that while Arya is searching for Riverrun, they meet a Tansy. And Catelyn took the "Tansy" her father was mumbling about to be a woman, not a thing. Very interesting, but so many of you think that he was thinking about the plant, fair enough.

Jadiecat, I also noticed Sam mention tansy in Maester Aemons' bags that they left on the Fist. What else is it used for?
The problem with rereads is that everything seems significant

Does anyone have any idea about Bella? Crackpottery - if this red-haired (yes, I think this is significant, considering how many times it's dropped into that one chapter) Tansy is Hosters' daughter, say, and Bella is her daughter, that makes the kid a Tully and Baratheon bastard. Good thing Gendry didn't let her "ring his bells"

[Buckwheat]

I believe that Tansy at the Stoney Sept and Cat thinking about Tansy as a person are only red herrings. I do not believe that Tansy is Hoster's daughter, even though she has red hair.

And why would it be any more disgusting if Bella were a Tully, not only a Baratheon? Gendry is a Baratheon, but he has no connection to the Tullys. It is enough with him and Bella being Baratheons - good thing they did not sleep together - if she were a Tully bastard too, it would make no difference.

[the Remarkable Other]

Buckwheat, on 21 February 2012 - 07:01 AM, said:

I believe that Tansy at the Stoney Sept and Cat thinking about Tansy as a person are only red herrings. I do not believe that Tansy is Hoster's daughter, even though she has red hair.

And why would it be any more disgusting if Bella were a Tully, not only a Baratheon? Gendry is a Baratheon, but he has no connection to the Tullys. It is enough with him and Bella being Baratheons - good thing they did not sleep together - if she were a Tully bastard too, it would make no difference.

This.

[Dracarya]

Buckwheat, on 21 February 2012 - 07:01 AM, said:

I believe that Tansy at the Stoney Sept and Cat thinking about Tansy as a person are only red herrings. I do not believe that Tansy is Hoster's daughter, even though she has red hair.

And why would it be any more disgusting if Bella were a Tully, not only a Baratheon? Gendry is a Baratheon, but he has no connection to the Tullys. It is enough with him and Bella being Baratheons - good thing they did not sleep together - if she were a Tully bastard too, it would make no difference.

That wasn't what I meant. Of course it's disgusting that they're both Baratheons, and Tully has nothing to do with that, but I was just supposing.

I can see my ideas are not wanted. Oki dokie, I shall puzzle them out on my own in future.

[Grail King]

The King in the South, on 20 February 2012 - 08:29 PM, said:

One of the theories I support the most

I think so, and if he off his son he is a kin-slayer in the eyes of the gods which is good for us bad for LF.

ETA: realized quoted the wrong person I agree with Arch-MaesterPhilip

Edited by Grail King, 21 February 2012 - 02:40 PM.

[Apple Martini]

As said, "tansy" is an ingredient in moontea.

Tansy the lady is a red herring.

And I love the idea that Baelish is Robert's father but I'd be shocked if it ever came out.

Edited by Apple Martini, 21 February 2012 - 03:13 PM.

[Winter's Knight]

Apple Martini, on 21 February 2012 - 02:40 PM, said:

As said, "tansy" is an ingredient in moontea.

Tansy the lady is a red herring.

And I love the idea that Baelish is Jon's father but I'd be shocked if it ever came out.

I pray that you mean LF is Robert's father.

[Dracarya]

Apple Martini, on 21 February 2012 - 02:40 PM, said:

As said, "tansy" is an ingredient in moontea.

Tansy the lady is a red herring.

And I love the idea that Baelish is Jon's father but I'd be shocked if it ever came out.

She's definitely a red herring? Well, thank you Martin, for making me obsess over something that clearly means nothing

Yeah,you mean Robert right? Is that possible?

[Apple Martini]

Fire&Blood, on 21 February 2012 - 02:52 PM, said:

She's definitely a red herring? Well, thank you Martin, for making me obsess over something that clearly means nothing

Yeah,you mean Robert right? Is that possible?

Yes, I mean Robert, sorry.

I've been getting names mixed up lately for some reason. I type ungodly fast and my mind lapses. It makes the Blackfyre Daeron-Daemon threads a bitch.

Edited by Apple Martini, 21 February 2012 - 03:14 PM.

[Ser Ilyn's Tongue]

Even if Tansy the woman is a red herring in regard to Hoster's last words, is it possible that she could still be a Tully bastard?  It's not unusual for high Lords to sire bastards but it would be kind of ironic considering the Tully words and Catelyn's views on bastards.

Also, Robert Arryn actually being Robert Baelish would be a good twist.  I'd expect LF to have realised or figured it out already... but you never know.

[Lady Octarina]

I think it's possible Robert is LF's son, but Petyr is most likely trying to conceal the idea from himself to kill the boy with no remorse. Or would he even care?

Though I agree with this theory, I don't know why it's so appealing. Perhaps the notion that someone like Jon Arryn would have such a sickly son? It's Lysa's (or rather, Hoster Tully's) fault either way that the boy is like that, both biologically and in his behavior.

[Arch-MaesterPhilip]

Lady Octarina, on 21 February 2012 - 07:58 PM, said:

I think it's possible Robert is LF's son, but Petyr is most likely trying to conceal the idea from himself to kill the boy with no remorse. Or would he even care?

Though I agree with this theory, I don't know why it's so appealing. Perhaps the notion that someone like Jon Arryn would have such a sickly son? It's Lysa's (or rather, Hoster Tully's) fault either way that the boy is like that, both biologically and in his behavior.

That's why I started thinking about it. I don't think he would father a sickly child. It's possible but I tend to think a son of his would be strong. And I think a few of the times Lysa miscarried she was drinking moon tea to terminate Littlefinger induced pregnancies. Repeated use of Moon Tea may also cause side effects.