Raksha the Demon, on 26 February 2012 - 08:10 AM, said:
Did the real (as opposed to the version seen in the TV show The Tudors) Anne Boleyn actually want to breastfeed baby Elizabeth but was prevented by Henry?
Yes, that and numerous other factors suggest that Anne B. was an excellent and loving mother to Elizabeth. A large part of the reason for Anne's rather callous behavior towards Mary (who Anne did treat quite badly in real life) was because the girl, so long as she refused to recognize Anne or Elizabeth, was a threat to Elizabeth in Anne's eyes.
BlackTalon, on 26 February 2012 - 02:08 AM, said:
I believe it is unfair to slam Robert as a horrible father, just remember young Robert with little Mya in the Vale, he couldn't get enough of playing and spending time with her. He would have been a much better father even to Cersei´s children if she hadn´t done her very best to estrange them.
This continued insistence that Robert B. was-- or totally would have been-- a decent father but was prevented from doing so by the wicked Cersei simply does not add up with the facts as we know them. Let's review:
1. Accusation: Robert would have loved his kids, but Cersei never let him.
False. Cersei testifies that Robert was reluctant to hold his kids, was neglectful from the beginning.
2. Accusation: Robert was naturally a great dad, but Cersei ruined it. His actions with Mya prove it.
False. Robert, when a young man, "doted" on his cute, fun little daughter, constantly stopping by to play with her and have fun. However, from the beginning, it is clear that he never took on any real responsibility (financial or technical) He wasn't there for the hardship, the discipline, or anything remotely tough. He just had fun and played with the kid and did all the fun stuff.
Then he pretty much forgot about his kid, for reasons having nothing to do with Cersei. From the moment he left for the war (which lasted a year) he started totally ignoring Mya, and apparently forgot about her existence. He then went for at least 8 years or so without mentioning the kid or attempting to do a thing for her, though he had pretty much unlimited resources to do so.
Then, 8, 9, or 10 years later or so, his own "son" cuts open a cat and proves himself to be a wicked sadist. It is shortly thereafter (it is noted) that Robert mentions to Cersei that he is going to bring his daughter to court. Cersei threatens Robert, Robert punches Cersei, and that is the end of it.
So... Cersei prevented Robert from being a good father? There are numerous problems with this hypothesis.
First and foremost, Robert totally forgot about Mya Stone for at least 8 years or more. He only remembers her, and decides to do something for her, when his own self esteem is in crisis-- seeing how monstrous "his" son has turned out, he no doubt wants to reassure himself by bringing up a "good" child of his. His reasons for wanting to bring Mya to court have everything to do with narcissism and personal insecurity; nothing to do with honest fatherly responsibilty or concern (he has certainly shown none whatsoever over the past 8 to 10 years, during which he's given every indication of having forgotten about Mya's existence.)
Also, if he were really concerned with Mya, he would NOT be bringing her to court. As Ned Stark notes, there would be no place for a bastard at court, being there would be awkward and humiliating for one. If Robert was really motivated by genuine concern for his offspring, then he would have financially provided for her, monitored what was happening to her, tried to make it so that she could move up in life. He did none of these things. He simply wanted to have his fun kid at court so he could feel better about himself again and play with her.
Just like before, he was willing to play around and have fun with his kid, but was not up to making any sacrifices or accepting any adult responsibilities. Cersei is not responsible for that, that has been part of Robert's character from day one.
And by the time that Robert decided he wanted to have his kid around, the damage had already been done. Mya (as she attests to Sansa) had already formed the distrust of men that would plague her all of her life. Because Robert, her father, had abandoned her.
There is also Edric Storm, who Robert "dotes" on when he sees him, but, as Stannis notes, really does not give two craps about. Why do you think he generally choses to shag hookers and low born girls? Because the last time he shagged a high born, she got pregnant and he had to recognize it and it spoiled a lot of his fun.
Robert is selfish, irresponsible, and unwilling to make sacrifices for anyone, including his own children, most of whom he abandons with all of the thought and concern of a tom cat.
His fake children are no different. He ignores Myrcella and Tommen; unlike Edric and Mya, they don't appear to really worship him, which I imagine puts out most interest on his part. The only thing different with Joff is his (understandable) deep personal dislike of the boy. Other than that, Robert is just the same standards, careless selfish absentee dad to Joff as he is to all of his kids. Cersei has nothing to do with this.
Edited by Queen Cersei I, 26 February 2012 - 12:25 PM.