54 replies to this topic

[A Free Shadow]

I was reading about Arya and Hound travelling together in ASoS. And noticed this:

"Arya glanced over her shoulder, but there was nothing behind them but a crow flitting from tree to tree. The only sound was the river."

Bloodraven, m? It is very unusual behaviour for a crow to go "from tree to tree", like fallowing someone.

I went to write this on a thread "Small things I'm ashamed to admit I did not catch", but found it locked. So maybe this will be a new one? And I promise to stop creating threads

[kissdbyfire]

A Free Shadow, on 29 March 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

I was reading about Arya and Hound travelling together in ASoS. And noticed this:

"Arya glanced over her shoulder, but there was nothing behind them but a crow flitting from tree to tree. The only sound was the river."

Bloodraven, m? It is very unusual behaviour for a crow to go "from tree to tree", like fallowing someone.

I went to write this on a thread "Small things I'm ashamed to admit I did not catch", but found it locked. So maybe this will be a new one? And I promise to stop creating threads

I don't know whether it is Bloodraven; I suppose it could be, and we have no proof that it isn't. But crows literally follow you, flying from tree to tree. I promise you. Most mornings when I take the dogs out whatever corvidae (because there're different ones) is around follow us for ages, flying from tree to tree, cawing like mad. It's hilarious.

[A Free Shadow]

Kissdbyfire, on 29 March 2012 - 11:19 AM, said:

I don't know whether it is Bloodraven; I suppose it could be, and we have no proof that it isn't. But crows literally follow you, flying from tree to tree. I promise you. Most mornings when I take the dogs out whatever corvidae (because there're different ones) is around follow us for ages, flying from tree to tree, cawing like mad. It's hilarious.

I consulted a bird specialist before posting While it is not unusual for them to hop from tree to tree when roosting for the night (in the morning), lone crows in the middle of the day do not do that. Even before the night they hop a tree or two, but not so much. I somehow get a deep impression the crow was fallowing them (maybe because Arya looked for fallowers over her shoulder, I admit).

[Lykos]

@Kissdbyfire
That´s because humans in our world drop food all the time, crows are very smart.  In Westeros they follow humans, because these drop dead all the time.  A feast for crows.

*****
I have a major messup, I made, to confess.  I was arguing for a week that we´ve only seen two White Walker in the story so far.  I had completely forgotten that Waymar Royce´s fight was witnessed by Will in the tree and he explicitly sees at least 6 WW.  I had even marked the page were the WW is described that comes forward to meet Waymar but I didn´t turn the page to reread.  I liked the idea so much that Sam could have killed the one and only WW.


ETA:  The crows I witnessed where also in the early morning,  is that their time of feeding?

Edited by Lykos, 29 March 2012 - 11:35 AM.

[A Free Shadow]

Lykos, on 29 March 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

I liked the idea so much that Sam could have killed the one and only WW.
ETA:  The crows I witnessed where also in the early morning,  is that their time of feeding?

That would be a royal plot twist! Poor lonely Other though.

I have some knowledge about birds. Crows come in hundreds/thousands to the same place to roost for the night. At least now when they prefer to be protected fro predators by city lights and traffic noise. But they can fly to look for food dozens of miles. They do that in smaller groups, but still in groups. And their food is almost never in trees (only bird eggs there). So a lone crow plus hopping trees should attract a bird watchers attention, I suppose.

I will believe it was Bloodraven

[Daena the Defiant]

My favorite little, hidden bit is very subtle - we know from her session with Syrio Forel that Arya is left handed; one of the reasons why Arya is so atrocious at needlework is that Septa Mordane is making her use the wrong hand,

[eyeheartsansa]

Paraphrasing - Davos stared into his cup of water, wishing it was wine.

It further illustrates just how lame Stannis is, and how clueless about basic courtesies.  He doesn't drink, but that doesn't mean he can't serve something as basic as a glass of wine to his right hand man.  And to Davos - he believes he's on the right team, but at the same time just weary of Stannis's quirks.

Edited by eyeheartsansa, 29 March 2012 - 12:37 PM.

[Teal'c]

A Free Shadow, on 29 March 2012 - 11:50 AM, said:

That would be a royal plot twist! Poor lonely Other though.

I have some knowledge about birds. Crows come in hundreds/thousands to the same place to roost for the night. At least now when they prefer to be protected fro predators by city lights and traffic noise. But they can fly to look for food dozens of miles. They do that in smaller groups, but still in groups. And their food is almost never in trees (only bird eggs there). So a lone crow plus hopping trees should attract a bird watchers attention, I suppose.

I will believe it was Bloodraven

What I am always trying to remember when we have discussions like this, is that it isn't as important what WE know about birds (or genetics or chemistry), but what does George know?

So the stronger hint is that George wrote that Arya looked to see if she is being followed, and George wrote that she saw a crow. Whan it fits into real science, it's just all the sweeter.

Edited by Teal'c, 29 March 2012 - 12:37 PM.

[A Free Shadow]

Daena the Defiant, on 29 March 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

My favorite little, hidden bit is very subtle - we know from her session with Syrio Forel that Arya is left handed; one of the reasons why Arya is so atrocious at needlework is that Septa Mordane is making her use the wrong hand,

  You have an eye!

Teal, on 29 March 2012 - 12:34 PM, said:

What I am always trying to remember when we have discussions like this, is that it isn't as important what WE know about birds (or genetics or chemistry), but what does George know?

So the stronger hint is that George wrote that Arya looked to see if she is being followed, and George wrote that she saw a crow. Whan it fits into real science, it's just all the sweeter.

Yes, yes! The second part of your post. Yes to that!

Edited by A Free Shadow, 29 March 2012 - 12:40 PM.

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

A Free Shadow, on 29 March 2012 - 11:50 AM, said:

That would be a royal plot twist! Poor lonely Other though.

I have some knowledge about birds. Crows come in hundreds/thousands to the same place to roost for the night. At least now when they prefer to be protected fro predators by city lights and traffic noise. But they can fly to look for food dozens of miles. They do that in smaller groups, but still in groups. And their food is almost never in trees (only bird eggs there). So a lone crow plus hopping trees should attract a bird watchers attention, I suppose.

I will believe it was Bloodraven

I guess. But Ravens are capable of recognizing individuals people and are known to follow and harass individuals whom have wrong them.  So much so that researchers who work with them in the wild have to wear masks in order to not be recognized.

[A Free Shadow]

Lord Littlefinger, on 29 March 2012 - 01:13 PM, said:

I guess. But Ravens are capable of recognizing individuals people and are known to follow and harass individuals whom have wrong them.  So much so that researchers who work with them in the wild have to wear masks in order to not be recognized.

Heard about it. And believe it even if it was only one student who made and published that experiment with his friends. But Arya or Hound did not do harm to any crows as I recall?

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

there are so many little things out there. I just noticed Myra Bran Jojen and Hodor are probably eating people in ADWD.  That the gimp on the quiet isle could be the hound. That Jeyne Westerling Jamie see's may in fact be Elenya Westerling.  Frey Pie. That patch face know what he's talking about.

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

A Free Shadow, on 29 March 2012 - 01:18 PM, said:

Heard about it. And believe it even if it was only one student who made and published that experiment with his friends. But Arya or Hound did not do harm to any crows as I recall?

No its more than just one student http://www.npr.org/b...he-crow-paradox.  And this crow isn't giving out any warning calls.  But, it may well recognize Sandor Clegane, and know that any where he goes dead bodies usually pile up.

Edited by Lord Littlefinger's Lash, 29 March 2012 - 01:31 PM.

[kissdbyfire]

eyeheartsansa, on 29 March 2012 - 12:34 PM, said:

Paraphrasing - Davos stared into his cup of water, wishing it was wine.

It further illustrates just how lame Stannis is, and how clueless about basic courtesies.  He doesn't drink, but that doesn't mean he can't serve something as basic as a glass of wine to his right hand man.  And to Davos - he believes he's on the right team, but at the same time just weary of Stannis's quirks.

No! That illustrates what a fantastic character Stannis is!
I think he is incredibly rigid and strict with himself, and he fully expects those around him to be able to maintain the same standard.

I love-love-love Stannis.

Lord Littlefinger, on 29 March 2012 - 01:13 PM, said:

I guess. But Ravens are capable of recognizing individuals people and are known to follow and harass individuals whom have wrong them.  So much so that researchers who work with them in the wild have to wear masks in order to not be recognized.

Yes, exactly. That’s the sort of thing I meant upthread. These birds I’m talking about follow us because they hate Troy. Troy chases them every chance he gets, and the birds know him. And not only do they follow us, but sometimes they fly above and behind him and dive bomb on him, clawing his bum. It drives him completely mad, it’s one of the funniest things I’ve seen ever.

[Dacie]

I thought Patchface was just talking gibberish at first too. I didn't realize until I came here that a lot of what he was saying was in fact prophecy

(maybe it's because I skim anything involving him because he gives me the creeps)

[Finarfin]

Most shocking moment for me was stumbling across the "Sailor's Wife = Tysha" theory...

[Qhorin Halfhand and Yoren]

The lord of the crossing game that Big Walder and Little Walder played and how if you say Mayhaps what you said and promised does not count. And of course Walder Frey says mayhaps in the red wedding.

[eyeheartsansa]

Quote

No! That illustrates what a fantastic character Stannis is! [img]../../../public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.png[/img]
I think he is incredibly rigid and strict with himself, and he fully expects those around him to be able to maintain the same standard.

I love-love-love Stannis. [img]../../../public/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.png[/img]

Great character.. strong commander, stingy host.  I've learned never trust an employer that is stingy with the food / drink.

Edited by eyeheartsansa, 29 March 2012 - 01:44 PM.

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

Qhorin Halfhand and Yoren, on 29 March 2012 - 01:34 PM, said:

The lord of the crossing game that Big Walder and Little Walder played and how if you say Mayhaps what you said and promised does not count. And of course Walder Frey says mayhaps in the red wedding.

well actually Walder tells Robb that he didn't recall him or his mother saying mayhaps when they agreed to marry Robb to a Frey...

A better reveal is "Though mayhaps this was a blessing. Had he lived he would have grown up to be a Frey"

[Ferrum Aeternum]

Reading through AGOT once again (I think this makes 5 times, but who's counting?), this time actively paying extra close attention to foreshadowing details.  Last night I caught a very subtle R+L=J clue - In the Ned chapter where he discusses the attempt on Bran's life with Catelyn and Littlefinger in the brothel, Ned muses on Robert's history of endorsing violence toward children --

He remembered Rhaegar's infant son, the red ruin of his skull, and the way the king had turned away, as he had turned away in Darry's audience hall not so long ago.  He could still hear Sansa pleading, as Lyanna had pleaded once.

The implication being, Lyanna had pleaded with Ned not to reveal the truth about Jon, lest Robert's wrath (well-known, and apparently irrespective of childhood innocence) be unleashed.  The line is probably a staple of R+L=J threads, which I don't often if ever read, but I'd never picked up on it before.