541 replies to this topic

[Ser Greguh]

Yeah, there's a real quick (like <2 min) summary of S1 shown before the start of the episode.

[BronnFan]

Westerosi Dude, on 02 April 2012 - 11:41 AM, said:

Could I just quickly ask:

Is there a summary of the events of Season 1 shown at the start of S2 Ep1? Because I'm in the UK and will be watching it in just over 2 hours with family members who haven't read the books, so I was going to show them a recap summary trailer of S1 on Youtube before they watched it, but I won't bother if it actually shows something similar at the start of the episode.

Show them that one on YT. The recap before the first episode was very short and I don't think would be much help to any completely new viewer.

[nara]

Winterbreath, on 02 April 2012 - 02:58 AM, said:

I just finished the episode and loved it!

The LF/Cersei scene was supposed to mirror last season where the Goldcloaks obeyed her instead of Ned-she's reminding him who's in charge and it seemed she came prepared with that in mind.

I just glanced over the scene in ACoK where Tyrion sends Slynt to the Wall-here's no confirmation that the order to kill Robert's bastards was given by Cersei. Joff on the other hand has sent a hired knife after at least one child.
Moreover,now that I think about it-why bother killing them now? She's seized power snd the commons have already heard about the incest.

I agree, there is no confirmation that she did it, although the guy who rescued Gendry and Arya (Yoren, I think) certainly thought so.  Also, I don't remember Cersei mentioning killing Robert's kids in her POV.  (Someone, please let me know if I'm mistaken.)  She might be capable of killing them without any regrets, but I can't imagine that it wouldn't come up in her thoughts sometimes.  i always thought that this was like Lysa's letter accusing the Lannisters of killing Jon Arryn and that this was not one of Cersei's crimes.

As for Lena's acting, I thought she was great in Season 1 also and that the restraint was deliberate.  She was the wife of the king and very aware of her lack of power.  Like Sansa's she armored herself with this cool exterior.  Now that Robert is gone and she THINKS she is in charge, she's free to be herself and let her crazy show.
BTW, is anyone else happy that they made Cersei's hair more golden this season?  It's petty, I know, but that really bugged me last season!  Now, if they could get to work on Jaime.

[gramblor]

I think a lot of people are being completely unrealistic with their expectations of the show. They have 10 hours in a season to portray the events that take place in aCoK. This being said, when people are complaining that they didn't get the emotional feeling behind Maester Cressen's death, would you have preferred that they spent the entire episode on him to have people feel bad that he died and Mel lived?

Be reasonable, I think that the show did what was necessary in order to engage the audience and introduce the new characters and create some form of understanding their roles. Obviously they will be broadened as the season continues. Lets not forget that they have to hook the population that haven't read the books yet either.

That being said, I think the episode was well done, and that while there was some stuff in the show that I think could have been done differently, I am super stoked/happy that the show is back on and can't wait to continue watching and enjoying. The show is a privilege, not a right. There is no need for everyone to be saying "this show is such a disappointment"

[Ser Greguh]

gramblor, on 02 April 2012 - 11:50 AM, said:

There is no need for everyone to be saying "this show is such a disappointment"

Nah, if people are disappointed by the show they have every right to say so.  It's just that in this case I think it will generally trend to saying more about them than about the show.

[Anduin Lothar]

Kind of disturbed about the baby killing scene with Barra.  I felt they could used that time for Arya or Gendry.  Some people are more or less prone to baby killings then others but that was just my reaction.  If they hadn't included that scene I would of enjoyed it.

Edited by Anduin Lothar, 02 April 2012 - 11:55 AM.

[So1ar]

I loved the first episode. The only problem I have is another whore try-out scene. I don't mind sex scenes but sticking a tit in my face just for the sake of it is annoying. But I digress, it's nice to see what Ros looks like with clothes on.

Also, I don't get the hate some people have for this show and it's characters. Do some of you realize what a miracle it is that our little book series is being brought to life by HBO? Or that fact that 99.9% of the actors are perfect for their roles? I'm not saying we should worship this show and only talk about positives. But my god, who cares if Maester Cressen (a character who lasts a whole 12 pages) isn't fleshed out enough at the expense of other characters losing screen time. And Craster isn't dirty enough for you? He's going to last what? 10 minutes this season? I know we all have our favorite characters and envision in them in magical ways, but be realistic.

[Snowman3131]

Anduin Lothar, on 02 April 2012 - 11:54 AM, said:

Kind of disturbed about the baby killing scene with Barra.  I felt they could used that time for Arya or Gendry.  Some people are more or less prone to baby killings then others but that was just my reaction.  If they hadn't included that scene I would of enjoyed it.

I agree, but it appears they are building up Slynt to be more hated.

In Ch. 8 CoC, they allude to Cersi ordering the bastards dead, but there is no confirmation who did it. Doesn't the murder of the bastards actually make the incest more believable? Why would someone NOT guilty try to hide all the bastards with "black of hair"? I wouldn't be surprised if LF didn't order it himself. Doesn't he pay the City Watch in the first place?

[Chelly]

I really liked it. Premieres are always a little rougher than the following episodes because it involves setting up stories, establishing new characters, and reintroducing the older characters. So, I though it was great. I watched it twice already. I liked it better than "Winter is Coming".

Lena Headey is looking especially beautiful this season as Cersei. She is much more fiery like the Cersei from the books. I love her scenes with Tyrion and Joff. The look on her face when she confessed to Tyrion that she did not have Arya was priceless. I really can't stand Cersei in the books, but on the tv show I see her as more human. Peter Dinklage is still killing it as Tyrion, so is Jack Gleeson as Joff. Jack Gleeson can really hold his own and outshine some of the older more established actors in the series.

Robb came off as a little arrogant in his scene with Catelyn, but I thought he was pretty arrogant in the book as well. I like Robb enough, but boy did I want Catelyn to smack him upside the head in the book. On the show, I found myself to be more understanding of Robb's reasoning. Richard Madden and Michelle Fairley have great chemistry(ew, not like that!) as mother and son. Catelyn's line about the rats in KL made me chuckle. Oh, btw, Robb, if your mother is telling you that Balon Greyjoy is not trustworthy, you might do well to listen.

I loved the added scene with Theon and Robb. Robb telling Theon he doesn't have to use formalities when nobody is around made me like Robb a little more. It was kind of touching, and I do believe Theon, at this point, wants to truly help Robb. He's so wrong to assume his father would be like Ned Stark and listen to him, though. It just solidifies the fact of how detached Theon clearly is from his people and family.

The bastard massacre was horrifying and the worst thing I have seen on tv. I couldn't bare to watch the scene with the young brothel girl and little Barra. Her frantic screaming as they ripped her baby away and butchered was sickening. The boy they were drowning and the toddler being carried away by its legs was too disturbing. Janos is a bigger monster on the show than he is in the book, I think.

No Arya and Gendry until the end . Hopefully there will be more of them next week and maybe we get a glimpse of Jaqen!

[Anduin Lothar]

Snowman3131, on 02 April 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

I agree, but it appears they are building up Slynt to be more hated.

In Ch. 8 CoC, they allude to Cersi ordering the bastards dead, but there is no confirmation who did it. Doesn't the murder of the bastards actually make the incest more believable? Why would someone NOT guilty try to hide all the bastards with "black of hair"? I wouldn't be surprised if LF didn't order it himself. Doesn't he pay the City Watch in the first place?

I would hate to be that actor during that scene.  Not judging.

Edited by Anduin Lothar, 02 April 2012 - 12:20 PM.

[Arya The Assassin]

First impressions:

Good:

• The orchestration for the opening theme seemed slightly different compared to season 1. The end title theme was superior to the one we heard in the first episode in season one (same theme but better orchestration. Djawadi had very limited time when scoring the first season).
  
• The actor who played Craster was very good. He was relatively low key, and yet he was intense and scary.
  
• I'm not 100% sure if the full shots of Robb's wolf was CG or not, but it did seem like CG. If that's indeed true, then they did a very good job (I'm quite certain the first closeup of the wolf's mirror image in the water was CG, though). In general, I think the CG creatures (wolf and dragon) were very well done, especially when you consider the budget of the TV-series (in fact, they compare favourably to the CG creatures I've seen in many higher budget feature films).
  
• I guess I'm one of the few who actually like Ros. She's not only attractive, but I like her attitude and persona.
  
• The cinematography was very good. The wide open scenery shots were awesome. I also liked the dynamic, subjective camerawork in some of the scenes.
  
• I liked Carice as Melisandre. Perhaps the actress could have been younger and more sexually attractive (in the books I get the impression that she's very sexy and seductive), but I'd rather have an attractive actress with Carice's acting talent than a 'bombshell' that can't act. The casting directors have made the right priorities here, the way I see it.
  
• Gleeson is really good as Joffrey. Joffrey is the kind of character than can easily look shallow or two-dimensional in the hands of a less gifted actor.

Bad:

• I'm not too happy about the actress who plays Shae (I didn't like her in the first season either). Perhaps she'll improve later this season, I hope so. Some of the actors I wasn't too excited about in the beginning of season one have steadily improved (Emilia Clarke, Lena Headey).
  
• I was hoping to see a bit more of Arya, one of my favourite characters. However, I realize that the writers needed to cover several bases in the first episode, so to speak, so they probably decided that Arya's story could wait (I don't quite remember, but I think we don't see that much of Arya in the beginning of A Clash Of Kings anyway).

Overall I found this first episode of season two to be quite enjoyable. I wasn't bored for a moment and there were several good scenes (Night Watch's visit to Craster, Tyrion's chat with Cersei, Robb's talk with his mother and Jamie, etc). Looking forward to episode 2!

[Caro99]

overall i liked this first episode very much. it had it's good & bad things but in the end the acting, the landscapes, the CGI (?) animals, the lines were all really good, and it's obvious the actors are going to really impress us this season, whether they be old faces or new...
The things that could've been better: Craster, Cressen, more eye-contact between sandor & sansa after he backs her up, Dany's silver dying, joff threatening her mother...
  But I did liked the scene between LF/Cersei. if i could have my way i would only have added this: cersei knows that LF was the one to give joff the idea of indeed killing ned, so after she orders the guards to release him, she whispers to LF, "And don't ever try to advice my son behind the Small Council and my back..." and about the killing of robert's babies, it was harsh and bitter, but in the end i liked it if only cause it was a nice way to introduce arya again and the newest addition to the danger she is currenty running from...
  But after last night i now like ross and shae (for the time being). and i think gendry and dolorous edd look quite hot. what i also liked a lot was jaime's interactions with grey wind, sandor being the first thing we see or hear in the episode, robb & cat, jack glesson's preformance, sophie turner's preformance, tyrion, cersei, bran & osha, melisandre, and all the cast, as i said before, are really doing their best this season regarding acting.

[legba11]

Ser Greguh, on 02 April 2012 - 10:30 AM, said:

Oh, I don't doubt that Ros is an informant for LF.  I would say that the Pycelle/Ros scene in E10 certainly suggests that Pycelle may believe that she's spying on him, given that he keeps up his Doddering Old Fool act around her and drops it immediately after she leaves.  As to whether or not she was spying for LF while up in Winterfell, it's hard to say, no real evidence for or against IMO.  I don't know how much good information she'd actually be privy to that LF would actually care about - LF doesn't give two shits for, say, Theon, she's not allowed in the castle (Theon has to sneak her in), and the logistics of getting messages from Winterfell to KL would be daunting (though Varys obviously has some method).  But I also seriously doubt that she's LF's only prostitute informant, so I think her rise still has to be more merit-based than by virtue of special favors done for him.  He sees she's clever and he needs someone in the role, so she gets the job.

Also, I liked the little touch of her specifying that it's nice to see Janos Slynt "again."  He's clearly a regular customer there.

No evidence for LF specifically, but that she is more than she seems.  When she is leaving, Theon doesn't understand how she has the money to afford such a trip.  She leaves the question unanswered (and we find out she is a natural redhead).  Martin pretty much ignored logistics of these spy networks (which are daunting to say the least), anf the show has almost followed suit (you see a couple of glimpses, like Jorah leaving when he finds out about Dany's pregnancy, if you think about what he had to do to get that message secretly to Varys it seems nearly impossible to keep such a network running and secret).  I am ok with this, as it's fun to have these spy masters in world where it would be nearly impossible due to size and communication.

She got promoted because the producers like her and she is known by the audience (as opposed to a random whore playing the role as in the books), I'm just justifying it   She was clearly well connected, though.  She was a regular for Theon and was in with Jon too.  We know Tyrion went to her as well.  Likely she was able to get good information out of Theon, who had no regard for her as anything but a whore.

It's the same as showing the scrubber kid twice in the episode (who I have little doubt is Vary's informant).  It reminds the audience that these guys are very involved in Game of Thrones, and have been playing this Game for some time.

[legba11]

Zar Lannister, on 02 April 2012 - 10:59 AM, said:

You know, I kinda liked the TV Cersei version, though they are toning down her evildom.

Keep in mind, they also have planted to seeds that she murdered her first Robert child, as opposed to "just" aborting them.  That may seriously beat down any sympathy she may have out there.  I will add that it's also possible that whole speech was a throw in by a writer who did not see the big picture.  It makes no sense that the heir to the Iron Throne dying was not known by the Starks, it would be the biggest news in the kingdom for a decade.

[Ser Greguh]

legba11, on 02 April 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

Keep in mind, they also have planted to seeds that she murdered her first Robert child, as opposed to "just" aborting them.  That may seriously beat down any sympathy she may have out there.  I will add that it's also possible that whole speech was a throw in by a writer who did not see the big picture.  It makes no sense that the heir to the Iron Throne dying was not known by the Starks, it would be the biggest news in the kingdom for a decade.

Well, that was mostly meta-speculation on our part given that going into that speech we readers knew just how evil Book!Cersei was and thus wouldn't have put it past her to poison the child.  Given that the show has already established (or at least had Cersei claim in 2 separate occasions) that she had genuine feelings for Robert for a very long time, it's much less likely that she would have killed the child.

I do agree that the birth and loss of a Crown Prince should have been well-known, however, and certainly known to the Starks.  A bit clumsy really.

[Baitac]

@Arya The Assassin: "The orchestration for the opening theme seemed slightly different compared to season 1. The end title theme was superior to the one we heard in the first episode in season one (same theme but better orchestration. Djawadi had very limited time when scoring the first season)."

I'm surprised no one mentioned this before you. The theme song seemed longer, perhaps to accomodate more castles in the intro. Also, the orchestration was different. It went into full strings earlier.  I'm not sure if I like the vocals at the end. The original musical theme was so perfect. It went perfectly with that masterful introduction of the map.

[nara]

legba11, on 02 April 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

Keep in mind, they also have planted to seeds that she murdered her first Robert child, as opposed to "just" aborting them.  That may seriously beat down any sympathy she may have out there.  I will add that it's also possible that whole speech was a throw in by a writer who did not see the big picture.  It makes no sense that the heir to the Iron Throne dying was not known by the Starks, it would be the biggest news in the kingdom for a decade.

I assumed it was a goof on the part of the creators, trying to humanize her without thinking of the impact to the Maggy profecy.  3 kids, gold shall be their crowns....

[sharkhawk]

dtones520, on 02 April 2012 - 11:41 AM, said:

Craster is never described as dirty and grimey in the books. He is described as old, white haired, and powerful. He doesn't really seem like he does a lot of the dirty work around his keep. I always pictured him as a guy who sat around drinking, eating, and creeping on his wives. Which is exactly how they portrayed him in the show.

Craster does nothing around the farm except eat drink and sleep with his daughters/wives.  Probably goes out hunting.  I'm sure he has the wives bathe him and clean his clothes.

[apt54]

Absolutely terrific episode. Another great job by both actors and writers.

Melisandre was awesome, Stannis was accurately awkward during his short public speech and davos's accent rocked.

I don't know why everybody is getting so worked up about Cersei/LF scene. I think it was awesome... and the look our mockingbird gave the Queen was terrific! His eyes were all like "I'll be remembering that, you whore."

And the ending was just so shocking! Ruthless, cruel and exceptionally written... making the transition towards Arya and Co. all the more uplifting!

Giving this episode 9.5/10. -0.5 for little Arya screentime (obvious Arya fan is obvious)

[Myrddin]

nara, on 02 April 2012 - 12:42 PM, said:

I assumed it was a goof on the part of the creators, trying to humanize her without thinking of the impact to the Maggy profecy.  3 kids, gold shall be their crowns....

Assuming the prophecy counts babies that didn't live long.

I'm sure they'll reword the prophecy when the time comes as needed. Let's hope we get to season 5 to do it.