40 replies to this topic

[Skywarpgold]

So, I was watching the episode on HBO Go with the enhanced features turned on, when a Meryn Trant pop-up appeared, with the following description:

"Ser Meryn: The Kingsguard member who killed Syrio Forel and struck Sansa at Joffrey’s bidding"

Here’s a screen-cap.

So is that final confirmation that Syrio is actually dead and Jaqen H’ghar is a completely different person?!

Edited by Skywarpgold, 02 April 2012 - 05:37 PM.

[Dracarya]

Couldn't access the link for some reason, but if it's true that he killed Syrio, well, this hurts me.

[Skywarpgold]

Fire&Blood, on 02 April 2012 - 04:30 PM, said:

Couldn't access the link for some reason, but if it's true that he killed Syrio, well, this hurts me.

Ack, not sure what happened with that! I think I fixed it though. Thanks for the heads up!

[atia-]

I think Ran sums it up well in the episode discussion thread:

Quote

The little text bits on the web site for HBO, describing various characters, are not written by the production, I think. So that may well be some web person's assumption.

Edited by dannister, 02 April 2012 - 05:43 PM.

[Laohu]

After the number he did against the 4 Lannister henchmen prior to his "end", I do not see how anyone could presume that Syrio fell at the hands of Ser Meryn. That was purposefully left up in the air by GRRM, both in the books and his own written episode 8.

[Skywarpgold]

Ah! That would make sense, and certainly make me feel a whole lot better!

[Tywin's bastard]

Laohu, on 02 April 2012 - 05:52 PM, said:

After the number he did against the 4 Lannister henchmen prior to his "end", I do not see how anyone could presume that Syrio fell at the hands of Ser Meryn. That was purposefully left up in the air by GRRM, both in the books and his own written episode 8.

It's hardly a stretch to think that even someone like Syrio would fall to a fully armored knight of the King's Guard (might not be Arthur Dayne but not chopped liver either) while only having a broken stick as a weapon. There's no evidence either way and both outcomes are supposed to be within the realms of possibility.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Tywin, on 02 April 2012 - 06:04 PM, said:

It's hardly a stretch to think that even someone like Syrio would fall to a fully armored knight of the King's Guard (might not be Arthur Dayne but not chopped liver either) while only having a broken stick as a weapon. There's no evidence either way and both outcomes are supposed to be within the realms of possibility.

I think you're right that it's not out of the realm of possibility, but Trant is such a classless oaf that it is too depressing to consider.

[Trebla]

Speaking of Trant, I was wondering if he may end up taking up Mandon Moore's role in the Battle of the Blackwater. While Tyrion surely will not be losing a nose, the attack serves the purpose of putting Tyrion out of action and thereby waking to find himself pushed from power. Trant dying would also give the audience some pleasure since he has been and will continue to be Sansa's physical tormentor.

[Hyper]

Skywarpgold, on 02 April 2012 - 03:42 PM, said:

So, I was watching the episode on HBO Go with the enhanced features turned on, when a Meryn Trant pop-up appeared, with the following description:

"Ser Meryn: The Kingsguard member who killed Syrio Forel and struck Sansa at Joffrey’s bidding"

Here’s a screen-cap.

So is that final confirmation that Syrio is actually dead and Jaqen H’ghar is a completely different person?!

Not a 'final confirmation'... but c'mon... Did you really think that Syrio and Jaqen H’ghar was/is the same person? It is one of the silliest fan theories out there.

Fire&Blood, on 02 April 2012 - 04:30 PM, said:

Couldn't access the link for some reason, but if it's true that he killed Syrio, well, this hurts me.

Occam's razor applies. It has always been the likely outcome. Don't let wishful thinking tell you otherwise.

Edited by Hyper, 02 April 2012 - 07:42 PM.

[Maginor]

Even though this is not a reliable source, I also think that Meryn Trant most likely did kill Syrio.

[boojam]

Skywarpgold, on 02 April 2012 - 03:42 PM, said:

So is that final confirmation that Syrio is actually dead and Jaqen H’ghar is a completely different person?!

I don't think that came from George, did it?

I think the Syrio - Jaqen masquerade is all fan invented.

Edited by boojam, 02 April 2012 - 09:11 PM.

[The Unborn]

Trant killed Syrio, period. Syrio didn't want to run, he didn't take a sword from a Lannister guard when he easily could and Trant is still alive and kicking. The outcome for me is pretty clear.

[Umberto]

The Unborn, on 02 April 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

Trant killed Syrio, period. Syrio didn't want to run, he didn't take a sword from a Lannister guard when he easily could and Trant is still alive and kicking. The outcome for me is pretty clear.

Because GRRM never makes it look like people die and have them actually be alive right?

[As high as honor]

I think you need re watch episode 8 of season 1. right before the scene cuts out the Lannister guards begin rise to their feet. 5 on one with a broken wooden sword? I'm pretty sure he is dead. I think GRRM actually stated that Syrio did not survive in an interview.

[Howdyphillip]

As high as honor, on 02 April 2012 - 11:40 PM, said:

I think you need re watch episode 8 of season 1. right before the scene cuts out the Lannister guards begin rise to their feet. 5 on one with a broken wooden sword? I'm pretty sure he is dead. I think GRRM actually stated that Syrio did not survive in an interview.

Absolutely 100% false... GRRM has never elaborated about the fate of the sword master of Bravos.

[seeyouintee]

Syrio was fucking awesome, but it would cheapen his character to bring him back. The sacrifice is what made that scene so poignant.

[ChromeWeasel]

seeyouintee, on 03 April 2012 - 03:16 AM, said:

Syrio was fucking awesome, but it would cheapen his character to bring him back. The sacrifice is what made that scene so poignant.

Pretty much this.

Here's a clip from an interview with Martin. I like the point he makes about Tolkien, that Gandalf should have stayed dead.

Quote

"Much as I admire Tolkien, I once again always felt like Gandalf should have stayed dead. That was such an incredible sequence in Fellowship of the Ring when he faces the Balrog on the Khazad-dûm and he falls into the gulf, and his last words are, "Fly, you fools."
What power that had, how that grabbed me. And then he comes back as Gandalf the White, and if anything he's sort of improved. I never liked Gandalf the White as much as Gandalf the Grey, and I never liked him coming back. I think it would have been an even stronger story if Tolkien had left him dead.
My characters who come back from death are worse for wear. In some ways, they're not even the same characters anymore. The body may be moving, but some aspect of the spirit is changed or transformed, and they've lost something. One of the characters who has come back repeatedly from death is Beric Dondarrion, The Lightning Lord. Each time he's revived he loses a little more of himself. He was sent on a mission before his first death. He was sent on a mission to do something, and it's like, that's what he's clinging to. He's forgetting other things, he's forgetting who he is, or where he lived. He's forgotten the woman who he was once supposed to marry. Bits of his humanity are lost every time he comes back from death; he remembers that mission. His flesh is falling away from him, but this one thing, this purpose that he had is part of what's animating him and bringing him back to death. I think you see echoes of that with some of the other characters who have come back from death."

[lmanion]

Syrio's 'death' is off screen we never 'see' him die though, he is a fairly minor character really his death is really implied although this is something we have seen a few times through the books only for the character to pop up again later. Admitedly this has mostly happened to POV characters like with Arya.

[Stark 4 ever]

Trebla, on 02 April 2012 - 07:33 PM, said:

Speaking of Trant, I was wondering if he may end up taking up Mandon Moore's role in the Battle of the Blackwater.

was thinking the same thing since the didn't show any other kingsgaurd. and trant doesn't really play an important roll later in the series IIRC