159 replies to this topic

[Eyron I]

Oh it was... Just perfect! I wish he would read out loud all the books for us I couldn't concentrate enough to take notes though, and tried to just listen and immerse in the story.

[Raksha the Demon]

Frey Pie, on 07 April 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

True true.Im hoping for a Daario Vic showdown.If Jorahs to stay around Dany hes gunna have to learn to hold his tongue a bit

I suppose it would be too much to hope for that Victarion and Daario would kill each other...

[Stallion That Mounts Texas]

Raksha the Demon, on 14 April 2012 - 09:27 AM, said:

I suppose it would be too much to hope for that Victarion and Daario would kill each other...

I couldn't agree w/ you more about Daario.  Even Ser Barristan knows he has to go.  I can only hope that it will be Vic that does him in.

[CrypticWeirwood]

Just can’t understand all this Daario-hate.

[Stark@heart]

Daario, as written, seems really sleazy and Dany screwing him was a Yuck moment for me.

Given a choice between a Daario type and a Vic type.  I'll take a Vic, atleast you know what to expect and don't have to stand around in 4 ft of BS.

[Stallion That Mounts Texas]

Stark@heart, on 14 April 2012 - 05:41 PM, said:

Daario, as written, seems really sleazy and Dany screwing him was a Yuck moment for me.

Given a choice between a Daario type and a Vic type.  I'll take a Vic, atleast you know what to expect and don't have to stand around in 4 ft of BS.

Could not agree more.  Ser Barristan has him figured perfectly and knows he has to go.  I foresee Daario somehow dying in captivity (maybe at the hands of the Tattered Prince on agreement with Barry) or certainly at the hands of Vic.

[Arkash]

Quote

Given a choice between a Daario type and a Vic type. I'll take a Vic, atleast you know what to expect and don't have to stand around in 4 ft of BS.

I would have gave her Quentyn...

The thing about Daario is that he's a figure that draws her away from Westeros. As long as he's around, she'll never have Westeros.

In order to get it, she must make political alliances and likely a wedding, which Daario will never allow and if he's still around, she will for sure, cheat on her husband, which isnt to blame if she doesnt love him, but could be problematic if found.

Moreover, Daario will never be accepted in Westeros.

So, all in all, he has to go, and the best way for Dany to definitly forget him is death.

Edited by Arkash, 15 April 2012 - 06:08 PM.

[Casso King of Seals]

My dream scenario is that Victarion murders the beejesus out of Daario and Hizdahr in the SAME SCENE, then Dany marries him for his ships, fulfilling the prophecy in ACOK, and starts heading west.

My story sense here is that Darrio and Hizdahr are important characters who need to be properly dealt with; they can't just vanish. This would give Vic the defining moment we need to "root" for him if he's going to do anything beyond die in this battle.

Alternative: Euron pops in and kills Vic just after the above moment of triumph, then Dany marries HIM for HIS ships, fulfilling the prophecy in ACOK, and starts heading west.

Edit: (To be clear, I'm suggesting that Daario and Hizdahr's ulterior motives be exposed before Vic kills them.)

Edited by Casso King of Seals, 15 April 2012 - 06:45 PM.

[redraike]

Wouter, on 07 April 2012 - 09:34 AM, said:

Since the Targs and their dragons exist, they are obviously not myth and superstition. Science would dictate study of the dragons, not killing them! In fact, some scholars did just that, as Tyrion tells us about the existence of books detailing the lifes and anatomy of dragons.

Because Tyrion has read these books, he's likely to be Dany's dragon-tamer - and he will need to do what he can before they set sail.  He will probably get his wish and ride one after all.

But it will take time...and there's definitely going to be quite a bit of drama in negotiations with Victarion for Dany's long-awaited return to Westeros.

[WolveseatDragons]

I would love for a Barristan chapter to be next that starts with Hizdahr's head on a spike and Daario's body flung over the wall into Mereen.  Really tired of both of those characters and they have served what purpose they had.  Daario is interesting but he distracts from the storyline.  He is someone she can't marry, is untrustworthy and treats her like a notch on his belt, and has "I will betray you" practically written on his forehead.  I'm just worn out by the "I'm a stupid little girl trying to play at ruling and making every mistake I can because I want for slavery to cease to exist and to change the world" storyline that basically was Dany in Dance.  I suppose they can keep Daario around to be the "treason for gold" which would make sense with his character.  It is hard though not to think in every chapter involving either of those two though that "great, more development on another storyline that will have nothing to do with her going to Westeros and moving the story along.  I guess we are looking at 8 books and they will never be finished."  

More than that though I just miss the Dany that is a badass and has no mercy for her enemies.  I hated watching her get pushed around all through Dance by people that she could simply have made into snacks for her dragons.  I want to see her get a little more "Aegon the Conqueror" and say "bend the knee or die" and if try to tell me what to do with my dragons or kill any of my people you will die screaming.  Instead she seemed weak, naive, and tired in Dance and completely lost her way.  She regressed badly in Dance as a character and I would have been just fine without all the bodily fluid descriptions as well.  About the only thing that is clear now is she can't be the winner of the Game of Thrones in the end, she's too much of an idiot.

It does appear though that Mereen is heading toward closure now though with everyone converging there, though the biggest gap seems to be that Dany is far, far away from Mereen a horde of Dothraki and the battle is about to happen.  Now that things are finally happening in Mereen she is hopelessly too far away to be a part of it.

[Stargareyen]

WolveseatDragons, on 16 April 2012 - 09:48 AM, said:

I would love for a Barristan chapter to be next that starts with Hizdahr's head on a spike and Daario's body flung over the wall into Mereen.  Really tired of both of those characters and they have served what purpose they had.  Daario is interesting but he distracts from the storyline.  He is someone she can't marry, is untrustworthy and treats her like a notch on his belt, and has "I will betray you" practically written on his forehead.  I'm just worn out by the "I'm a stupid little girl trying to play at ruling and making every mistake I can because I want for slavery to cease to exist and to change the world" storyline that basically was Dany in Dance.  I suppose they can keep Daario around to be the "treason for gold" which would make sense with his character.  It is hard though not to think in every chapter involving either of those two though that "great, more development on another storyline that will have nothing to do with her going to Westeros and moving the story along.  I guess we are looking at 8 books and they will never be finished."  

More than that though I just miss the Dany that is a badass and has no mercy for her enemies.  I hated watching her get pushed around all through Dance by people that she could simply have made into snacks for her dragons.  I want to see her get a little more "Aegon the Conqueror" and say "bend the knee or die" and if try to tell me what to do with my dragons or kill any of my people you will die screaming.  Instead she seemed weak, naive, and tired in Dance and completely lost her way.  She regressed badly in Dance as a character and I would have been just fine without all the bodily fluid descriptions as well.  About the only thing that is clear now is she can't be the winner of the Game of Thrones in the end, she's too much of an idiot.

It does appear though that Mereen is heading toward closure now though with everyone converging there, though the biggest gap seems to be that Dany is far, far away from Mereen a horde of Dothraki and the battle is about to happen.  Now that things are finally happening in Mereen she is hopelessly too far away to be a part of it.

Give Dany a break, will you? The prime reason she stayed in Essos was to learn how to rule and give time for her dragons to be of use in war. She has taken decisions too wise for her age - marrying Hizdahr to bring peace, rejecting Quentyn at the cost of Dorne's help, rejecting Daario as suitor (unlike Robb Stark who gave in to his teenage lust), softening on her stand on fighting pits for her people even though she finds it unethical/barbarian. The only reason her chapters sounded boring because managing a kingdom is indeed boring, it's not about fighting wars all the time. She needed a vacation from all the stress and Drogon gave her that!

[Stargareyen]

First of all, when we talk about Vic, we need to remember that he has been planted there by Euron himself and the Crow's Eye is not stupid enough not to understand that his brother will plot behind his back. Vic has always been shown arrogant and stupid, and even though he's trying to ace his brother's moves, he is somehow meant to be dragon fodder...err...meat. It's somewhat weird how the dragons are not bound to the man who blows the horn, but to the one who's blood is sprinkled on it!

Daario has bound Dany by being a charmer and brave, but he won't backstab her as the prophecy has already been somewhat fulfilled by the Brown Ben Plumm betrayal (unless his coming back to her nullifies it). If Tyrion indeed ends up saving him, Dany would have a good reason to admit Tyrion among her counselors. Since he's so good in field, his death is meant to be in a fierce battle and not by Yunkish hands.

[Casso King of Seals]

Stargareyen, on 16 April 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

Daario has bound Dany by being a charmer and brave, but he won't backstab her as the prophecy has already been somewhat fulfilled by the Brown Ben Plumm betrayal (unless his coming back to her nullifies it). If Tyrion indeed ends up saving him, Dany would have a good reason to admit Tyrion among her counselors. Since he's so good in field, his death is meant to be in a fierce battle and not by Yunkish hands.

Haha, there is NO WAY Dany is only going to be betrayed three times in her entire life. The three treasons have to be HUGE and result in enormous changes of fortune for her - like Mirri Maz Duur killing her husband and unborn child. She hasn't faced anything remotely like that since then, so I'm positive the two other treasons are yet to come.

If the Undying were counting every time someone close to her did something execution-worthy, or every time someone in her army of sellswords swapped sides, that prophecy would have went on for decades.

[TheKindlyMan]

One of the lines of the Undying prophecy is something like "Three mounts shall you ride.  One to bed, one to dread, and one to love."  Bedding is most likely Daario, and therefore temporary.  I think dreading is pretty obvious now that she rides Drogon.  One to love...this is the interesting one, I'm thinking UnJon Snow, but others seem pretty confident that it will be Vic...which I just see as entirely too tidy for this story.

As for Tyrion, he has to stick with Dany until Casterly Rock is his, the Second Sons are shattered, or he dies.  Dany's visions also included a white lion running through grass taller than a man.  Could be symbolism for Tyrion, but I doubt he ever rides or tames a dragon.

Edited by TheKindlyMan, 17 April 2012 - 01:35 AM.

[Stargareyen]

TheKindlyMan, on 17 April 2012 - 01:31 AM, said:

One of the lines of the Undying prophecy is something like "Three mounts shall you ride.  One to bed, one to dread, and one to love."  Bedding is most likely Daario, and therefore temporary.  I think dreading is pretty obvious now that she rides Drogon.  One to love...this is the interesting one, I'm thinking UnJon Snow, but others seem pretty confident that it will be Vic...which I just see as entirely too tidy for this story.

As for Tyrion, he has to stick with Dany until Casterly Rock is his, the Second Sons are shattered, or he dies.  Dany's visions also included a white lion running through grass taller than a man.  Could be symbolism for Tyrion, but I doubt he ever rides or tames a dragon.

Hasn't she already 'mounted' Khal Drogo for love? Or did the Undying ignore that fact and spoke of the future alone... Vic lives under Euron's shadow and in no way will he woo Dany!

[IKE]

Stargareyen, on 17 April 2012 - 09:07 AM, said:

Hasn't she already 'mounted' Khal Drogo for love? Or did the Undying ignore that fact and spoke of the future alone... Vic lives under Euron's shadow and in no way will he woo Dany!

I think the prophecy refers to the future, Drogo wouldn't count.  No way to know for sure though..  

Just a shot in the dark: bed = Daario, dread = Vic, love = conclusion of the character arc/story - JonTarg or someone else who makes it to the end.

But if Drogo is meant to be part of the prophecy than it'd be the same, except bed = Drogo.. Perhaps bed is suppose to imply having children..

It's anyones best guess..

I do think dread refers to a political marriage, so maybe Hahzdir fits too.   A political marriage that improves her ability to conquer, Vic/Euron.  Or in Hahzdir's case, marriage simultaneous with the Harpy murders

Edited by IKE, 17 April 2012 - 09:24 AM.

[PatrickStormborn]

I really doubt the "mounts" are lovers. Mount to bed is probably her Silver taking her to Drogo; mount to dread is most likely her riding Drogon (Balerion the Black Dread come again). Mount to love is still to come.

[protar]

Is there anywhere we can get a live reading of this?

And also I'm really looking forward to seeing Dany through Tyrion's eyes. As of now she's the only POV who hasn't been seen from another POV. I wonder why?

[WolveseatDragons]

Stargareyen,

I'll give Dany a little rope but she is being an idiot.  She's trying to rule by Westerosi ethics in Slaver's Bay and it will never work.  She is not being strong enough and is being bullied as well, she needs to make people fear her twice as much because she is a young woman but instead she shows she is soft.  She also should have left with Quentyn and taken the ships offered to her.  She isn't going to stay in Mereen so no one is going to change for her because when she leaves it will all change.  She needs to be focusing on her exit strategy.  She just seems confused and lost.

protar,

I believe we saw Dany through Barristan's POV though I agree the Tyrion/Dany meeting will be awesome.  It has been almost as frustrating as Arya running all over the Riverlands and coming up just short of seeing Robb and Catelyn.

[PatrickStormborn]

protar, on 17 April 2012 - 02:02 PM, said:

And also I'm really looking forward to seeing Dany through Tyrion's eyes. As of now she's the only POV who hasn't been seen from another POV. I wonder why?

We saw her through the eyes of Quentyn and Barristan.