193 replies to this topic

[Dracarya]

I gave it a 9 - I'm trying to take the show as a separate entity to the books now, else I'd lose my mind. We don't see Stannis and Melisandre having sex in the books, so it's no surprise that people are shocked when it happens so blatantly on our screens. He has been changed - "a son?" was just cringe-worthy. Too many brothel scenes too - makes me feel slightly ill. No need to see all of that.

Very close to giving up watching too, but seeing it as a new TV show rather than an adaptation of these books makes it a bit better. I thoroughly enjoyed season 1, probably because I watched it before reading.  I highly doubt we'll get all the seasons needed to cover all of the books anyway.

[mrnegativity]

Too many brothel scenes?? GRRM vividly describes vaginas as 'c***s' in the books and happily writes about incest, but nudity and sex on screen 'makes you...ill'?

Kudos for remaining faithful to GRRM's violently sexual world, IMO.

[Qhorin Halfhand and Yoren]

Fire&Blood, on 09 April 2012 - 04:12 AM, said:

I gave it a 9 - I'm trying to take the show as a separate entity to the books now, else I'd lose my mind. We don't see Stannis and Melisandre having sex in the books, so it's no surprise that people are shocked when it happens so blatantly on our screens. He has been changed - "a son?" was just cringe-worthy. Too many brothel scenes too - makes me feel slightly ill. No need to see all of that.

Very close to giving up watching too, but seeing it as a new TV show rather than an adaptation of these books makes it a bit better. I thoroughly enjoyed season 1, probably because I watched it before reading.  I highly doubt we'll get all the seasons needed to cover all of the books anyway.

Based on the rest of your post your 9/10 score seems a tad strange.

[TheEvilKing]

Qhorin Halfhand and Yoren, on 09 April 2012 - 04:17 AM, said:

Based on the rest of your post your 9/10 score seems a tad strange.

Haha yes. 9/10 but very close to giving up watching? So a TV shows need to be a perfect 10/10 to be watchable?

[Dracarya]

Qhorin Halfhand and Yoren, on 09 April 2012 - 04:17 AM, said:

Based on the rest of your post your 9/10 score seems a tad strange.

Like I said - taking it as a separate entity. 9/10 as a show, pretty damn crap as an adaptation of these excellent books.

[mrnegativity]

Adaptation =/= word for word rendering! The show is doing a pretty awesome job of making Westeros come alive.

But I'll stop trolling now.

[DannySpud]

Fire&Blood, on 09 April 2012 - 04:22 AM, said:

Like I said - taking it as a separate entity. 9/10 as a show, pretty damn crap as an adaptation of these excellent books.

GRRM has said that he wrote the books almost specifically to be un-adaptable because he was fed up with the limits imposed by tv and film (paraphrasing a bit as I can't remember his exact words but that's the gist of it). I think they're doing a decent job with it.

[PatrickStormborn]

The show is a faithful adaptation. Stannis and Mel is as obvious in the books as Loras and Renly, and I'm sure we would have got a very graphic sex scene if Mel had been a POV character while Stannis was still at the Wall.

A Free Shadow, on 09 April 2012 - 04:11 AM, said:

Asha/Yara came across as not so much intelligent or daring (as in the books), but simply spiteful and a brute.

I've got to admit - I thought the exact opposite. I didn't like Asha at first in the books, but I think Yara seems more compelling and more in line with what we learn about her in AFFC.

mrnegativity, on 09 April 2012 - 04:16 AM, said:

Too many brothel scenes?? GRRM vividly describes vaginas as 'c***s' in the books and happily writes about incest, but nudity and sex on screen 'makes you...ill'?

Kudos for remaining faithful to GRRM's violently sexual world, IMO.

Exactly. Readers have been describing GRRM's sex scenes as "gratuitous" since AGOT was first published. The show seems no different to me.

Edited by PatrickStormborn, 09 April 2012 - 04:32 AM.

[Princess of the Night]

I gave it a ten, because I think it was waaaaay better than the first one. I really liked it.

Asha is not what I imagined her like, but I think the actress is perfect for the role. And Balon, too. Loved it.
There might be a little too much time for Ros and Littlefinger, but to people who never read the books, it means a lot to see the relationship between Littlefinger and Catelyn..

And as far as Joffrey ordering the bastard killings, well, whatever. Cersei's time is yet to come, let the audience hate Joffrey a bit more..

[A Shadow]

Fire&Blood, on 09 April 2012 - 04:22 AM, said:

Like I said - taking it as a separate entity. 9/10 as a show, pretty damn crap as an adaptation of these excellent books.

I'm getting a little better at separating books from the show too. It really helps. Still such a big difference compared to season one, when all was new to me.
No regrets for reading the books though They are amazing

[Tywin's bastard]

I thought the first episode worked well but this is still a clear step up, mainly because most things are on their way and the tempo could be lowered a bit. It's clear that the entire machine working on GoT knows better how to work now than last season, which I suspect will pay off immensely when things really get going.

Pyke was amazing. This season has been a step up in production values overall and it made seeing the Iron Islands really joyful. The acting keeps on being done well and these characters will certainly add to the show in a great way.

I actually liked the added scene with Ros and Littlefinger quite a bit since we get to see one of the most fundamental parts of him, which of course is his ruthless efficiency, and Aidan acted it very well by slowly going from one thing to another. He's not emotionally attached to many things in the world and it's both why he's so great at finances, as well as a good part of why his schemes are of the kind that can succeed.

I don't have a problem with Stannis having sex with Melisandre either. It's a fact that it happens in the books and that he's aroused doesn't bother me. In the books we hear that he slept with his wife out of duty but she's a completely different person than Melisandre. I don't think the fact that Stannis can be aroused changes him (even most of the driest men can be in the right situation and Stannis doesn't have to be two-dimensional) and it's a clear way to show how Melisandre affects him and his decisions in a way that no one else can (which of course makes Davos' job very hard). As always, the number one rule in TV/film: Show, don't tell.

Fire&Blood, on 09 April 2012 - 04:22 AM, said:

Like I said - taking it as a separate entity. 9/10 as a show, pretty damn crap as an adaptation of these excellent books.

Could you point me towards a TV show, or movie, that adapts something comparable with far greater faithfulness then? It must be out there since you go so very far as to describe this adaptation as "pretty damn crap", which I hope no one would do without learning how to make proper expectations. It would be interesting to see such an example in order to compare witht his show.

Edited by Tywin's bastard, 09 April 2012 - 04:40 AM.

[Dracarya]

Loras and Renly wasn't very obvious to me at all in the books, I only knew because I saw season 1 first. I like the show, but I don't like the changes they're making from the books. Certain characters are being changed for reasons beyond me, there is too much sex, and I think the icing on the cake was Arya instantly trusting Gendry.  

Fuck me with a bloody spear, I didn't realise having a mixed opinion was a problem.

[Dracarya]

Tywin, on 09 April 2012 - 04:36 AM, said:

Could you point me towards a TV show, or movie, that adapts something comparable with far greater faithfulness then? It must be out there since you go so very far as to describe this adaptation as "pretty damn crap", which I hope no one would do without learning how to make proper expectations.

Why is everyone on my arse about this? It's just my opinion. I just think the changes they're making to the story are unnecessary, and are slightly ruining it for me. Once again, the show in itself is amazing, but as an adaptation of these books, I'm disappointed. And proper expectations? Please, you don't even know what my expectations were, so leave it out.

Everyone on here is so argumentative. Ridiculous

[Tywin's bastard]

Fire&Blood, on 09 April 2012 - 04:40 AM, said:

Why is everyone on my arse about this? It's just my opinion. I just think the changes they're making to the story are unnecessary, and are slightly ruining it for me. Once again, the show in itself is amazing, but as an adaptation of these books, I'm disappointed. And proper expectations? Please, you don't even know what my expectations were, so leave it out.

Everyone on here is so argumentative. Ridiculous

You don't have to get so defensive. This is a discussion board so people will, and should, discuss each others opinions. The only thing ridiculous about it is you calling that obvious fact ridiculous when it gets used in practice. For people that don't want to discuss it's better to start a blog.

Your post was a bit tricky to get a grip on so the reason for me asking about it (and it was an honest question) was to understand the contest you're coming from. In order to understand your point about how the show is as an adaptation it's interesting to know what you think adaptations are generally like.

[salt]

So far, Robert is the only Baratheon brother to have been portrayed faithfully in the show.  Renly in almost a completely new character, from what we saw in season 1 he retained maybe 15 percent of the essence of the book character.  Stannis also seems to have been changed pretty drastically, though its still early on.  Which is fine, it doesn't ruin the show, but its disappointing for the readers like me who thought the Baratheon brothers and their dysfunctional relationship with one another was one of the best parts of the books.

Aside from Stannis and the confirmation that it was Joffrey and not Cersei who ordered the killings ( ), I liked the episode.  The Iron Islands were great, very faithful to the Theon chapter in the book.  I loved Gendry and Arya ("You shouldn't insult people who are bigger than you." "Then I'll never get to insult anyone!").  OK episode, but out of the 12 we've seen so far this falls somewhere in the bottom 4 for me.

Edited by salt, 09 April 2012 - 05:30 AM.

[PatrickStormborn]

Fire&Blood, on 09 April 2012 - 04:37 AM, said:

Loras and Renly wasn't very obvious to me at all in the books, I only knew because I saw season 1 first. I like the show, but I don't like the changes they're making from the books. Certain characters are being changed for reasons beyond me, there is too much sex, and I think the icing on the cake was Arya instantly trusting Gendry.  

Fuck me with a bloody spear, I didn't realise having a mixed opinion was a problem.

I'm just incredibly surprised that so many people are shocked by the scene. How else did you think Mel got shadowbabies -- by having sex with Stannis while he slept? It's all but confirmed in the books, just like Loras and Renly (although, now that I think about it, Mel/Stannis is a bit more obvious). The reason they've had to show a sex scene between Mel and Stannis is because so many readers missed it. If the show simply hinted at it, I doubt many viewers would pick up on it.

Gendry knew Arya was a girl; she therefore had to explain why she was with the Night's Watch.

There is nothing wrong with "having a mixed opinion". I just don't understand how Game of Thrones could ever be called a bad adaptation. It's much more faithful to the books than I was expecting. Some things simply have to be changed.

[A Shadow]

salt, on 09 April 2012 - 05:30 AM, said:

OK episode, but out of the 12 we've seen so far this falls somewhere in the bottom 4 for me.

Today I deliberately went on various entertainment sites and read comments there. It differs like day and night from people, who have read the books,and those, who didn't. Viewers who just watch the show are amazed how good the episode was...

[A Shadow]

PatrickStormborn, on 09 April 2012 - 05:37 AM, said:

Gendry knew Arya was a girl; she therefore had to explain why she was with the Night's Watch.

She did not have to tell all. In the books their dynamics is quite different. And for those, like me, who really liked what was in the books, it is harder to watch. I understand that they have to hurry things up, but when the precious time is given to excessive brothel scenes instead...   I can not complain how they handled Hot Pie, even if none of it was in the books. It was perfectly done. Arya, on the other hand, seems not quite the same... So.

[PatrickStormborn]

A Free Shadow, on 09 April 2012 - 05:51 AM, said:

She did not have to tell all. In the books their dynamics is quite different. And for those, like me, who really liked what was in the books, it is harder to watch. I understand that they have to hurry things up, but when the precious time is given to excessive brothel scenes instead...   I can not complain how they handled Hot Pie, even if none of it was in the books. It was perfectly done. Arya, on the other hand, seems not quite the same... So.

Sorry, I should have worded that differently. I was shocked to see Arya revealing her identity so early, but I think it's an understandable change. I'm going to reserve judgement until I see how they've handled the Arya/Gendry relationship throughout the whole season.

[Stallion That Mounts Texas]

A Free Shadow, on 09 April 2012 - 05:39 AM, said:

Today I deliberately went on various entertainment sites and read comments there. It differs like day and night from people, who have read the books,and those, who didn't. Viewers who just watch the show are amazed how good the episode was...

Having read the books, this is worst episode to date: 4/10

1. I like sex scenes as much as the next man, but there comes a point were it becomes over the top and gratuitous.  As usual HBO has crossed that threshold.  But what do you expect from the channel that has brought you Six Feet Under, Rome and True Blood.

2. Not only do I not like the actor for Stannis, but I also would rather have any sex between Stannis and Mel to remain implied rather than be explicit.  I almost stopped watching the show I was so shocked.

3. Killing one of Dany's blood riders to save a buck?  Where was the sense in that?

4.  Having Theon finger his sister is just creepy.  No way Asha/Yara would allow it

If HBO is just gonna get paid to rewrite ASOIAF what is the point?