1. The one who conciously made a choice and effort to make Jon feel unwanted was Catelyn. That is a fact. That is what happened. You might want to give her a pass, because she wasn't given a piece of information? Whatever. She still did those things.
2. Wether Ned could have prevented her sucky behaviour, can never be told, because a secret Targaryen in Winterfell would still have been a threat to her family and she might have still threated Jon like a dog.
If you want to expand this discussion, maybe a new thread would serve?
My response to that:
Cat didn't treat Jon like a dog.
If you want a paralell, check what Cersei wanted to do to Robert's bastard and what she thinks of Cat accepting Jon under her roof. Cersei had no qualms about killing Gendry and all his half brothers and sisters. She even states in one chapter that she hinted to Robert she'd have Mya Stone assassinated if she was ever brought to Kings Landing. Bringing up bastards together with trueborn children is a huge affront to the wife or a lord. It's an embarrassment to her of massive proportions and people keep ignoring this over and over again. Cersei thinks that Cat must be meek as a mouse to accept such an insult.
Cat was distant and cold to Jon, she did not treat him like a dog. She lashes out to him once only.
If Catelyn wanted to exercise her "right" to be angry, I would have really welcomed her to lash out at Ned. I she was too weak to do that, abusing a child, who could not in any way get back, making him feel quilty of his very existance was the lowest of low.
As you bring this up again, I answer. But could I repeat myself and ask once more to keep this discussion in other threads, if it interests you. I'm sure you know there are dozens of them littering the boards. And I've read one or two, it did not in any way change my mind. Just to infrom you in advance.
Now, while Cersei is certainly crueller than needed, we do get an extra perspective from a lady as highborn as Cat and Cersei is very, very clear that fostering a bastard together with trueborn children is an insult and an embarrassment. To completely disregard Cersei's views on this would to be disregarding the generally understood way of things, since Cersei is quite judgemental.
Cat does talk to Ned about it, twice that we know of. The first time Ned tells her to never speak about it again, which is basically a STFU answer, and the second he is outraged that Cat asks that Jon needs to leave Winterfell.
I've posted about this before in another thread and I don't condone Cat for her lashing out at Jon at Bran's bedside, but the fact of the matter is, Cat was still much, much nicer about Jon's existence at Winterfell than she needed to and she had all the right on her side to be royally pissed off about it. Her lashing out seems to be about all her pent up rage, embarraassment and frustration and yes, it's wrong to aim it at Jon Snow, but as Ned has stonewalled her....where is it gonna go?
I've written this before in another thread regarding not just the embarrassment of having a bastard fostered with her trueborn children, but on another aspect of Jon Snow/Cat as well:
Am I the only one who thinks Cat had very good reasons to be upset that Jon was around? It's seen as a huge slight for a husband to raise his bastards with his normal children. It's normally only muppets like Walder Frey who does this, so Cat had good reason to feel rather put upon by it, especially considering that she and Ned had a very happy marriage apart from that and that Ned did respect her in every other way.
Further, Ned always refused to tell her who the mother was or if he felt anything for her. The rumours Cat heard was that it was the ethereal beauty Ashara Dayne, which must have been pretty painful to hear, especially since that indicates that Ned preferred Ashara both before and after his wedding to Cat. So yeah, Cat had to endure the product of what she thought as her husband cheating on her every single day, plus the added embarrassment of what outsiders thought of it.
Despite this, she only snaps at Jon once, and that is under extreme pressure. Apart from that one time, we don't see her treat Jon unfairly or being mean to him.
Even though Cat chose being cold and distancing herself from Jon instead of causing all the issues she had every right to, people still insist she should have mothered Jon, despite it being against her entire upbringing and the traditions of Westeros to do so. Cat should then have been more selfless and forgiving, which would surely make her a better archetype for a demure mother and a far more traditional, tractable female character, but hardly an interesting character. Conflict creates tension and Cat's coldness towards Jon adds flavour to her character and she avoids being the stereotypical good, altruistic, demure mother.
Ned certainly could alleviate the situation, either by sending Jon to be fostered or by telling Cat the truth eventually, but he chose not to.
Link to original thread here.
Edited by Lyanna Stark, 17 April 2012 - 03:56 AM.