120 replies to this topic

[WolveseatDragons]

Arya has clearly gong through a lot of transformation and her loyalties are hard to forsee.  She certainly doesn't want to be a traditional lady but she still doesn't seem to be a FM.  She also has been prone to rage and revenge.  So what happens when she finds out that "Arya" has married Ramsay Bolton and that marriage is being used to justify the Bolton's taking Winterfell?  Will that be enough for her to leave the FM and go on a killing spree in Westeros?  I just don't see her standing idly by and not reacting.

[Lady Hodor]

I'm not sure. Part of being a Faceless Man is abandoning your past identity, so someone else stealing "Arya Stark" benifits her greatly in that she no longer has a place to go back to.
But I see what you mean, there is still some part of her that wants to cling to the Stark in her, that might stir upon hearing of the conflict.
I guess whatever the Faceless Men have her do will effect this, if she cant kill someone, then she has no choice but to be Arya, but if she can kill as ordered, then she's in for good.

[ARYa_Nym]

She already knows I just think she was too young to understand what she was hearing.

[A Shadow]

I think it will help her to feel more free. And when she comes back quiet as a shadow, she will be able to do what she plans.

[Serie]

I think she'll be angry. Maybe that will be the event that will trigger her leaving the FM....

I agree with what Lady Hodor says. Methinks though that this "some part of her that wants to cling to the Stark" is a bit bigger.


ETA:

ARYa_Nym, on 19 April 2012 - 11:21 AM, said:

She already knows I just think she was too young to understand what she was hearing.

I'm so ashamed to admit that but... I'm clueless to what are you referring?

Edited by Serie, 19 April 2012 - 11:24 AM.

[WolveseatDragons]

I just have this lovely image of Needle being stuck up Ramsay's ass, or maybe Walder Frey's.  I also think the fact that she hid Needle when she gave up everything has significance.

I just think Arya's heart isn't really in being a FM.  I think she likes killing but she also has a sense of justice and revenge.  The FM are really more about killing as a "gift" and not being emotionally involved.  Arya still loves her family and hates those that have harmed them and I think that will ultimately result in her leaving the FM, it is simply a matter of something pushing her over the edge.  Before when she had chances to leave she felt herself too weak to do anything, I don't know that she sees herself that way any longer.

[Apple Martini]

I'm not sure what will happen, but I don't think

Spoiler

It's an accident that Jeyne!Arya is going to Braavos where the real Arya is.

It makes sense for Stannis to send Massey, but it really seems like sending Jeyne is just a plot device to get her to interact with or be seen by Arya.

Edited by Apple Martini, 19 April 2012 - 11:47 AM.

[ARYa_Nym]

Serie, on 19 April 2012 - 11:22 AM, said:

I'm so ashamed to admit that but... I'm clueless to what are you referring?

Quote

"They found her too," said Polliver. "The sister. She's for Bolton's bastard, I hear." Arya sipped her wine so they could not see her mouth. She didn't understand what Polliver was talking about. Sansa has no other sister."

By this time she knew that her brother was dead and what happened to Sansa (she didn't understand that either). I think given her age she can't think figure out certain things like someone older than her would. She needs to be explained.

[Serie]

ARYa_Nym, on 19 April 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

By this time she knew that her brother was dead and what happened to Sansa (she didn't understand that either). I think given her age she can't think figure out certain things like someone older than her would. She needs to be explained.

thanks
no, I don't think either she did realized what they were talking about.

[SelaBela]

I can see her going and investigating, not in any official capacity as a faceless man, but just to see who her imposter is. From there, if she felt pity toward Jeyne's situation she might come forward and have vengeance, redeeming Winterfell etc. Just don't know how she would do that unless she had someone to back her, like Sansa, should she become a power of her own in the Vale.

I don't really think Arya will become a FM. Maybe its just wishful thinking!

[Sand Snake No. 9]

I don't think Arya ever, ever intended to really become a Faceless Man.  I think it's strongly implied throughout her POVs that what she wants is their skills and knowledge to get her own revenge.

Spoiler

Is it clear that Faux Arya is going to Braavos?  I thought Stannis' instructions were to leave her with Jon, although of course there will have to be a change of plan post the Ides of Marsh.

I think that if Arya learned that Ramsay was trying to claim Winterfell through a marriage to an imposter she'd be really angry, not because someone was pretending to be her, but because a Bolton was trying to claim Winterfell.

Oh, it would be so satisfying for Ramsay to meet his end at the hands of a little girl, but I think it won't happen for that very reason.  *le sigh*

[Apple Martini]

Sand Snake No. 9, on 19 April 2012 - 12:19 PM, said:

Spoiler

Is it clear that Faux Arya is going to Braavos?  I thought Stannis' instructions were to leave her with Jon, although of course there will have to be a change of plan post the Ides of Marsh.

Spoiler

They were, but with Jon possibly dead and her being a fake anyway, I have a feeling that she'll end up going with Massey. If, say, they're on the road and hear about Jon's "assassination," Massey could take her with him for her own safety.

Edited by Apple Martini, 19 April 2012 - 12:35 PM.

[Fragile Bird]

Arya is learning skills that will become very important in the bigger battles to come, but if she goes after the Boltons, it will be Roose, for Robb, not for fake Arya IMHO.  But if she runs into her, she`ll get an update on what exactly has happened.

The North Remembers, even against it`s own.

[chris999]

Sand Snake No. 9, on 19 April 2012 - 12:19 PM, said:

Oh, it would be so satisfying for Ramsay to meet his end at the hands of a little girl, but I think it won't happen for that very reason.  *le sigh*

This is perfect. The horrible way that Ramsay treats women. It is just fitting that he meets his end on the pointy end of a girl's sword.

Also, I am convinced that Arya is going to kill Ramsay because..


(TWOW spoilers)

Spoiler

I think that she will somehow be brought back by Massey(is that his name?) who is traveling to Bravoss to hire sellswords. All of the good sellsword companies are already employed, so I think Massey will have to make do with what he can find

Edited by chris999, 19 April 2012 - 12:34 PM.

[the Scorpion Knight]

I think this is where Arya (as herself) comes back to westeros.
I even think she will eradicate the FM

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

1) She already knows.

“They’ll find her,” said Polliver. “If it takes half the gold in Casterly Rock.”

“A pretty girl, I hear,” said the Tickler. “Honey sweet.” He smacked his lips and smiled.

“And courteous,” the Hound agreed. “A proper little lady. Not like her bloody sister.”

“They found her too,” said Polliver. “The sister. She’s for Bolton’s bastard, I hear.”

Arya sipped her wine so they could not see her mouth. She didn’t understand what Polliver was talking about. Sansa has no other sister. Sandor Clegane laughed aloud.

“What’s so bloody funny?” asked Polliver.

The Hound never flicked an eye at Arya. “If I’d wanted you to know, I’d have told you. Are there ships at Saltpans?”

2) People seem to have a complete misunderstanding of the faceless men

The Common Tongue came to the waif more quickly. One day at supper she turned to Arya, and asked, “Who are you?”
“No one,” Arya answered, in Braavosi.
“You lie,” said the waif. “You must lie gooder.”
Arya laughed. “Gooder? You mean better, stupid.”
“Better stupid. I will show you.”

One day the kindly man came on her unexpectedly and asked what she was doing. She told him that she had gotten lost.

“You lie. Worse, you lie poorly. Who are you?”

“No one.”

“Another lie.” He sighed.

The don't want her to lose her identity.  They want to not be able to tell whether she's lying or not. Whether she is who she says she is or not.  Which for the purposes of their test is the same thing, anyway.

Compare that to...

He cupped her under the jaw, raising her chin, his fingers pinching her painfully. “And that’s more than little birds can do, isn’t it? I never got my song.”

“I... I know a song about Florian and Jonquil.”

“Florian and Jonquil? A fool and his cunt. Spare me. But one day I’ll have a song from you, whether you will it or no.”

“I will sing it for you gladly.”

Sandor Clegane snorted. “Pretty thing, and such a bad liar. A dog can smell a lie, you know. Look around you, and take a good whiff. They’re all liars here... and every one better than you.”

Edited by Lord Littlefinger's Lash, 19 April 2012 - 01:36 PM.

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

the Scorpion Knight, on 19 April 2012 - 12:43 PM, said:

I think this is where Arya (as herself) comes back to westeros.
I even think she will eradicate the FM

Such a confused creature.  But what can you expect from someone who like Randall Tarly and mislikes dear sweet Petyr.

Arya is, always has been, and is incapable of being anyone but, herself.  

Which I suppose in and of itself invalidates the premise of your second statement.

But why would Arya destroy the group the brought down the vast slaving empire of Valyria?  The organization that give Bravos the ability to punch well above its weight as they win wars against Pentos, Volantis and beat back the last vestiges of the Ancien Régime?

[Lord Littlefinger's Lash]

Apple Martini, on 19 April 2012 - 12:25 PM, said:

Spoiler

They were, but with Jon possibly dead and her being a fake anyway, I have a feeling that she'll end up going with Massey. If, say, they're on the road and hear about Jon's "assassination," Massey could take her with him for her own safety.

Where does it say Jon is dead?

[Apple Martini]

Lord Littlefinger, on 19 April 2012 - 01:20 PM, said:

Where does it say Jon is dead?

WoW stuff should be in spoilers.

Spoiler

It doesn't say that Jon is dead. But my thinking is, Massey and Jeyne could hear about the assassination attempt on their way up to the Wall, and Massey ends up taking her to Braavos with him instead of dropping her off at Castle Black. I thought I explained this.

Edited by Apple Martini, 19 April 2012 - 01:23 PM.

[Lyanna Stark]

Lord Littlefinger, on 19 April 2012 - 01:07 PM, said:

The don't want her to lose her identity.  They want to not be able to tell whether she's lying or not. Whether she is who she says she is or not.  Which for the purposes of their test is the same thing, anyway.

Nice catch. It goes hand in hand with both Sansa and Arya losing their identities and posing as someone else. By AFFC/ADWD they are both pretty successful at this. It also means that they are learning skills the traditionally minded Ned and Cat did not possess. Arya and Sansa are being prepared for a crueller world in a way.

I really want them to end up ruling Winterfell together while waiting for Rickon to come of age. The she-wolves of Winterfell. I think they'd make an amazing team, sort of good cop (Sansa) - bad cop (Arya).