18 replies to this topic

[Frank the bunny]

First off, yes, I am aware that the vast majority of characters are not inherently good or evil... but, do you guys think that by the end there will be a main evil force? The leader of the others? Winter itself? What do you guys think?

I know the "evil dark lord/god thing from the far wretched north" is a bit of a cliche, yet I think the "great" other may make an appearance. Perhaps a final clash with AA no?

[A Song of Ice and Fire]

The evil forces are White Walkers that are beyond the wall. Enemy of Westeros is probably Daenerys Targaryan.

[LuisDantas]

My money is on Stannis.  Or if he dies soon enough, I guess it will be the White Walkers.

[Golden Lady]

I think it will be the White Walkers. All houses have that enemy in common

[Brienne the Beauty]

It would be a bit of a let-down to have a conventional Dark Lord after all the complexity so far.

[Arkash]

Are we talking about the books or the series here ?

[LuisDantas]

The series, I have just noticed.  Supposedly it won't make a difference, but who knows.

[Alex Baratheon]

LuisDantas, on 03 May 2012 - 05:26 AM, said:

The series, I have just noticed.  Supposedly it won't make a difference, but who knows.

If it doesn't matter, then I say it'll be Crow's Eye.
The whole Ironborn mess is a time bomb just waiting to blow...

[Knez Snow]

Well in the series it seems that Joff being mischievous with a flaming dildo is pretty much best bet for main antagonist so far.

[CrypticWeirwood]

The true enemy is the Others from the Land of Always Winter.  You don’t even need to call them evil for them to be inimical, but all those Animate Dead spells they keep casting do smack of necromancy and other wickedries.

That’s why those who play at the game of thrones are such fools, fiddling away  while the kingdom not burns but freezes.  Ned was right, and they were — and are — wrong.

[Stark Wolf]

The theart of the White Walkers will finally bring the relm together. We have the two heads of the dragon the third to be revealed and they will burn the White walkers with dragon fire. My best guess!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Francis Buck]

Well, personally I do not believe there will be one single person or group that is easily definable as the "main antagonist", and that includes the Others. At the end I believe there will be two big human armies fighting against each other, with neither being totally good or totally evil, and will fall into a general category of either Ice (Starks, the North, the Old Gods, White Walkers) and Fire (Targayrens, the South, R'hllor, Dragons), with Ice being led by Jon and Fire being led by Dany. I think the whole point of the series is that ice and fire need to re-balanced, not that Winter is just all bad and that Dany's gonna come in at the last second to save all of Westeros with her magical dragons.

I'm not going to rattle all of the evidence I think there is for this, because there's too much and I've already done it about thirty times on this forum, but that's my opinion and I've yet to see any other that I thought was more convincing. And I would literally bet money that the end of the series won't simply be all of humanity rallying together against the big bad Others. It's just too obvious, too simple, and too generic.

Edited by Francis Buck, 03 May 2012 - 10:34 AM.

[boojam]

Frank the bunny, on 22 April 2012 - 01:35 AM, said:

First off, yes, I am aware that the vast majority of characters are not inherently good or evil... but, do you guys think that by the end there will be a main evil force? The leader of the others? Winter itself? What do you guys think?

I know the "evil dark lord/god thing from the far wretched north" is a bit of a cliche, yet I think the "great" other may make an appearance. Perhaps a final clash with AA no?

According to the Red Woman (she has a name!)(in Davos III) in SoS shows Davos a vision of the Mother of All havoc and war is coming between the Lord of Light, the Heart of Fire, the God of Flame and Shadow and the Great Other whose name may not be spoken, the Lord of Darkness, the Soul of Ice, the God of Night and Terror.
(If Great Other is its name it just got spoken.)(Got another moniker?)

[Francis Buck]

GRRM already said that none of the deities themselves will ever make a personal appearance in the story. So if the Great Other does show up, then it's going to be a normal character like Bloodraven or something (my personal choice); in other words, a character that simply has a certain title without actually being a "true" deity (much like how the Old Gods turned out to be super-wargs living in the weirwood-net, and not divine beings in the traditional sense). A lot of this comes down to your definition of what does or doesn't qualify as a "god", though.

[PatrickStormborn]

The White Walkers, the wildlings and Joffrey have been set up as the main antagonists so far, although Littlefinger, Cersei and Tywin will probably start looking more antagonistic as the series progresses. Stannis and Mel are probably seen as antagonists at the moment, but they'll gradually be seen more positively.

Daenerys may very well be an antagonist ... But so far she's putting Westeros in a lot less danger than Balon, Robb, Tywin, Joffrey, Stannis, etc.

Edited by PatrickStormborn, 03 May 2012 - 12:29 PM.

[Prince of Braavos]

I'm worried about spoiling too much of the books, but I think Daenerys is the Big Bad.  Not like she'll be the only enemy or anything so simplistic, but I think she'll be wreaking havoc and everyone will realize they have to take her down.  That's why her storyline started separately but is always so prominent: the end-series twist is that Daenerys's entire storyline has actually been the Big Bad's origin story.

This is simplistic, I know, but I mean it in the broadest strokes; I know if it happens it will be more complex than this.

[Francis Buck]

Prince of Braavos, on 03 May 2012 - 02:14 PM, said:

I'm worried about spoiling too much of the books, but I think Daenerys is the Big Bad.  Not like she'll be the only enemy or anything so simplistic, but I think she'll be wreaking havoc and everyone will realize they have to take her down.  That's why her storyline started separately but is always so prominent: the end-series twist is that Daenerys's entire storyline has actually been the Big Bad's origin story.

This is simplistic, I know, but I mean it in the broadest strokes; I know if it happens it will be more complex than this.

I also agree with this to a point, and that's partially why I believe she will be on the opposite side from the Starks (and thus the whole Ice/Fire division of two armies, plus the Old God/Red God division).

[dreamcatcher]

I actually think it's Daenerys, she's so self-entitled she doesn't even notice all the shit she's causing. She won't be the Big Bad, though, I think she's clever enough to figure out (right before the end) that the Iron Throne doesn't matter at all.

[Hyper]

Francis Buck, on 03 May 2012 - 10:28 AM, said:

I think the whole point of the series is that ice and fire need to re-balanced, not that Winter is just all bad and that Dany's gonna come in at the last second to save all of Westeros with her magical dragons.
...
And I would literally bet money that the end of the series won't simply be all of humanity rallying together against the big bad Others. It's just too obvious, too simple, and too generic.

Yes, yes, yes, and yes.

Its a bit shocking to me how many ASOIAF fans think that after all the complexity of the books so far, that we are going to end with a climactic good vs evil fight. No. While it is possible that GRRM could lose his mind and screw this up, it is not likely.

While the show be different? That is certainly more likely - but I wouldn't bet on that either. HBO shows don't tend to have simple, happy endings.

Edited by Hyper, 03 May 2012 - 08:13 PM.