12 replies to this topic

[Ran]

Non-spoiler discussion of the show goes here, for those who've not read the books or those who have but are happy to not actually reference them at all in discussion, taking each episode as it comes.

This topic should open automatically when the show begins airing.

Edited by Ran, 20 May 2012 - 06:21 PM.

[Fragile Bird]

All and all, a pretty sad episode, considering where all the characters are headed off to.  They could have called it, The Forks in the Road.

[FirelordSylar22]

Amazing episode, very calm before the storm-ish.

[justashadow]

Good point Firelord.

Liked Yara this episode..she finally has some human quality to her. Too bad, Theon doesn't.

Did Halfhand set Jon up with the wildings..he did make a comment, "Do what you have to do" or something like that.

Also, Tyrion/Varys scenes.



Brienne's reaction to Jaime - priceless.

Didn't think that it would be that easy to walk out of Harrenhall but I liked how Arya set Jaqen up .

And lastly, Bran and Rickon - good ending...Nobody would have thought.

My guess is that some storylines are most likely finished as next week will be the big battle scene and Dany's visit to the HotU. I figure Jon & Arya in finale.

Edited by nightshadow, 21 May 2012 - 01:16 AM.

[teamocil]

This was the most aggravating episode by far.  I hate it when major plot developments hinge upon characters acting unaccountably stupidly, and in this episode, everyone seems to have dropped about 50 IQ points compared to before.

• Theon acted like an idiot, but at least that is consistent with before.  But do his men not see that they are completely screwed if they stick around Winterfell?
  
• Arya apparently just dicked around doing nothing, until... Tywin just leaves?  That's it?  All that awesome Tywin/Arya interaction, and that's the resolution?  They just go their separate ways?  This retroactively ruins all those great scenes from before.
  
• Tywin : why exactly is he hurrying off to fight Robb right now?  Wouldn't it make more sense, if he's going to leave, to help out his beseiged kids at King's Landing?
  
• Robb : it's hard to believe that someone so good at tactics and strategy could fail to see that backing out of his marriage contract is going to cause problems down the line.
  
• Catelyn: yes, we know from last season that she's not the brightest bulb, but holy shit, it is not believable that anyone would be so stupid as to release Jaime like that, with no reason to think that the Lannisters would give her kids back.

It was also frustrating to have no development on the Dany / dragon plot line.  I've been loving this season, but this episode was a major step down.  At least it looks like next week's episode will be epic!

[drigoly]

teamocil, on 21 May 2012 - 01:56 AM, said:

This was the most aggravating episode by far. I hate it when major plot developments hinge upon characters acting unaccountably stupidly, and in this episode, everyone seems to have dropped about 50 IQ points compared to before.

• Theon acted like an idiot, but at least that is consistent with before. But do his men not see that they are completely screwed if they stick around Winterfell?
• Arya apparently just dicked around doing nothing, until... Tywin just leaves? That's it? All that awesome Tywin/Arya interaction, and that's the resolution? They just go their separate ways? This retroactively ruins all those great scenes from before.
• Tywin : why exactly is he hurrying off to fight Robb right now? Wouldn't it make more sense, if he's going to leave, to help out his beseiged kids at King's Landing?
• Robb : it's hard to believe that someone so good at tactics and strategy could fail to see that backing out of his marriage contract is going to cause problems down the line.
• Catelyn: yes, we know from last season that she's not the brightest bulb, but holy shit, it is not believable that anyone would be so stupid as to release Jaime like that, with no reason to think that the Lannisters would give her kids back.

It was also frustrating to have no development on the Dany / dragon plot line. I've been loving this season, but this episode was a major step down. At least it looks like next week's episode will be epic!

* his own men are beginning to respect him, besides running off would mark them as traitors and they would be drowned
* yes, but he is leaving her in the care of gregor clegane, maybe he thinks that no one with an iq of over 10 would consider running away from the most brutal men in Westeros, so maybe he would want her back someday?
* when did he say that he is hurrying off to fight Robb? he just said that they need to force march through the night and that Robb shouldn't know that they are on the move, he didn't say where they are going nor whom they are going to fight
* He did know, but love > intelligence
* aye

[Fakko]

Tyrion & Roz:  Tyrion is still the Hand of the King and as such commands more control than the queen. Why can he not simply command her release?  Joffrey foolishly wants to go into battle so, it would not appear he is in league with Cersei on this matter, if he even knows about it.

Also, I am dumbfounded that Tyrion's immediate response to Shae wasn't GTFO!  Why wouldn't he immediately send her away now that Cersei has shown her hand?

Tyrion & Varys is as good, if not better, than Varys & Littlefinger from season 1.

A rather abrupt ending to the Arya & Tywin Show, but all good things ...

I like how she coerced Jaqen into helping her and her friends escape.

It seems that Daenerys getting to The House of the Undying is as difficult as Clark Griswold getting to Wally World.

The Days of our Lives: The Starks with Robb and his lovely field surgeon continues to bore the eyes from my skull. She is lovely (even more so naked), but their storyline is dull to me.

Brienne and Jamie is interesting. I predict it not ending well for Brienne though. A dumb move for Catelyn though. I understand why she would do it, but it won't bear fruit IMO.

Theon continues to struggle for validation from somewhere and gets nothing. So tragic.

[drigoly]

Fakko, on 21 May 2012 - 07:37 AM, said:

Tyrion & Roz: Tyrion is still the Hand of the King and as such commands more control than the queen. Why can he not simply command her release?

Cersei is not only the wife of the former king, she is also queen regent to Joffrey, meaning that Tyrion is her hand in fact but both know that their power is dependent on their father, so both have to be carefull not to publicaly sabotage each other.

[justashadow]

Stannis & Davos..they seemed  calm before battle. I thought Stannis asking Davos to be the Hand was spot on.

Edited by nightshadow, 21 May 2012 - 10:17 AM.

[chico]

Fakko, on 21 May 2012 - 07:37 AM, said:

Joffrey foolishly wants to go into battle so, it would not appear he is in league with Cersei on this matter, if he even knows about it.

I think Cersei is just trying to find ANY way to gain some traction at this point.  She is resorting to brute force, which means she's losing the knowledge/tactics game.  She has no control over Joffrey; Tyrion knows this, which is why he went along with things when they brought Roz in.  Tyrion is letting Cersei think she still has any cards left.

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Also, I am dumbfounded that Tyrion's immediate response to Shae wasn't GTFO! Why wouldn't he immediately send her away now that Cersei has shown her hand?

Because Shae isn't in any danger.  If Cersei was so confident that she got the right whore, no need to freak out and do something rash.  Obviously Shae's quarters are still fairly safe.

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Tyrion & Varys is as good, if not better, than Varys & Littlefinger from season 1.

I couldn't agree more.  Tyrion, Varys, AND Bronn though - oh my!  

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A rather abrupt ending to the Arya & Tywin Show, but all good things ...

I kind of figured we'd get something abrupt - either separate ways or Tywin finding out that it was Arya.  There really weren't many other options there...

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I like how she coerced Jaqen into helping her and her friends escape.

Masterful.  I also like the implication, at least IMO, that agreeing to un-name him possibly means she's still got one more name to use.  After all, the guards were just in Jaqen's way to honoring this new agreement - Arya didn't name any of them.  I don't think we've seen the last of Jaqen - at least, I hope not.

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It seems that Daenerys getting to The House of the Undying is as difficult as Clark Griswold getting to Wally World.

Yeah, what is that all about.  We get 1 scene with Dany & Jorah?  Bah.  That was a little weak...

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The Days of our Lives: The Starks with Robb and his lovely field surgeon continues to bore the eyes from my skull. She is lovely (even more so naked), but their storyline is dull to me.

I don't agree here.  We needed to see Robb make a decision for himself.  "A King takes..." as many others have been wont to say.  I don't think he ever intended on marrying the Frey girl anyway; it was merely a war tactic.  He's been hell-bent on returning to Winterfell with the rest of his family intact.  He has no need for a wife or an alliance with a bridge owner hundreds of miles away.  I think it gives us a reason to continue to root for the Starks - just because Ned is gone and they are scattered to the wind, they are still good people just trying to find one another again.

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Brienne and Jamie is interesting. I predict it not ending well for Brienne though. A dumb move for Catelyn though. I understand why she would do it, but it won't bear fruit IMO.

I didn't particularly like the way the scene with Jamie & Brienne was shot.  She kept turning her back to him and it didn't look like he was tied up other than his hands.  I'll have to re-watch the episode (of course), but surely he could have just grabbed her sword or dagger?

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Theon continues to struggle for validation from somewhere and gets nothing. So tragic.

I disagree here.  I think Theon got a lot of validation from his sister.  She was reaching out and telling him that she's always loved him and he's realizing that he's always loved her.  So even if their father traded him away, his sister never forgot him.  And she doesn't want to leave him behind now, but the choice is his.  That's pretty validating in my book.  

[justashadow]

I rewatched it again....I have to say that Bronn/Tyrion/Varys scenes had great dialogue especially Bronn.

[WinterWarrior]

I watched the episode again and I have to comment on what a great actor the guy who plays Joffrey is. The scene where he is blustering about cutting a smile on Stannis' face and he pulls out his sword a little was so obnoxiously played, it was perfect. He really does the obnoxious clueless brat of a boy king role to the hilt. I think he is very, very, good in the role.

And I think the actor who plays Bronn has that role down perfectly as welll - and Varys too. The Varys/Tyrion scene which was part of the Joff scene is priceless. I could not imagine a better job of portraying Joff, Bronn, Varys and Tyrion than what these skillful actors are doing.

[elementaru]

WinterWarrior, on 25 May 2012 - 08:27 AM, said:

I watched the episode again and I have to comment on what a great actor the guy who plays Joffrey is. The scene where he is blustering about cutting a smile on Stannis' face and he pulls out his sword a little was so obnoxiously played, it was perfect. He really does the obnoxious clueless brat of a boy king role to the hilt. I think he is very, very, good in the role.

couldn't agree more. though the character is very unlikable, actor that is portraying him is just wonderful - you have to admire him:)

one question about the scene with Tyrion and that prostitute. I understand that queen decided that she is Tyrion's love because someone found some jewelry that she was carrying that was Tyrion's. can someone remind me how she got that jewerly? was it from first episodes when Tyrion was visiting Winterfell?
also, why she was pretending that she is Tyrion's true love? what's in it for her? she may suffer torture, she is locked down, why is she just playing along? or does she really believe that Tyrion care for her?

also, this is probably not from this episode, but can someone remind me, when Littlefinger was visiting Tywin, he didn't recognize Arya, right?