WolveseatDragons Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I had a real fear with Ramsay and the Reeds being cut this season that the House of the Undying would fall victim as well. It is by far the most important thing that happens to Dany imo in this season but it is likely expensive and difficult to film as well as being loaded with flashbacks and prophecies which the show has avoided so far. I am looking forward to that episode more than any other this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crannogman Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Same here, but I am really curious how they are going to pull it off. I was also wondering if they are going to show all of the flash backs and foreshadowing that Dany experiences, or if they are just going to send her right to the undying and bypass all of the other rooms. We will see I guess. If they do it right, it will be amazing to see this on screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unborn Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I expect nothing from the house of the undying. I fear it might get severly cut, so if we get something cool out of it I will be pleasantly surprised instead of disappointed :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Others have said it better then I, but if its filmed literally its going to look like a David Lynch film and quite possibly turn off a lot of people. I think we'll be seeing some camera tricks to get around actually showing any of the stuff described in the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrum Aeternum Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Pree's immediate and forthright invitation to the HoU makes it clear to me that D&D consider this to be an important part of Dany's quest, and in fact the pivotal stop for this season.I have put more thought into how this scene can be adapted for TV, than perhaps any other in the series. Honestly, as much as I love the sequence in the book, I can't imagine a way to pull off most of the major content without the entire thing coming across as terribly confusing or at the very least cheesy. That kind of stuff has worked on a certain level for a few TV shows in the past (Sisko's interactions with the Prophets in DS9 being the best example I can think of at the moment), but it wouldn't quite fit the tone this series has established thus far. Hopefully D&D have some good ideas that can convey the general feel and concept of the HoU across without quite making it a literal translation, similar to what they've done with Bran's dreams. I think the Warlocks' table and Drogon's roasting of the Heart will remain, as it's a great opportunity for a breakout dragon action sequence. Though how they'll convey the significance of the event for Dany to the viewer is anyone's guess. Maybe the Warlocks themselves will talk of the PTWP, the dragon having three heads, etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarah.jenice Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I was very excited to hear it, too. This is such an important part of Dany's story and so many of our theories are based on that sequence that I have been dying to see what they include in the show.I can see them maybe skipping directly to the audience with the Undying, but I think the RW foreshadowing and the Rhaegar scene should be included. I've been looking at the episode names, but can't really decide which one it may appear in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 If they had intended to cut the House of the Undying, they would have cut Qarth altogether. The House of the Undying is the main (and one might say only important) plot point in the whole Qarth plot, so I would have been really surprised if they had included Qarth but cut the House of the Undying.About the visions:They could cut Aerys and Rossart, and even corpse-king Robb, but they have to include in my opinion the following scenes:1. Rhaegar, Elia, and Aegon - the stuff about the promised prince and the Song of Ice and Fire (I'm confident about that, since Melisandre already mentioned the 'place of smoke and salt').2. The blue winter rose growing at the Wall (or a similar hint pointing towards Jon Snow)3. The King without a shadow (Stannis) and the cloth dragon on pole (Aegon) as false saviors.4. The Mother-thing and other hints about Dany's future (the fires, the treasons, and the mounts) should at least be mentioned by the Undying if it's not shown directly, since this might become important. The same about 'the stone beast breathing shadow fire'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantôme Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I don't have much hope for this scene. If they do show the visions it's not going to make any sense for the non-readers. For exemple, since we didn't get any of ned's reminiscences about lyanna (the "promise-me"s, the tower of joy , the blue roses) the elements hinting to R+L=J would be totally useless. As for the Rhaegar&Elia scene, I don't think they could make the identities of the characters as obvious or as interesting for the viewers as it was for us (except by using their names maybe) . And the show's name is not asoiaf so it probably wouldn't make a great impact to mention it . I do think they'll keep the "three,three,three" stuff (at least the treasons) but I won't get my hopes up for the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx The Riddle Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 1. Rhaegar, Elia, and Aegon - the stuff about the promised prince and the Song of Ice and Fire (I'm confident about that, since Melisandre already mentioned the 'place of smoke and salt').2. The blue winter rose growing at the Wall (or a similar hint pointing towards Jon Snow)if they showed this all nerds would rewind and play about a hundred times in a row Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkash Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 The blue winter rose is such a vivid and powerful image, really emotional, I hope we got it ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightwisp Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 I hope the House of the Undying is not cut totally out. This is one of the most interesting parts of the book. I think the prophecies would be a mystery to nonreaders but if done correctly I think even nonreaders would find this scene intriguing Sure, not every detail can be presented, but I think the prophecies still can be done, even if only briefly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peasant Rebel Leader Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Didn't Pyat Pree's and Xaro Xoan Dhaxos description of the House sound different than in the book. More "natural" in the way that it's just warlocks studying books, taking drugs and trying magic. The way Xaro was speaking down to them didn't ring right the way he does in the books...From, a story arc perspective, I'd guess the house will be the climax for Dany this season. Act 1: Exposition in the Gardens (Pyat's invitation, Xaro's proposal, Quaithe's warning and the Spice King as the most powerful man last episode, Act 2: First catastrophe - next episode something happens, maybe the Dothraki will "rebel" or create tension with the Spice King so that he demands something of Dany or Xaro, Act 3: Proposed solution, Act 4: Total Catastrophe and Solution - plan goes wrong, Dany has to go to the House of the Undying as a last resort. Act 5: aftermath - getting kicked out of Qarth, Arstan saving her or something.This way, the House is perfectly suited for an episode ender, I'd guess we haven't heard Dracarys for nothing this episode. But the prophecies will take second place to the needed solution for the plot. If the sequence is too long, it gets boring, if the Undying just speak, it gets boring, if Dany has too walk, it might take up too much airtime. So I'd guess they'd do something with the drug she has to take and those images flowing past her, make her murmur to what she sees and make the images blurry or not realistic, maybe they are shadows whirling on the wall, blue things speaking to her. The whole set up with "always take the door to the right" is not necessary for the house of the undying, what is that she is on her way to the Undying, she has obstacles and during those, she sees some prophecies and some things of the past... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrum Aeternum Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Didn't Pyat Pree's and Xaro Xoan Dhaxos description of the House sound different than in the book. More "natural" in the way that it's just warlocks studying books, taking drugs and trying magic. The way Xaro was speaking down to them didn't ring right the way he does in the books...Show-Xaro is a different character than in the book, so it makes sense he'd offer a different view on the House. It seemed to me that he was trying to downplay the House and the Warlocks in general, with more than a bit of scorn. Probably trying to sate Dany's curiosity about the place by making it seem mundane and foolish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkash Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Same here! And wasnt it the same in the books ? Xaro trying to convince Dany not to go to the HotuH by telling her how useless it is... ? And then bam... best Dany scene of the book ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeRuiner Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 It is possibly my favorite chapter in all books. I don't mind the writers taking liberties with it as long it is done well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elfangle Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 I think they will just stick with the 3 heads of the dragon thing and the wolf dinner. All the rest will not be clear to viewers that never read the book (Rhaegar, Elia and Aegon) since i can't really remember any information about them during the shows. The blue rose might be in it as a reference to Jon (or Mance for the believers) but it has to be explained rather quickly because otherwise people will simply forget about it since it is not as strong as the prophecy of the tree heads and the fate of the young wolf.The difficult thing will be to make it seem so other worldly like it is in the books. The problem with that is that attention will be drawn away from the actual important things. In the books, you can read them again and again and decide your own speed. And even then it was a pretty hard read for me (just because of the freakiness of it all). It might be hard for people to during the show to distinguish between the important things and all the craziness happening on the screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkash Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 I'm wondering if D&D are reading us to see our expectations... would be fun if one day they'd aknowledge reading us here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheese Pudding Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 I want to see the Red Wedding metaphor, the winter roses growing and Rhaegar. If they show the Cloth Dragon, wow, that would surpass my expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolveseatDragons Posted May 1, 2012 Author Share Posted May 1, 2012 There is actually one other major event in Quarth, Dany meets Selmy and he saves her from the Sorrowful Man. They will need to age the dragons a bit before she goes in to the HoTU because no one would believe that little dragon would burn it down after last week. My guess is that Dany becomes somewhat de-emphasized the next few weeks and is skipped at least once or twice in the shows with the HoTU as the finale and previous episodes having her meet Selmy and develop some relationship with Xaro. That would give her time to realize that everyone wants to use her for her dragons and she can trust no one while letting the dragons get a little bigger.As for the HoTU itself I think is ok if it is confusing to the viewers to an extent. They have thrown around more and more magic and I don't think the HoTU is as out there as the "shadow baby". Part of the allure of the HoTU is a big "WTF?" the first time you read it. People go back to re-read it just as they will go back to re-watch it, most folks have the ability to rewind. It also gives the show an opportunity to play catch up on some things they have glossed over and from a structural perspective it really doesn't matter how it looks in the HoTU as much as the feeling of daze and confusion combined with prophecy. If done right it will really engage the viewers by getting them to want to know what will happen next because of the hints that occur there. They could also make some things more obvious visually and in terms of the spoken word to make it less confusing. For instance having Ella say "Rhaegar" in that scene would help and having the Undying speak slowly and clearly what the prophecies are will help. Having something like this will also encourage more folks to re-watch the previous episodes, buy the DVD's, and read the novels.Mainly though, this just excites me that they will have some more prophecies going forward which made the books so interesting. All you have to do is look at the forums here and see those are the enduring topics of interest and part of what makes the books so compelling. I am hopeful that the rumors that they did some filming last year showing Robert's Rebellion scenes that were "cut" was simply about thinking forward to future seasons when they can show flashbacks with actors that have long since been killed off in the show. Of course that is my optimism speaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Well, I don't really expect to see the blue rose, but if they wanted, they could show us the symbols along with glimpses of the faces of the people they stand for (i.e. blue rose/Jon, shadow king Stannis, cloth dragon/Aegon, and so on).They already introduced the whole Mel prophecy stuff, it's time that the audience is going to get a hint that the true savior Mel is looking for is not Stannis but Daenerys.And if the House of the Undying is going to establish the first hint that Jon Snow might be Dany's nephew I'll not complain at all (although there is only the very subtle winter rose hint in the book). After all, this would be the best opportunity to do so. And hinting at the fact that Daenerys still has to face a lot of trials and that her claim is going to be challenged by other pretenders/false saviors will also establish her as one of the main characters of the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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