413 replies to this topic

[Visual909]

hmmm Bran and Howland are strong candidates although there has to be a reason for Howland to leave if he knows not just..."hey i ffeel like revealing Jon's mother's identity to him. time to go to the wall." Although Robb's will maybe a tipping point for him to leave to find Jon. Assuming it made it at all and would be honored.

[alienarea]

Maybe Jon finds out while dying? Like:

He saw a woman's face. Shh called his name. "Come home, Jon." He had only seen her once, long ago. "Mother?" She smiled. "Yes, Jon. My name is [insert your choice]." Then there was only darkness.

[Blackfyre Bob]

Daario, on 01 May 2012 - 08:34 PM, said:

I don't think anyone will tell him straight up.
More likely Bran will guide him to Winterfell crypts where a clue lies about his identity.
Someone with historical knowledge (such as Sam) will be with him and tell him what it means when he pulls Dark Sister from Lyannas grave.

I strongly concur.  Awesome notion about Dark Sister in Lyanna`s grave

[Lexy Boleyn]

Here's an idea I recently had

I think that DwD prologue, with a warg surviving many deaths, hints that Jon will survive. When he comes back to life, in a way or another, he kills the Black Brother in him as he killed the boy, and, learning about Robb's will, travel to get it; in the last chapter, the epilogue perhaps, he comes to face Howland Reed; this follows:
Jon: Are you Lord Reed? I'm...
Howland: I know who you are. I was waiting for you.
Jon: What?
Howland: I was waiting for you, Jon, son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark.
End. Another seven years of waiting.

[Knez Snow]

All of the Reeds, Bloodraven and Benjen probably know. And Jojen is probably Howland so unless Bran ate him he can reveal it. Also Bran can magic it out, and Ashara and Wylla maybe know. (btw is it possible that Wylla is Ashara?).

[wertham]

Knez Snow, on 03 May 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

All of the Reeds, Bloodraven and Benjen probably know. And Jojen is probably Howland so unless Bran ate him he can reveal it. Also Bran can magic it out, and Ashara and Wylla maybe know. (btw is it possible that Wylla is Ashara?).

How can Jojen be Howland... or Wylla be Ashara?

Edited by wertham, 03 May 2012 - 11:02 AM.

[Knez Snow]

wertham, on 03 May 2012 - 11:01 AM, said:

How can Jojen be Howland... or Wylla be Ashara?

Well there is this crazy theory that Howland is aging in reversal after he visited green men. Things like 'Jojen was born old' and Jojen wondering why Ned have not told Bran about Harenhall turney, and fact that Jojen has green dreams and him saying he knows the day he will die are some indications. Maybe there are more. I think it is still considered crackpot, and I am not sure has it been refuted. This Wylla and Ashara thing just occured to me, but i guess it is stupid.

[wertham]

Knez Snow, on 03 May 2012 - 11:11 AM, said:

Well there is this crazy theory that Howland is aging in reversal after he visited green men.

I'd not heard that before. I just assumed Howland sent Jojen & Meera to the Starks while he "went to ground" at the Neck.

But is does seem strange that nothing has been said about Howland in a long while (has it been years?)

Edited by wertham, 03 May 2012 - 11:43 AM.

[IceGal]

dreamcatcher, on 01 May 2012 - 05:01 PM, said:

What about Benjen Stark? (Coldhands, I think) I always thought that maybe he knew. He's not stupid, he knows Ned more than anything, he knew Lyanna, he knew Rhaegar, I'm sure he'd at least figure it out on his own based on Jon's looks and Lyanna's infatuation to Rhaegar.

I've always felt that Benjen was conveniently gotten out of the way to avoid discussion of Jon's parentage. After Ned, Benjen and Howland Reed are the most likely people to know of Jon's mother, and both are out of the picture.

[Dornish Bannerman]

If Septa Lemore is Ashara Dayne, she probably has told Jon Connington about it. I mean if she knows Jon is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. Maybe this would make him try to kill Jon? To rid him out of the way for his Aegon?

[Im With Stannis]

1. The mother is Lyanna. I'll accept nothing less.

2. I always hoped it would be Ned, like in a dream or something by a weirwood tree.  Idk, i just think it would be more emotional then a complete stranger (Howland Reed) walking up to JS saying "Hey, I used to know your father. Btw, your mom is Lyanna and your real father is Rheagar. Bye!" I think it may be Benjen. Why would be in the story just to mysteriously disappear and never show up again?  I still think he'll come back and will tell Jon Sow all the secrets he's been holding.

Edited by Im With Stannis, 03 May 2012 - 04:11 PM.

[Eggplant Wizard]

I would lol pretty hard if it was Ned and a random woman of no significance. That would be some nice egg on the face of all the theorists haha.

[Lord Davos Seaworth]

Howlen Reed, aka Jojen, is the only survivor who knows the truth.

[blackseer]

Dornish Bannerman, on 03 May 2012 - 04:04 PM, said:

If Septa Lemore is Ashara Dayne, she probably has told Jon Connington about it. I mean if she knows Jon is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. Maybe this would make him try to kill Jon? To rid him out of the way for his Aegon?

If Lemore is Ashara (which I'm still skeptical about), why would she tell JonCon? There seems to be no reason to do so so far. She might do it, if they ever meet Snow.

[Apple Martini]

Dornish Bannerman, on 03 May 2012 - 04:04 PM, said:

If Septa Lemore is Ashara Dayne, she probably has told Jon Connington about it. I mean if she knows Jon is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. Maybe this would make him try to kill Jon? To rid him out of the way for his Aegon?

Aegon's older than Jon, so his claim would be superior anyway. No need to kill Jon.

[CrypticWeirwood]

If Lady Lemore is Princess Elia’s handmaiden Ashara Dayne, then what did Ned tell Ashara right after the Tower of Joy that convinced Ashara to fake her own death, and how does it connect with her current rôle catering to Aegon’s spiritual needs?  How would Ashara have been duped by some post-facto swap around of a child of Serra Blackfyre and Illyrio, far off in Essos?  She wouldn’t.

That doesn’t add up.  There’s a critical piece missing.

[Apple Martini]

CrypticWeirwood, on 03 May 2012 - 10:30 PM, said:

If Lady Lemore is Princess Elia’s handmaiden Ashara Dayne, then what did Ned tell Ashara right after the Tower of Joy that convinced Ashara to fake her own death, and how does it connect with her current rôle catering to Aegon’s spiritual needs?  How would Ashara have been duped by some post-facto swap around of a child of Serra Blackfyre and Illyrio, far off in Essos?  She wouldn’t.

That doesn’t add up.  There’s a critical piece missing.

Before the Septa Lemore thing, it occurred to me that Ashara might have faked her death in order to protect what she knew about Jon's parentage. I think she's the one who told Ned where to find Lyanna. It's also possible that the Ashara-as-Jon's-mom thing came about so if he looked like a Targ when he got older, people could assume it was his Dayne side. But in order for Ned to take him, Ashara — his "mother" — needed to be out of the picture. Otherwise, I think it'd look weird for Ned to claim him and not his "mother," and then people would ask questions.

[alienarea]

Apple Martini, on 04 May 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

Before the Septa Lemore thing, it occurred to me that Ashara might have faked her death in order to protect what she knew about Jon's parentage. I think she's the one who told Ned where to find Lyanna. It's also possible that the Ashara-as-Jon's-mom thing came about so if he looked like a Targ when he got older, people could assume it was his Dayne side. But in order for Ned to take him, Ashara — his "mother" — needed to be out of the picture. Otherwise, I think it'd look weird for Ned to claim him and not his "mother," and then people would ask questions.

And may I ask for your opinion after the Septa Lemore thing?

IMHO Jon has too many 'common' behaviors despite being raised with Ned's and Catelyn's children, being an argument against Rhargar and Lyanna or Ned and Ashara as parents. And I speculate there is some wildling blood in him and it comes from Wylla. But that is just my opinion.

[Onion Ring Knight]

Apple Martini, on 04 May 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

Before the Septa Lemore thing, it occurred to me that Ashara might have faked her death in order to protect what she knew about Jon's parentage. I think she's the one who told Ned where to find Lyanna. It's also possible that the Ashara-as-Jon's-mom thing came about so if he looked like a Targ when he got older, people could assume it was his Dayne side. But in order for Ned to take him, Ashara — his "mother" — needed to be out of the picture. Otherwise, I think it'd look weird for Ned to claim him and not his "mother," and then people would ask questions.

Interesting theory (or is it "thaery"?) but what is Ashara's motivation to do this? I mean, why give up her life as a privileged young woman in an ancient noble house and go into hiding? Just to protect the identity of the child (Jon) of her Lady's (Elia's) arguably-cheating spouse (Rhaegar)? Why would she even care, or at least, care enough to throw her whole life away?

[CrypticWeirwood]

Bloody Bastard of Barfield, on 04 May 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

Interesting theory (or is it "thaery"?) but what is Ashara's motivation to do this? I mean, why give up her life as a privileged young woman in an ancient noble house and go into hiding? Just to protect the identity of the child (Jon) of her Lady's (Elia's) arguably-cheating spouse (Rhaegar)? Why would she even care, or at least, care enough to throw her whole life away?

That shows how important  a piece to the puzzle it is that we’re all somehow missing.

Her motivation for feigning suicide followed by exile just doesn’t make good strong sense unless Aegon were her own child, and even then, probably only if it were also Rhaegar’s, not Ned’s.  And that child had to be there right then and there when she left.

On the other hand, if she had just had a still-born baby, she could have been Aegon’s milk-nurse. But where’s her motivation for exile?  That argues that Aegon must really be Rhaegar and Elia’s son.

Either way you look at it, Ashara makes no sense if Aegon is just some random child unrelated to her or the royal couple, like some a Blackfyre pretender born years later and pawned off on her while she was in exile.

That just doesn’t wash.

What is Ashara’s angle?

Figure that out, and everything else will fall into place.

I’m pretty sure that Arthur and Ashara Dayne were respectively Rhaegar’s and Elia’s best friends.  It’s still a lot to ask though.  I can’t come up with any motivation for Ashara that makes any sense unless Aegon is the child of one or more of Ashara or Rhaegar.  She wouldn’t give up her life for a nobody.

Edited by CrypticWeirwood, 04 May 2012 - 12:24 PM.