26 replies to this topic

[udpaco13]

This is a major contridiction from the book series.  The FM are all about the Many Faced God aka Death aka the Great Other aka the opposite of the R'lohr(sp).  Anyone else upset by this?

[Independent George]

No, because, as has been noted several times in the episode discussion thread, it was taken almost word-for-word from the books.

Quote

"A man pays his debts. A man owes three."

"Three?"

"The Red God has his due, sweet girl, and only death may pay for life. This girl took three that were his. This girl must give three in their places. Speak the names, and a man will do the rest."

[Francys Targaryen]

A man mentioned the red god because he was about to be consumed by an inferno..

Edited by Francys Targaryen, 01 May 2012 - 01:44 PM.

[Jon Snows Ghost]

Isn't he a servant of the Many Faced God? The Red God, Old Gods, The Seven......all the same to him I think

[Prince of the North]

Francys Targaryen, on 01 May 2012 - 01:43 PM, said:

A man mentioned the red god because he was about to be consumed by an inferno..

Yes, this.  The Faceless Men view all gods as simply being different versions of the same thing - hence The Many-Faced God.  If Arya had given them the means to save themselves from drowning instead of burning Jaqen would mention that the Drowned God must be repaid three deaths instead of the Red God.

[Haberdasher]

Yes he follows the Many-Faced God, but if you were an FM, would you really go around announcing it? Of course not. I was concerned about it initially as well, but this "face" that he's using is a Braavosi (hence the speech style) and the red god is far more popular in essos than westeros so I'm ok with it. It's part of his cover.

[Mr. E]

As someone said earlier, it's also straight from the book.

[Ororo727 Jon Snow Fangirl]

Haberdasher, on 01 May 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

Yes he follows the Many-Faced God, but if you were an FM, would you really go around announcing it? Of course not. I was concerned about it initially as well, but this "face" that he's using is a Braavosi (hence the speech style) and the red god is far more popular in essos than westeros so I'm ok with it. It's part of his cover.

it's not a matter of a cover. It is a fact, that three deaths were taken from R'Hllor, therefore the lives must be given. He is a FM. If someone where saved from drowning, he would have said, the drowned god.

[Reposado]

Ororo727 Jon Snow Fangirl, on 01 May 2012 - 07:55 PM, said:

it's not a matter of a cover. It is a fact, that three deaths were taken from R'Hllor, therefore the lives must be given. He is a FM. If someone where saved from drowning, he would have said, the drowned god.

maybe. but in the end. he says this line line in the book.

[Ororo727 Jon Snow Fangirl]

BaelorBreakspear, on 01 May 2012 - 08:38 PM, said:

maybe. but in the end. he says this line line in the book.

I never said that he didn't. I know this.

[Zappotack]

Ok one thing I never got if they were saved from being burnt and sent to the red god. Shouldn't the 3 lives given be burnt to give him his due, if it were the god of death this would be different...

[Hyper]

Zappotack, on 01 May 2012 - 10:10 PM, said:

Ok one thing I never got if they were saved from being burnt and sent to the red god. Shouldn't the 3 lives given be burnt to give him his due, if it were the god of death this would be different...

Yes and No. The faceless men believe that all deities associated with death are the same god. So Ultimately the dead will go to the same destination, no matter how they die. The "red god" comment was just shorthand for death by fire.

Edited by Hyper, 01 May 2012 - 11:41 PM.

[boojam]

udpaco13, on 01 May 2012 - 10:21 AM, said:

This is a major contridiction from the book series.  The FM are all about the Many Faced God aka Death aka the Great Other aka the opposite of the R'lohr(sp).  Anyone else upset by this?

So you have read books 4 and 5? ... The Faceless Men's philosophy has been complicated up since the time George wrote CoK.
Let this sleeping dog lay.
Argument about it has caused me nothing but grief.

[Zappotack]

Hyper, on 01 May 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

Yes and No. The faceless men believe that all deities associated with death are the same god. So Ultimately the dead will go to the same destination, no matter how they die. The "red god" comment was just shorthand for death by fire.

Oh thanks for clearing that up

[packersfan]

If straight from the book, GOOD...I heard him say that and was a little concerned.  I can't remember what he said in the book, so if it is right from the book, OKAY!  Great!

[Mr. E]

Hyper, on 01 May 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

Yes and No. The faceless men believe that all deities associated with death are the same god. So Ultimately the dead will go to the same destination, no matter how they die. The "red god" comment was just shorthand for death by fire.

See, now, I always interpreted it that Jaquen was a follower of R'Hollor, but understood that R'hollor (and the seven, Old Gods, etc.) was still just an aspect of the many-faced god.

Akin to if I found out that Jesus, Odin, Allah, Zeus, etc. etc. were one many faced god...I'd still probably say I'm a follower of Jesus, even though I know that Jesus would be just one aspect of this whole god...

did that make any sense?

[Hyper]

No I don't think that analogy works here. Followers of R'Hollor don't believe in multiple gods. Just theirs, and the 'evil one' - the opposite. This is a very different philosophy compared to the faceless men and many-faced god worship.

Edited by Hyper, 02 May 2012 - 01:32 PM.

[bloocanary]

Haberdasher, on 01 May 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

Yes he follows the Many-Faced God, but if you were an FM, would you really go around announcing it? Of course not. I was concerned about it initially as well, but this "face" that he's using is a Braavosi (hence the speech style) and the red god is far more popular in essos than westeros so I'm ok with it. It's part of his cover.

Forgive my nitpickery, but he's actually using a Lorathi disguise. He says so when he introduces himself to Arya. But, as we know nothing about Lorath other than the fact that it's an island, it's possible that they follow the Red God there. But I think he'd refer to him as the Lord of Light if he were actually pretending to be a follower.

Also, I don't think he ever bothers to actively hide that he's a FM to Arya, since he changes his face right in front of her later on.

[boojam]

bloocanary, on 02 May 2012 - 05:33 PM, said:

Forgive my nitpickery, but he's actually using a Lorathi disguise. He says so when he introduces himself to Arya. But, as we know nothing about Lorath other than the fact that it's an island, it's possible that they follow the Red God there. But I think he'd refer to him as the Lord of Light if he were actually pretending to be a follower.

Also, I don't think he ever bothers to actively hide that he's a FM to Arya, since he changes his face right in front of her later on.

Some one should educate reviewers and commentators , who I guess have not read the book, that Jaqen is NOT a criminal.
One of the teleplays should let the audience in on that some how and not wait until the Arya and Jaqen scene.
Seems , not sure, even Arya figures that out, before that last scene, I think she is educated enough to know about the FM.
He is, in fact, the most dangerous man in Harrenhal.

Edited by boojam, 02 May 2012 - 07:30 PM.

[BoldAsYouPlease]

Prince of the North, on 01 May 2012 - 02:23 PM, said:

Yes, this.  The Faceless Men view all gods as simply being different versions of the same thing - hence The Many-Faced God.  

The FM are Hindus? Who knew?