69 replies to this topic

[Fylimar]

I like Myrcella a lot and am still hoping, that Maggys prophecy doesn't necessarily mean the death of her and her brother.
About becoming king: I could see Stannis on the Iron Throne - without Melisandre of course. He has to get rid of her somehow. And I don't think, that he would kill a whole family - and since neither Myrcella nor Tommen are trueborn kids of Robert, they have no claim to the throne and aren't really a danger to Stannis or anyone else claiming the throne (one of the one hundred Trags, prowling the lands perhaps). I would be more afraid, if Daenerys would claim the throne - she seems to be hating the Baratheons, Lannisters and Starks a lot and could very well want to have revenge for her family  - but maybe, she gets another reality check by Barristan.
Whoever will sit on that piece of scrap iron at the end, I hope, that Myrcella and Tommen somehow make it through alive - they are really not to blame for their mothers actions.

[NOc]

She's going to die.  Maggy's prophesy, Stanis's break before bend attitude, and the Dornish scheming all lead to her being killed.  It is upsetting, because other than Joffrey, the children are kind.  I'm surprised at that.  How did they get to be sweet while he became ruthless and spoiled?

[cuendillar]

Simply because Cersei always focused almost all her attentions and tutelage on Joffrey. She did not take nearly as direct a hand in her other childrens education, especially not about ruling. Tommen and Myrcella were loved, as much as Cersei could love, but never corrupted by her. Joffrey was told since he was very young that it was his right (not duty) to rule and that he would define right and wrong. No wonder a child gets worse than arrogant from that...

Who knows, Joffrey might even have turned out a nice kid if raised by Ned or Jon Arryn.

[Fearsome Fred]

Tewks44, on 03 May 2012 - 01:42 AM, said:

wait, what?  Perhaps my memory is failing me but I remember from one of Arianne Martell's Chapters that she recalled Myrcella being wounded, but to me it never seemed implied that Myrcella was killed.

Arianne recalls Myrcella being wounded and feverish.  She was worried that Myrcella might die.  That is the last DIRECT evidence we have of Myrcella being alive.

Note that people in these books do become feverish and die after suffering wounds.

[Fearsome Fred]

Dr. Pepper, on 03 May 2012 - 02:24 AM, said:

Arianne did see Myrcella after the attack as she coached her in what to say.  

No.  This is never established.

Quote

Whether or not she coached Myrcella or Myrcella's impersonator cannot be confirmed.  

This is also true.  But neither is it established that she coached anybody.

[ThePrinceOfSunspear]

Shes scarred for life and is missing one ear.....not to mention she is the product of incest.

She can say goodbye to the marriage with Trystane. Prince Doran of Dorne probably already knows and believes that she isn't Roberts true daughter and simply agreed to the betrothal because of the game hes playing.

Once Dorne revolts he'll end it.

Myrcella will die unfortunately. So will Tommen I suspect.

[Fearsome Fred]

Raksha the Demon, on 03 May 2012 - 05:18 AM, said:

If Myrcella died of her wounds, Doran could send this girl back; but he'd have to have her killed during the journey, perhaps by assassins wearing Tyrell colors, and her face disfigured, so Cersei wouldn't recognize that the dead child wasn't Myrcella.

Not necessarily.  Doran need only DELAY the inevitable discovery until he is ready for open war with the Iron Throne.  And he is already making such preparations.  For instance, he has sent a military force to the border to unite with Darkstar's forces, to prepare a surprise attack.

[Fearsome Fred]

Jaehaerys Sand, on 03 May 2012 - 02:22 PM, said:

Yeah, I've heard this theory, but I don't by it. Doran seems to make it pretty clear to Arianne Myrcella lived.

This is at the same point where he was insisting to Arianne that Quentyn was still at home.  He does not trust her at this point and has no reson to tell her secrets.

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And if she did die, it would mean Doran had an innocent girls face cut open to copy the wounds, [...]

No.  He need merely cover her face with bandages and salve, which impedes facial recognition, and makes it more likely that the double will be mistaken for the real Myrcella.

Note, this is very similar to something that has already happened.  The fake Myrcella sat, in the dark, with her face covered in maester's salve, while Arianne made off with the real Myrcella.

Quote

[...] and I can't see him doing that.

I can.  But there is no reason to assume he did.

[jarl the climber]

Its also possible that Myrcellas death would give the Martells the oppurtunity to hire a Faceless Man to kill Tommen while disguised as Myrcella. Then potentialy you could have a FM sitting on the Iron Throne.

[Melpomene]

I'm a Marcella fan myself, she is quite likable. Clever, empathetic, strong personality, and is kind to people like Tyrion and knows their worth.


I'm worried about her future - I'm particularly worried on account that she wouldn't be dubbed as "useful" anymore, on account that she wouldn't be considered pretty. It's sad, in this world a girl's top worth is her looks (Along with good bloodline), overshadowing other attributes like intelligence. I hope she doesn't get rejected by anyone or treated horribly differently. Including Trystane, I hope he would be kind to her.



Anyhoo, there is a good chance she won't make it, but I really hope she will survive till the end of the series.

[Fearsome Fred]

Melpomene, on 04 May 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

I'm a Marcella fan myself, she is quite likable. Clever, empathetic, strong personality, and is kind to people like Tyrion and knows their worth.

It was Tyrion who sent her to her death.

UNCLE TYRION FEEDS THE SNAKES

CERSEI: My only daughter! You can’t POSSIBLY mean to send her to Dorne. They HATE us.
TYRION: Myrcella will be perfectly safe in Dorne. So, stuff it, you dumb female. I am playing the GAME OF THRONES.
[later]
TYRION: Okay. Off you go, Myrcella. I shall send Rosamund as a lookalike decoy with your to keep you safe on your journey.
MYRCELLA: Bye Uncle Tyrion.
[later, in Dorne]
MYRCELLA: Hi Everybody. I’m Princess Myrcella. Uncle Tyrion sent me to marry Prince Trystane.
DORNISH: A Lannissster! YESSS!!!
MYRCELLA: Hey, why are you all looking at me like that?
DORNISH: At lassst! REVENGE!!!
ARIANNE: Let usss get revenge by making her QUEEN.
DARKSTAR: No, let usss get revenge by SSSLAYING her.
DORAN: Yesss. Revenge. But not yet. Patiensssce. Patiensssce. I have PLANSSS.
ARIANNE: Ssscrew you dad, you ussselesss procrassstinator. Come Myrsscella, here’sss a golden crown. Now you are QUEEN of the Ssseven Kingdomsss, and can make war on your nasssty little brother.
DARKSTAR: Sssscrew that, Arianne. [chop, slice]
MYRCELLA: Aaargh! I am slain.
DARKSTAR: Now we MUSSST make war. We have no choisssce.
DORAN: [sssigh] Arianne! Darkssstar! Why will you not TRUSSST me? Just because I am cautiousss and deliberate, doesss not mean I am not jussst as evil. [Aside] But at leassst I ssstill have Rosssamund. I can pretend ssshe livess until I am ready to SSSTRIKE! And when I ssstrike, I will ssend Myrsscella'sss bonesss home in a boxsss, gift-wrapped in a golden ssshroud.
MYRCELLA: (dying) Uncle Tyrion, you suck.

[Pellaeon]

ThePrinceOfSunspear, on 04 May 2012 - 10:07 AM, said:

She can say goodbye to the marriage with Trystane. Prince Doran of Dorne probably already knows and believes that she isn't Roberts true daughter and simply agreed to the betrothal because of the game hes playing.

Once Dorne revolts he'll end it.

I never took Doran for somebody who would kill a child, he might use Myrcella for a plot by I doubt he would harm her, it's not his style

[JKeats]

Tyrion sending Myrcella to Dorne was a perfectly sensible thing to do.  How was he to know Arianne read Doran's letter to Quentyn all those years ago.

But hey, why pass up a chance to blame Tyrion for something?

[Dornish Bannerman]

Myrcella is probably alive. Doran already told about the ones he wanted to kill to revenge Elia, Rhaenys and Aegon. Myrcella went back to King's Landing with Lady Nym, and Cersei would see the difference, Doran would know. My Prince is no fool!

[Fearsome Fred]

JKeats, on 04 May 2012 - 01:26 PM, said:

Tyrion sending Myrcella to Dorne was a perfectly sensible thing to do.  How was he to know Arianne read Doran's letter to Quentyn all those years ago.

He does not need to know the specifics.  Cersei understood the crux of the matter.  She did not want to send her child among the Dornish, because "They hate us."  That is really all she, or Tyrion, really needed to know.

Nor did Tyrion disagree.  He just thought he was clever enough to rule out the possibility that Myrcella would come to harm in a pit of snakes.  He is in love with his own cleverness.  But what did he know?

Edited by Fearsome Fred, 04 May 2012 - 01:44 PM.

[The Storm Queen]

Fearsome Fred, on 04 May 2012 - 01:42 PM, said:

He does not need to know the specifics.  Cersei understood the crux of the matter.  She did not want to send her child among the Dornish, because "They hate us."  That is really all she, or Tyrion, really needed to know.

Nor did Tyrion disagree.  He just thought he was clever enough to rule out the possibility that Myrcella would come to harm in a pit of snakes.  He is in love with his own cleverness.  But what did he know?

I really want to like Tyrion again because he has his moments but his behaviour concerning Myrcella in one of the things that really made me dislike him: First the Dorne thing and later the fact that he contemplates using her as a pawn against her brother. Using his niece who always loved him unconditionally as a pawn only because he hates her mother is really a low point!

[BlueHighwind]

Don't you mean "Myrcella Lannister"?

[theguyfromtheVale]

Pellaeon, on 04 May 2012 - 01:20 PM, said:

I never took Doran for somebody who would kill a child, he might use Myrcella for a plot by I doubt he would harm her, it's not his style

You are buying into Doran's own propaganda as a weak, undecisive, ultimately harmless man. But we can see behind his facade, and there we discover something different. In his own words, Doran is out for Vengeance. Justice. Fire and Blood. Vengeance for what? Elia, Aegon and Rhaenys, obviously. But they died at the command of Tywin Lannister... and now Doran has Tywin's granddaughter under control. Do you really think Doran wouldn't take this chance at vengeance by paying back the Lannisters in their own coin? We see the same in Manderly: he's abhorred by the Frey's breach of guest right, but he also considers them unprotected by guest right themselves after the Red Wedding.

[Fearsome Fred]

theguyfromtheVale, on 04 May 2012 - 02:16 PM, said:

You are buying into Doran's own propaganda as a weak, undecisive, ultimately harmless man. But we can see behind his facade, and there we discover something different.

Right.  Doran seems himself as the grass that hides the snakes.

[Jaehaerys Sand]

Fearsome Fred, on 04 May 2012 - 10:20 AM, said:

This is at the same point where he was insisting to Arianne that Quentyn was still at home.  He does not trust her at this point and has no reson to tell her secrets.

He has every reason to tell her this secret, he needs her to convince Myrcella to lie about what happened. Why lie about that if it isn't Myrcella?

Fearsome Fred, on 04 May 2012 - 10:20 AM, said:

No.  He need merely cover her face with bandages and salve, which impedes facial recognition, and makes it more likely that the double will be mistaken for the real Myrcella.

Note, this is very similar to something that has already happened.  The fake Myrcella sat, in the dark, with her face covered in maester's salve, while Arianne made off with the real Myrcella.

Judging by what Kevan Told Cersei in Dance, it sounds like Ser Balon actually saw the wounds.

Edited by Jaehaerys Sand, 04 May 2012 - 03:05 PM.