63 replies to this topic

[FacelessDude]

Ok so just finished the part where Tyrion kills Shae. Tyrion found Shae sleeping in the Hands part of the castle (now occupied by Tywin). So did Shae sleep with Tywin? She had his necklace on and everything.

I know to seems like "duh, she was naked, in his bed!!!". But I just wanted to clarify it.

Edited by FacelessDude, 05 May 2012 - 04:44 AM.

[theguyfromtheVale]

Looks like it, yes. Which makes Tywin a ginormous hypocrite, of course.

[Lummel]

There are two schools of thought on this.  Yes Tywin slept with Shae and no, it was all a set up by Varys to make sure that Tyrion killed Tywin.

Both are quite nice in a way as depending on your view you can then either have Tywin as a self-righteous hypocrite or Varys as a vicious schemer.

[Francisco R. Fonseca]

IMO both are good theories and plausible, personally though I think Tywin had been sleeping w/Shae for a while.

[timjo3]

I want to believe they were sleeping together.  She goes where the power is and, if I were him, I wouldn't throw that out of my bed.

[Greywolf2375]

theguyfromtheVale, on 05 May 2012 - 08:09 AM, said:

Looks like it, yes. Which makes Tywin a ginormous hypocrite, of course.

And there is speculation that the secret tunnel that leads to the brothel was built for him - expanding just how much a hypocrite he may very well be.

[Chise]

so tempted to just snark "no, she was in his bed because her own room was being repainted at the time"

but yeah, Shae clearly slept with Tywin. He may have started to pay and screw her much earlier, during the trials. Shae is a ditz but she loves money, and if there's one thing Tywin has much (and way more than his kids) is cold hard gold!!

[WhiteWalder]

I think its a cobination of both theories.  Varys set it up so that Shae would sleep with Tywin at the right time and be caught by Tyrion.

[kwvapor]

The thing about this theory that Varys set it up is... How would Varys be able to read Jaime's mind, that he'd force Varys to rescue Tyrion.  Unless, he'd rescue Tyrion without Jaime's involvement?  To undermine the realm's hold on power and shake things up, a continuation of what he has been doing? maybe.

I hope the answer to this is revealed in the next book by Varys.

Edited by Censored Wolf, 08 May 2012 - 11:43 AM.

[flikQ]

This is why I love these books, not everything is in black and white, like reality, so conspiracy theories are rife! Love it!

[FacelessDude]

Well I heard Varys is all out for the Targaryen's, not the realm like he says. I don't know if it's revealed in FFC or DWD. Idk if it's true or not. But Varys could've set it up for Tyrion to kill Twyin so it could lead to Cersei's downfall, therefore the Lannister's downfall. Hmmmm....

[NedStark]

My opinion is that Tywin was sleeping with Shae and Varys wanted Tyrion to see that in order to take his father out of the picture but in the world of Westeros you can't be certain for anything.

[FacelessDude]

Lol @ Chise. Maybe her room was being repainted,  Jk haha.

But I was shocked when I found out Tywin was screwing Shae. I loved it when Tyrion told his father to stop saying whore, or something about whores, or else he'd shoot him. Then he didn't listen, and then Tywin gets what he deserves. Tywin projected all his inadequacies and himself onto Tyrion.

[A Bear covered in Fluff]

I dont think it was set up by Varys because tyrion had to drag the information about the ladder and tower from him whilst excaping. I think the Eunich actually didn't want Tyrion to see Shae in Tywin's bed. Strangely enough, i believe that varys actually had pity or something for Tyrion in the end.
It made me wonder what really did happen to Tysha....

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

Tywin always seemed like such a righteous, hard-line guy. But I guess with his wife dead for so long...plus she was naked on his bed. Who would refuse that?

Im a believer that Varys set the whole damn thing up though

[NotSoGreat Jon Umber]

In the end, Lord Tywin Lannister didn't shit gold

[Sigrid]

FacelessDude, on 10 May 2012 - 10:22 PM, said:

Well I heard Varys is all out for the Targaryen's, not the realm like he says. I don't know if it's revealed in FFC or DWD. Idk if it's true or not. But Varys could've set it up for Tyrion to kill Twyin so it could lead to Cersei's downfall, therefore the Lannister's downfall. Hmmmm....

I'm not totally sure what Varys's end game is.  I think that Varys is trying to keep lots of balls in the air, and one of those is the Targaryens.  I don't know about Varys setting up Tyrion to kill Tywin, because if Tyrion had gotten caught, then Varys could be in trouble and we know his loyalty ends where risk to himself begins.  I wonder if Varys is trying to steer Tyrion and his skilled political mind to Dany she could sure use some help when it comes to actual governance.

[Mephesto]

Tywin knew about her, when Tyrion was leading the hill tribes in the Vanguard.   He told him not to bring the whore to court.

As soon as he got to court, no doubt he saw here.   By then she was Handmaid to Lollys and Sansa, so he knew exactly who she was.

Tywin has a documented history of being extraordinarily cruel in his retributions for what he deems disrespect.    I would bet almost everything that he had been sleeping with Shae since the he returned to the capitol, just to spite Tyrion.  No doubt Varys told him about her if he didn't figure it out first.   He probably even intended for Tyrion to find out so it would crush him, but it just didn't happen.

No doubt Varys led Tyrion to what would surely be a murder.

The only thing about the whole scenario that I didn't get, what why did he lie to Jaime?   That plays strange to me.   He idolized him, and was saved by him, why would he lie to hurt him.    Tysha couldn't have been the cause of that.   Otherwise he would have hated Jaime forever.

[duffmid]

EDIT- Possibly a bit of a spoiler for the beginning of AFFC but only a little bit plus some wild speculation.

My first thought was that she was just a whore all along and she never really gave a damn about Tyrion, actually this is what I thought since she spoke at his trial.   But now as I go into the beginning of the next book and people cannot stop talking about how badly Tywin's body smells and he seems to be decomposing very rapidly.  So now I'm thinking could she have been there to poison Tywin and the poison is causing his body to break down much faster than it would normally?

Edited by duffmid, 19 July 2012 - 09:49 AM.

[SpareBoot]

not really a spoiler I guess Duffmid, but thats in AFFC, not ASOS