16 replies to this topic

[IceGal]

I'm re-reading AFFC, and came across this list of names for King Tommen's new dromonds. It's in one of the Cersei chapters half way through the book.

Sweet Cersei, Brave Joffrey, Lady Joanna, Lioness, Queen Margaery, Golden Rose, Lord Renly, Lady Olenna, and Princess Myrcella

Cersei lets on that the last five names were chosen by Tommen. I was struck by the fact that one of Tommen' ships is names Lord Renly! Isn't that like naming one of his ships "The Young Wolf" or "Lord Robb"? Why would the Lannisters allow that?

[Apple Martini]

Because Tommen's the king. And Renly was his uncle, after all. I think it's kind of sweet.

[IronSuitor]

Renly has been whitewashed by the Tyrell alliance. He's now one of the tragic victims of the evil Stannis.

[SerMixalot]

I was expecting a Tommen's Pussy

[Dracarya]

Aw because he's such a sweetheart!

[Grip]

I like how Princess Myrcella was a comprise, he was forced to chose that instead of something far superior IE Moon Boy..Ah sisters, always ruining everything!

[IceGal]

Apple Martini, on 08 May 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

Because Tommen's the king. And Renly was his uncle, after all. I think it's kind of sweet.

Seems more like Loras' idea to name it that (via Margaery)

[Tony Soprano]

I thought that he named it after Renly because he liked his uncle. Renly and Joffrey hated each other, but we didn't get any interaction between Renly and Myrcella or Tommen.

[IceGal]

To me those names - especially Queen Margaery, Golden Rose, Lord Renly, and Lady Olenna seem like Tyrell ideas planted in young Tommen's head. Maybe he was fond of his uncle (nuncle?) Renly, but he has no reason to be THAT fond of Lady Olenna! Plus Golden Rose sounds too poetic a name for a boy of 9 to come up with.

I think the names are Margaery's idea and point to the increasing influence of the Tyrells in KL. I find it interesting that Margaery chose to name a ship after her grandmother (and not any of the other Tyrells). Another clue that Margaery and Olenna are much closer than the books let on.

Another thing I found interesting was that Margaery gets a "Queen" before her name, while Cersei only gets "Sweet"

[Great Dayne]

I remember Tommen being a big fan of Loras, and as we know, Loras was a big fan of Renly.

[Fragile Bird]

Maybe it`s foreshadowing of who all is going to die, since ships are often named after dead heroes.  You don`t name ships after the living, because if it sinks it`s a really bad omen.  So Cersei, Margaery, Lady Olenna and Myrcella bite the biscuit, and Tommen survives, with no ship named after him, to be his mother`s valonqar.

[Greenseer Stark]

Fragile Bird, on 08 May 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

Maybe it`s foreshadowing of who all is going to die, since ships are often named after dead heroes.  You don`t name ships after the living, because if it sinks it`s a really bad omen.  So Cersei, Margaery, Lady Olenna and Myrcella bite the biscuit, and Tommen survives, with no ship named after him, to be his mother`s valonqar.

I definitely wouldn't put it past GRRM to include a little bit of foreshadowing like this.

[IVI4RCU5]

I think it's important to note that it's named the LORD Renly and not the KING Renly - so in a way, it's something of a rebuke to the Renly's notions of kingship.

And I too detect Loras's influence behind the decision to choose it.

Edited by IVI4RCU5, 08 May 2012 - 03:50 PM.

[Kung Fu Kiddo]

I agree with the others about the Tyrell's influence over him. He views them in a positive light, and since Margaery is his wife, his sweet, 8 year old mind so thoughfully included her family in the names of the royal fleet. Which, when I read them, caused me to chuckle. More like laugh. Tommen unwittingly trolling his mom. The best.

[siberia82]

Don't forget that "King Renly's Ghost" helped saved the day at the Battle of Blackwater. Lord Renly was initially viewed as a rebel, but his "spirit" redeemed itself by successfully defending KL---and the Lannister-"Baratheon" dynasty---from the "evil" Stannis. (I'm not sure if LF anticipated when he made the suggestion about Renly's armour to Garlan and Loras that it would also lessen the tarnish surrounding Renly's role in the War of Five Kings, but it ended up being a great PR move for the Tyrells because Margaery isn't really perceived as being the widow of a traitor/enemy.)

Along with the Tyrells' influence (it's easy for me to imagine Tommen wanting to please his hero Loras by naming a dromond after Loras' best friend), I like to believe that Renly was friendly to Tommen. (Tommen was no doubt closer to his uncle Tyrion, but I wonder if the kid's fondness has been greatly diminished now that Tyrion is wanted for Joffrey's murder). Renly is an amiable fellow by nature, so I see no reason why he would be mean or indifferent to his nephew Tommen, who's actually nice.

[chrisdaw]

You missed Lord Tywin in your list, the flagship.

[MotherAnduin]

It must be Margery who suggested naming the ship Lord Renly to appease the Stormlanders.