76 replies to this topic

[Mr. E]

Buckwheat, on 15 May 2012 - 07:05 AM, said:

And where in seven hells is Ghost?

Ghost is stuck in the netherworld of expensive CGI.

[Buckwheat]

Mr. E, on 15 May 2012 - 08:15 AM, said:

Ghost is stuck in the netherworld of expensive CGI.

Saaaaaad .

I rather like someone's explanation that he sees that Jon is a fool and he is ashamed of him and has abandoned him.

[Independent George]

Buckwheat, on 15 May 2012 - 08:29 AM, said:

I rather like someone's explanation that he sees that Jon is a fool and he is ashamed of him and has abandoned him.

My dog looks at me like that all the time.

[David Selig]

I found the Ygritte - Jon scenes in this episode cringe worthy. Lame "blue balls" jokes going on and on forever is not my idea of good television.

[dreamcatcher]

Ghost714, on 15 May 2012 - 03:45 AM, said:

As long as Jon turns his cloak on the last order of Qhorin Halfhand, I will be completely fine with the changes to the beggining of Jon's story with Ygritte. It will be hard being fine with Jon nonsensically chasing Ygritte, after deciding not to kill her, but I will do it. However, it's going to take some time getting over them making Jon look absolutely incompetent. In. Every. Single. Bloody. Episode.

Agree, you'd think they make him a bit less bratty considering he sort of grows up in the 2nd book PLUS that he's a lot older in the show. But he's acting like a 12-year-old in the skin of a twenty-something. WTH D&D??

Edited by dreamcatcher, 15 May 2012 - 10:27 AM.

[victim]

The sillier Jon seems now, the more badass he'll look later. TV is a much simpler medium than novels, I'm afraid.

[Shay Baratheon]

I was sooo waiting for her to say "you know nothing, Jon Snow", took a while to get there XD

Other than that, she was pretty much a she-Austin Powers

[SerMixalot]

Even the silly banter between Y and J would have worked if Jon said

"I Dont want to father any bastards, wilding!"

characterization and rational response to silly dialogue

[Sheep the Evicted]

I actually really like her too but i wish they could have found a way to get that out of her without ruining Jon Snow; he's many things but a bumbling idiot is not one of them.

[SerMixalot]

all that being said the actress playing Y is quite beautiful, of course I have a think for red hair and underbites

[So1ar]

Onion Smuggler, on 15 May 2012 - 04:58 AM, said:

I think that what they might have done, is that Jon and Qhorin have already come up with a plan that Jon deliberately "gets lost", and Ygritte manages to get him captured by the wildlings. The Qhorin turns up and to prove himself as a turncloak Jon kills him, they could have a flashback scene where Qhorin tells Jon what he must do before they attacked Ygritte's camp. That way they don't make Jon look incompetent because it was his plan all along to be captured and they have the scene where he kills Qhorin to prove himself. That's how I would do it anyway, they don't have many flashback scenes though.

That would be cool but I can't see it happening. TV Show Jon has been turned into a complete moron.

[Chelly]

Sheep the Evicted, on 15 May 2012 - 11:43 AM, said:

I actually really like her too but i wish they could have found a way to get that out of her without ruining Jon Snow; he's many things but a bumbling idiot is not one of them.

I agree. It has been mentioned repeatedly on the show about Jon being some dumb pretty boy. I never got that in the books. He was clearly naive and ignorant of much in the world, but I never got that he was stupid or slow. I found him to be fairly competent and he continued to grow up and learn more all the way up to ADwD.

Anyway, I love Ygritte and I already love her on the show. I think they made a very good casting choice here. She delivered "You know nothing, Jon Snow" perfectly.

[David Selig]

Yeah, Jon this season is so dumb and everyone owns him that it's too much even for me (and I've never liked him in the books, bashing him has been one of my favourite activities on this board). Really don't see how they'll sell to the viewers him being chosen for Lord Commander when they spent a whole season making him look completely incompetent and the butt of all jokes in his plotline.

[Prince of Dragonstone]

You have to remember that he is still a young guy. In the books he's what? 16? He's NEVER been with a girl sexually up to this point. His hormones are raging! Now this gorgeous, fiery, charismatic girl is throwing herself at him...what is he supposed to do? Act the perfect soldier? Not be distracted in the slightest? Women have been using their "feminine wiles" since the beginning of time to seduce, distract and coerce men into doing things they normally wouldn't do.

Edited by Prince of Dragonstone, 15 May 2012 - 12:15 PM.

[Patchface12]

Eddard Sand, on 15 May 2012 - 12:39 AM, said:

I'm still clinging to the hope that Halfhand gets to order Jon to kill him. It NEEDS to happen. I can still see it playing out not sure how.. but its possible.

Yeah, I hope Qhorin asks to talk to Jon in private as a kind of last request before he does him in. Jon just killing him seems out of character. Then again, Jaime killing his own cousin seemed out of character too and that didn't stop them from doing it

[Greywolf2375]

Prince of Dragonstone, on 15 May 2012 - 12:14 PM, said:

You have to remember that he is still a young guy. In the books he's what? 16? He's NEVER been with a girl sexually up to this point. His hormones are raging! Now this gorgeous, fiery, charismatic girl is throwing herself at him...what is he supposed to do? Act the perfect soldier? Not be distracted in the slightest? Women have been using their "feminine wiles" since the beginning of time to seduce, distract and coerce men into doing things they normally wouldn't do.

I don't have any problem with what she was doing, just how often they went back to that same well to see if there was more water with the same joke.

Patchface12, on 15 May 2012 - 12:19 PM, said:

Yeah, I hope Qhorin asks to talk to Jon in private as a kind of last request before he does him in. Jon just killing him seems out of character. Then again, Jaime killing his own cousin seemed out of character too and that didn't stop them from doing it

Jon just turning on Quorin and killing him would be a much larger departure in character than Jaime's was though.  I don't like how they've had them marching...somewhere...for a while, but whatever.  What I will be disappointed with - and this may be a nitpick to many - is if we do not get to see Squire Dalbridges stand for his brothers.  And not just die for them - the way he did it was to me one of the most heroic, bad ass moments in the series.

[Silverx2]

I think this is showing Jon out of his element. Jon has been raised as a fighter/lord/tactician Not as a ranger/guard. I think all of the "damage" jons character is taking now will quickly be erased when we see him fight QH, Defend the wall against the raider attack, and then ultimately when we see him defend the wall against the wildling army.

Jon was raised to be a leader among men, The old bear saw that, thats why he didnt make him a ranger, and was trying to groom him for command..

[Menos Grande]

TeamDanyArya, on 14 May 2012 - 09:34 PM, said:

Yeah, I don't want or need them to change her death in the series to it being Jon's arrow that did it. Keep that as is. And I don't think they are drastically changing their relationship dynamic too much at this point. She's kind of bratty in the books (which I loved) and made no secret that she liked him so her dialogue isn't that much of a stretch for me. I can see how a free wilding woman would question the institution of the Night's Watch and some of their vows. It's pretty sad that someone as young as Jon choose to confine himself is such a way and choose not to love a woman in his life. And for what? To protect the realm from things North of the Wall that may or may not be as evil as everyone has been led to believe.

He have that impression of the night's watch (and surely the Kingdom also). But we know now that the wall wasn't put there to hold the wildlings out, and yes to keep out lurks in the night out of nightmares out..
The Kingdoms are surely more powerfull than the free folk, they could conquer their lands if realy wanted to.. why they put the wall? Because of the Walkers/giants/Spiders/ and only the gods know what more lies at the other side.
By many years (or centurys) the Others slept and we thought we "were safe".  So the wall and the night's watch only fought Wildlings.. so both Wildlings and Night Watch (Hell the kingdom!) Think the Wildlings being the reason of the wall.
But as the others came back everybody remmembered the necessity of the wall, and that the man of night's watch stay true.
So I wouldn't say his vows are horrible, they're necessary, some one has to do it.

[Jayaris]

Jon is certainly looking rather silly, certainly not a man that the mighty Tormund Giantsbane would come to respect.

[dreamcatcher]

Silverx2, on 15 May 2012 - 12:51 PM, said:

I think this is showing Jon out of his element. Jon has been raised as a fighter/lord/tactician Not as a ranger/guard. I think all of the "damage" jons character is taking now will quickly be erased when we see him fight QH, Defend the wall against the raider attack, and then ultimately when we see him defend the wall against the wildling army.

Jon was raised to be a leader among men, The old bear saw that, thats why he didnt make him a ranger, and was trying to groom him for command..

By the time we come to that, everybody will hate him, readers and non-readers alike. When he dies everybody will be like YAY.