148 replies to this topic

[Ser Wun Wun]

I think the three heads of the dragon are the ones who will lead the fight against the Others, they will not all necessarily be dragon riders.

With that in mind, I think the three heads are Dany, Jon and Jaime (Jaime will not ride a dragon, Dany and Jon will).  I think Jaime is the bastard son of Aerys and R+L=J, so all three have dragon blood in them.  But they have assumed different identities based on their upbringing.  Dany stayed a Dragon, Jaime was raised a lion, and Jon a wolf.  That's what I think the prophecy means by three heads.

This is just the latest theory I'm ascribing to.  I seem to vacillate on this topic a lot because it is so open to interpretation.

Edited by Ser Wun Wun, 18 May 2012 - 03:25 AM.

[Dreadnaught]

I like the R+L=J theory but one thing bothers me.  Daenerys notes that Viserys was not a true dragon, because a true dragon would not be harmed by fire.  However, Jon burnt his hand saving Mormont.  So can he then be one of the heads of the dragon?

[Ser Wun Wun]

Dreadnaught, on 18 May 2012 - 03:43 AM, said:

I like the R+L=J theory but one thing bothers me.  Daenerys notes that Viserys was not a true dragon, because a true dragon would not be harmed by fire.  However, Jon burnt his hand saving Mormont.  So can he then be one of the heads of the dragon?

Daenerys isn't immune to fire either, that thing with the pyre was a special one time event.  She suffered minor burns when she rode Drogon in ADWD for instance.

So yes, he can still be a dragon.

Edited by Ser Wun Wun, 18 May 2012 - 04:04 AM.

[All For Joffrey]

I was really pulling for Biter to be one.

[Lord Martin Stark]

I believe they are Dany, Jon and Aegon. I do believe Aegon is for real but i do see him dying along with the dragon he rides

[Anzu]

Well we know dany should be 1 of the heads thats 100% sure.

other 2 splits between other people

Bran
Bloodraven
Daario ( or was it , i think was him that spoke of having bit of valerian blood in him)
Jon (some people think its very likly just becouse L+R=J , and if it does so what ? )
fAegon (Blackfyre or not he is technicly a Targ - afterall what his last name isnt very importent )
Tyrion (i never tought of that myself - but once someone mantioned him being 1 of 3 i instantly remeber him talking with Jon that he used to dream about riding dragons as kid ^^)
Melisandre - after all she is only (other then Dany ) person resistant to fire
Stanis - (his grandma was Targ - by gods i have Daario on this list so Stanis has a right to be here 2 ) the how is a problem yea...
Aegon Targaryen - (the real one) unless his dead or fAegon is real Aegon VI ,Illyrio and Varys spoked that have saved him . if its true he may still appair.
----

i vote Bran(or bloodraven) Dany and Melisandre (show some respect i saw people saying Jamie )


edit : added Aegon Targaryen

Edited by Anzu, 22 August 2012 - 06:05 AM.

[Stark@heart]

Going by the vision she had in the House of the UnDying,  the three heads of the dragon are shown.

Rhagar dying on the Trident
Viserys being given his golden crown  and

A man with long silver hair, looking back over his shoulder at a burning city ( she does not see the face and assumes its a male).  A banner of a Fiery Stallion flys overhead.

I think that is Dany seeing herself at some future battle.

She and Drogon are the Stallion that Mounts the World.  That's why the Crone(s) looked afraid,  probably had a glimpse of Dany's True Children.  

Dany will soon have all the Doths in her Kalazaar so I think she will use a Fiery / Flaming Stallion as her personal banner to fly alongside the Three - Headed Dragon of House Targaryen.

What I'm hoping we won't see is the Fiery Heart of R'holor.  Dany's already been burned by magic twice, I don't see it happening again.

Dany learns her lessons the hard way.   MMD and the Warlocks/ UnDying will have taught Dany enough about those who practice magic to keep Morq at arm's length.  Quaithe on the other hand?  Who knows?  So far she hasn't asked for anything so she's probably the most dangerous of all.

One thing I can't see is Dany falling under anyone's spell ( besides Darrio , but I think that's just cause she lonely and he's a slick talking bad boy -( been there, done that).

She wore the floppy ears and tried the meek and mild path in Mereene.

She gave a crown to a Son of the Harpie and took him into her bed to buy peace and they paid her with false coin.  That won't be forgotten but it did Wake the Dragon so Dany is now a True Targ, a Dragonlord / rider.   So Mereene was worth it after all. Another lesson learned that will serve her well in battles to come and Westeros.

I think the other dragons will be controlled via magic horn and warging.  It's possible that someone with Targ blood and courage could become a rider.  I've cracked potted all over the place about  the idea that Quenten could be alive and trying his hand at that now but it's slim - slim to none truthfully but this is GRRM so as I oft repeat - He could make something like that work.

[Ser Endrew Tarth]

Apple Martini, on 15 May 2012 - 04:46 PM, said:

I like the idea that it's three different aspects ("heads") of one person. The dragon in question is symbolic, not literal.

Yes it's a good theory, but after re-reading AFfC I'm thinking the dying Maester Aemon seems to have finally deciphered the prophecy, and he felt there would be three riders it seems.  It sux that he dies before he can explain this to Dany, and that all we have is little scraps of info from Sam (sometimes even mad ravings of a feverish old man).

As to the person who put Stannis as a possible rider, Aemon agrees there is dragon's blood in him, but he is not the one.  He basically states mel is leading him down a false path.

Mugwump, on 15 May 2012 - 05:45 PM, said:

There is another hint that most people miss during Khal Drogo's funeral.

The black egg is set next to Drogo's heart.
The white egg is set next to Drogo's loins
The green egg is set next to Drogo's head

Is the positioning important? I can't imagine GRRM chose those locations by accident. Since the white dragon seems aimed at Jon (his last name is Snow, his wolf is white, etc.), is there significance to the placement on Drogo's body? It seems a hint that Dany and Jon will become lovers.

If so, what does the placement of the green egg signify? What character in the book seems most closely associated with the head, and also has an association with the color green (one green eye, creative use of wildfire - which is an odd green color)? Tyrion.

Good catch, I've seen it touched on before but not discussed in length.  I also like that the colors could foreshadow the rider.  I guess with drogon, black and red are the targ sigil colors right?

Lord Martin Stark, on 18 May 2012 - 03:25 PM, said:

I believe they are Dany, Jon and Aegon. I do believe Aegon is for real but i do see him dying along with the dragon he rides

for some reason this seems the most likely to me as well.  I love Tyrion (doesn't everybody) and want him to be one in a fantasy fan-boy kinda way, but as mentioned upthread it would seem kinda hokey.  But if anyone can pull it off GRRM can, similar to Stark@Heart's assertion.  Stark@heart you're truly Quent's champion on this forum lol.  LONG LIVE QUENTYN MARTELL!!!  

[Feather Crystal]

Wouldn't that be ironic if Jaime and Cersei were Targaryens, then their children would have had rightful claims to the throne.

There must be a reason why all three mothers died giving them birth. (Jon, Dany, Tyrion) Only death can pay for life.

Mugwump, on 15 May 2012 - 05:45 PM, said:

There is another hint that most people miss during Khal Drogo's funeral.

The black egg is set next to Drogo's heart.
The white egg is set next to Drogo's loins
The green egg is set next to Drogo's head

Is the positioning important? I can't imagine GRRM chose those locations by accident. Since the white dragon seems aimed at Jon (his last name is Snow, his wolf is white, etc.), is there significance to the placement on Drogo's body? It seems a hint that Dany and Jon will become lovers.

If so, what does the placement of the green egg signify? What character in the book seems most closely associated with the head, and also has an association with the color green (one green eye, creative use of wildfire - which is an odd green color)? Tyrion.

This makes sense to me and I think it's a brilliant observation.

Edited by Melisandra, 22 August 2012 - 11:30 AM.

[Anzu]

Melisandra, on 22 August 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

There must be a reason why all three mothers died giving them birth. (Jon, Dany, Tyrion) Only death can pay for life.

now thats a brilliant observation

[Feather Crystal]

Anzu, on 22 August 2012 - 11:41 AM, said:

now thats a brilliant observation

I wish it were mine, but the OP suggested it.

[shaeyoufool]

In AFFC Maester Aemon says "the dragon must have three heads, but I am too old and frail to be one of them. I should be with her, showing her the way, but my body has betrayed me."  This sounded to me like Dany is the dragon and the heads would be three people other than Dany?

[Ser Cornholio of Titikaka!]

shaeyoufool, on 03 September 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

In AFFC Maester Aemon says "the dragon must have three heads, but I am too old and frail to be one of them. I should be with her, showing her the way, but my body has betrayed me."  This sounded to me like Dany is the dragon and the heads would be three people other than Dany?

I dont know how you infer that. However, what is important is that he's ready to abandon the wall for Danny.

[Ser Endrew Tarth]

shaeyoufool, on 03 September 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

In AFFC Maester Aemon says "the dragon must have three heads, but I am too old and frail to be one of them. I should be with her, showing her the way, but my body has betrayed me."  This sounded to me like Dany is the dragon and the heads would be three people other than Dany?

This is one of the most important exchanges in AFFC IMHO.  I think alot can be gleaned from Maester Aemon's ramblings that sheds light on the prophecies and their validity.  It sounds to me like it's three heads with Dany as one of them.  He mentions that Stannis may have been one of the heads but concludes the baratheons do not have enough dragon's blood to be a head of the dragon (Tho GRRM says that's not necessarily a requirement i believe).  I would've loved to see Maester Aemon meet Dany or Aegon before his passing, what a great conversation that would've been...

[Budj]

I think we have been shown plenty of times that Aemon and Rhaegar can't decipher anything about the prophecy.  I think that's the point though.  The prophecy is so ambiguous how can you actually pin point it unless you already know how it fits together?  Judging by Aemon's musings about being a rider I would also assume that he thinks that all 3 riders will be Targaryens?  And we know that's not necessarily true.

I agree with Apple - the dragon (singular) has 3 heads (plural / metaphorical).  The way the phrase is stated gives the impression that (along with Dragon's being actual Targs in Dunk and Egg) the "dragon" is someone that would be the poster-boy figure for the Targ dynasty...not that this makes him the lone savior of the story - we all know that's not Martin's storytelling.

Are we even sure we will have dragon "riders"?  I personally find it hard to believe that all 3 dragons will make it through TWoW unscathed.

[Lord Gautham Girishankar]

another topic..same story..even I made a similar topic

[Stark@heart]

I think there can be other dragon riders but they will need "help" to control the dragon - like a magic horn or the ability to warg.

I think only Targs (with the right blood, maybe, like other old Valerian House) are natural dragon riders.

In the House of the UnDying Dany is told the Dragon has three heads and that she is a child of three.   The vision is of the "three" Targ dragon riders, the three children / heads of the Dragon - Aerys.

We see Rhagar die on the Trident.

We see Viserys killed by his golden crown  

and then

Dany sees a "man" with long silver hair atop a horse looking back over a burning city.  Above the figure flies a banner with a Fiery Stallion.

I think this is Dany seeing herself at some future battle.

I think she'll take the Fiery Horse as her personal banner as The Stallion That Mounts the World to fly along side the Three Headed Dragon of House Targareyen.

The vision means that the Three have come.  Two have died but their Dragons live on - Hence, GRRM has already shown us how the other two Dragons will be tamed.

As for who?   I think the mothers' dying in birth has meaning.  Again and again we're told that only death can pay for life and that was how Dany was born and how she also hatched the Dragons.  I think it's telling that both Tyrion and Jon's mothers died while birthing them and it's been speculated that both are Hidden Targs so it's possible that they have for some reason, an abundance of Targ blood, which could also make them (near) natural dragon riders.

There is only one horn ( so far).  Only the Gods know what will happen when someone tries to use it but it is real.  For some reason, I'd like to see Tyrion get his hands on it

As far as Wargs go,  the ones we know the most of, the Stark kids are mostly in the North, so the Dragons would have to come to them.  Except for Arya - she could end up near Dany or one of the Dragons.   Love that too.

Anyway, that's my thoughts / wishes on what has happened and what may be...

[Harry the Heir]

mcb, on 15 May 2012 - 10:54 AM, said:

...during their wedding night. If any of Joanna's children were fathered by Aerys, it had to be the twins, not the youngest one.

I don't think that works. The liberties were taken during the bedding, which is a semi-public ceremony in which Aerys' activities would be witnessed by a number of other people. If Aerys had actual intercourse with Joanna in front of members of the court, then it's hard to fathom Tywin staying on as Hand for another fifteen years.

The point of the "liberties" story is that it establishes Aerys' sexual interest in Joanna, not that Aerys fathered anybody that particular day. And there's much more evidence for Tyrion being a half-Targaryen than for Jaime and Cersei.

DragonsHungry, on 15 May 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

Tyrion, I hope not, it would suck and completely ruin his character. Tyrion should stay a Lannister, not somehow be Aerys' son. The whole point of his feud with Tywin would seem cheap and lame. I will quit reading if that happens.

If the Tyrion Targaryen theory is true--and believe me, I am a reluctant convert, but ADWD convinced me--I don't think that means that everything that ever went wrong between Tyrion and Tywin can be attributed to that single fact. There's also Tysha, for example, which isn't directly related to Tyrion's parentage.

Edited by Harry the Heir, 10 September 2012 - 02:31 PM.

[Nikos Targaryen]

I can't accept the fact that Tyrion is the result of an illicit relationship between Aerys and Joanna Lannister. He's just so much like Tywin it's not even funny, even his aunt says as much to Jaime in AFFC

[Harry the Heir]

Nikos Targaryen, on 10 September 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

I can't accept the fact that Tyrion is the result of an illicit relationship between Aerys and Joanna Lannister. He's just so much like Tywin it's not even funny, even his aunt says as much to Jaime in AFFC

He was raised by Tywin, after all. Jon spends a lot of time trying to follow Ned's example too.