Stanmore, on 18 May 2012 - 09:44 AM, said:
Funny. I think Dany listens to her current advisers a bit to much. Reopening the fighting pits, allowing the brazen beasts to interrogate prisoners, marrying Hizdahr.... The problem isn't that she doesn't take advice. The problem is pretty much everyone around her is giving her the wrong advice.
I stand corrected. You are right. Dany listens to her advisers. It just so happens that she has put together a poor council that includes former slavers who are advising on how to deal with their former slaves. They are working against her. That her council is so weak indicates how weak and incompetent she is as a ruler.
Dany never set out to rule.
Perhaps she didn't intend to rule at the beginning of AGOT but she still makes a very deliberate decision to rule. It wasn't thrust upon her. She herself decided not to go to Vaes Dothrak, where widowed kahleesi's normally go. She herself decided not to go to Asshai as Jorah recommended. She herself decided not to return to the house with the red door in Braavos or even to Pentos where she at least knew Illyrio. She herself decided to sack and devastate an entire region. I don't disagree that her original reason for doing so was a noble one, but she is still the one who decided to do it and she should be held accountable for her decision and especially for poor execution. It wasn't thrust upon her. My line of work is related to human rights. I see atrocities all the time and I know that something should be done and I know that at times people look to me to help them, doesn't mean that I should automatically make the decision just because of that. I would make a terrible leader! I recognize this. I recognized this all the way in primary school when I didn't do things like run for student council and such. The only time I've ever taken on a leadership position, it was with a lot of thought and careful planning.
BabyMeraxes, on 18 May 2012 - 10:07 AM, said:
I think this is a key part of Dany's character that often gets lost in the shuffle. She's is a genuinely good, kind, empathetic person who really cares about her people, and won't turn away the wretched outcasts of society. She just fucked up Slaver's Bay. Yeah, she's not a good ruler, but she is a good person at her core, and that means more to me.
I really disagree with the statement that she's a good, kind, empathetic person who really cares. For crying out loud, she sits on her throne eating while holding court when she's aware that the city is starving! So freaking insensitive. I'm not suggesting that she starve herself (it would be counterproductive) but perhaps hold off on nibbling bits of elaborately presented food when in privacy. She's definitely not kind or good when she crucifies 163 random people. Absolutely not kind or good when she uses or threatens to use WMDs (which she has little control of!) to get what she wants.
Faint, on 18 May 2012 - 12:41 PM, said:
I'm curious to know, if Daenerys proves to be the hero of the story, are those here who hate her going to seriously devalue the series in consequence? Because, right now, a lot of people are banking on, or even hoping, that this will not prove to be the case, but if it does turn out that way, will the entire story be ruined for you guys?
No, the entire story would not be ruined for me if she turned out to be the hero but only if GRRM builds up to it. What we know of her now, what we know of Martin's pace in these books and what we know of how many books are left in the series, there simply isn't enough time to turn Dany into some hero so big and shiny that it totally overshadows all of the villainy stuff she's done.
I do wonder if the story would be ruined for those who think she's already a bright and shiny hero if the series ends with her being a clear villain.
This thread has been quite interesting. Hope it gets a new one started before this one gets locked.