155 replies to this topic

[Reznak mo Reznak]

Direwolf Lager, on 04 June 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

i think D&D are too dumb to foreshadow material that may appear in the Winds of Winter or A Dream of Spring. by the way season 2 was shot, i doubt GRRM told them any of the major plot points that still havent been revealed in the novels

They seem pretty smart to me. Whatever reasons they have I doubt lack of intelligence is one of them. No need to insult them.

[Fragile Bird]

Holafernando Torres, on 04 June 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

This is OBVIOUSLY not the case. Without question, when Hodor delivers this powerful line of dialogue he is questioning the limits of his own humanity. He is expressing real concern about his capabilities as a care giver and his new found role as a medieval wheelchair. The emphasis on the last letter tells us that although terribly frightened, there is still an unrestrained hope that he can carry out his duties to his young lord. All in the word "Hodor"

Wow.  That's a pretty powerful message.

[rebel]

What I take from the visions is that obviously Dany will decide to spend another book and a half in Mereen.

[Aslerys]

Hasfast, on 04 June 2012 - 08:09 PM, said:

Crackpot or not, I do like it and it sounds plausible enough. After all, the Undying only say that she'll know three betrayals. Although forsaking the Throne in favour of love is not necessarily a self-betrayal. D.R.

I meant to say that she would be betraying everything she belived in as well as her family honor not necessarily herself as a person if you know what I mean...

[Fragile Bird]

Obviously the trip through the HotU is getting all the attention, but watching tonight again, what about Stannis and Melisandre?

"You will betray the men serving you.  You will betray your family.  You will betray everything you once held dear."

"You are the son of fire.  You are the warrior of the light.  You will sweep aside this pretender and that.  You will be king."

Stannis is an unloved, dour man, who was loyal and expects loyalty in return.  He has already betrayed his wife, with Mel.  He betrayed Renly, by killing him.  He basically betrayed Robert by not telling him his suspicions about Jaime and Cersei, but these are in the past, done already.  What other family betrayals will there be?  Shireen?  He has tried to burn Edric Storm.  How will he betray the men serving him?  And what does he hold so dear, what is it he will betray?  Loyalty and honour?  He's already betrayed his god.  Will he betray Davos?

[JayDubya]

When Dany sees the frozen, snow-covered throne, I thought:  'This is what will happen to Westeros if you take the throne'.

When Dany sees the hut north of the wall, and inside it are the people she loves,  I thought 'This is where you will find happiness and joy - beyond the Wall'

When Mel told Stannis he will betray everyone, I thought 'Stannis is going to be the King of the Others'

[Sand11751]

In HotU scene, I thought the writers were trying to say Daenerys' yearning for the Iron Throne will lead to her ruin and her yearning for a family, whether children or lost Targs, will be a distraction she can't afford. Her sole purpose must be to protect those who need her most, beyond the Wall. If fire destroys wights, have her to stop lounging around and hightail it to Westeros with those fire-breathing dragons, where that undead army of white walkers is marching. The full grown dragons can be just as effective as their ancestors were on the Field of Fire.  

Poor Stannis. Melisandre is delusional and whatever he saw was what she wanted him to see. Especially telling was when he first confronted her and her entire facial expression as she's backing him says, "I fucked that one up BIGTIME! How do I salvage this?"

Edited by Sand11751, 04 June 2012 - 09:25 PM.

[Hasfast]

Holafernando Torres, on 04 June 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

This is OBVIOUSLY not the case. Without question, when Hodor delivers this powerful line of dialogue he is questioning the limits of his own humanity. He is expressing real concern about his capabilities as a care giver and his new found role as a medieval wheelchair. The emphasis on the last letter tells us that although terribly frightened, there is still an unrestrained hope that he can carry out his duties to his young lord. All in the word "Hodor"

Hodor is suddenly elevated to a much revered and enlightened figure... The utterance of his own name, it seems, is a mantra of limitless power, much like the "Ohm"... Why have all my reading happened by me without understanding this mighty truth? I shall atone for my faults. D.R.

[GeorgeIAF]

Was it Benjen the wight on the horse ?

I really doubt it, but it just crossed my mind.

Edited by GeorgeIAF, 05 June 2012 - 02:17 AM.

[Kobayashi Maru]

The HoU was kind of anticlimatic.I must admit I was expecting something more.Maybe a glimpse of RW,but it still shows a lot.

Danny in front of IT and coming so close shows us she will get there but it will not be as fullfiling as she imagines it.It looked to me that she would become a queen of a burned and destroyed kingdom,not nice.

Also the scene at the wall to me meant that she will find her love and family at the wall.Not convinced in R+L=J so this is first semi proof that maybe she'll at least meet Jon.But IMHO it is obvious if you put two and two together,dragons=fire;fire kills wights...she'll be going to the wall.

Drakarys was dissapointing,strange angle of the camera I supose,but still ok.

I guess I don't see why get shy with foreshadowing now and give us so little of all that happened in the books in the hou when they revealed a major plot spoiler in seson one when they showed us Varys and Mopatis are bff-s.I am talking about the scene when Arya sees them in the dungens,when she hides in one of the dragon heads.In the books we don't know who she sees and shee only tells Ned one of them is a wizard or something like that.It took us a lot to find out who this wizard was (Mopatis) and to find out that Varys wants a Targ on the throne(if you accept that Aegon is real Targ,I'm still to be convinced).So they showed us a plot spoiler from the book 5 in the first season and now they are all shy about the HoU and tree treasons.

[StarkWard]

In all honesty, I wasn't thinking when I watched the HotU scene. I was just keeping an eye out for blue roses.

[ARYa_Nym]

It was noted in the House of Undying thread that when Dany first walks into the throne room there is something blue on the stained glass but it may not be the blue flower.

Edit: Here are three caps.
http://oi48.tinypic.com/2rc1o38.jpg
http://oi50.tinypic.com/v6i4id.jpg
http://oi50.tinypic.com/11jrjg7.jpg

Edited by ARYa_Nym, 05 June 2012 - 05:06 AM.

[Buckwheat]

Adam West, on 04 June 2012 - 07:13 PM, said:

Did any of you guys also notice that one of the wights had a Stark shield across his back? I find this very interesting due to the lingering Starks = others (or w/e you call it) theory.

I noticed it, but I do not think it has any connection to this theory. It might just show that some wildling who turned into a wight once stole a Stark shield or that a Stark once turned into a wight himself. No foreshadowing.

About the snow in the throne room, I understood it as the message of Winter is coming. The Winter and the Others will come as far south as KL.

Dany following her children's crying was to show that they are the most important for her - I think that was especially visible when she left Drogo's tent. She could have stayed in there for the illusion - that was what Pyat wanted her to do, to keep her interested in something else while he drained her life from her - but she kept following their voices. It showed that she is the most interested in taking care of her children - by which I also mean the freed slavves and other followers of her.

I also think the burned roof foreshadowed her burning it through Drogon.

I still wish there were a blue flower on the wall - I know it would mostly be fan service for the book-readers, but so was the mention of the Crag and family Westerling some episodes ago, and it would make more viewers happy than that one, I think.

I do not know about the hidden messages of "Hodor", though, habe to rewatch and think it through before I say anything definite about it.

[Buckwheat]

ARYa_Nym, on 05 June 2012 - 04:53 AM, said:

It was noted in the House of Undying thread that when Dany first walks into the throne room there is something blue on the stained glass but it may not be the blue flower.

Edit: Here are three caps.
http://oi48.tinypic.com/2rc1o38.jpg
http://oi50.tinypic.com/v6i4id.jpg
http://oi50.tinypic.com/11jrjg7.jpg

This is just part of the window decoration, is it not? I do not think it looks like a flower, and do not think it is deliberate - as far as I can tell, the windows were always like this.

[ARYa_Nym]

Buckwheat, on 05 June 2012 - 05:23 AM, said:

This is just part of the window decoration, is it not? I do not think it looks like a flower, and do not think it is deliberate - as far as I can tell, the windows were always like this.

Yes. it looks the same when Tywin walks in.

[lojzelote]

ARYa_Nym, on 05 June 2012 - 04:53 AM, said:

It was noted in the House of Undying thread that when Dany first walks into the throne room there is something blue on the stained glass but it may not be the blue flower.

Edit: Here are three caps.
http://oi48.tinypic.com/2rc1o38.jpg
http://oi50.tinypic.com/v6i4id.jpg
http://oi50.tinypic.com/11jrjg7.jpg

I think it's the Sevenpointed Star.

[Buckwheat]

lojzelote, on 05 June 2012 - 05:34 AM, said:

I think it's the Sevenpointed Star.

Yup, it is. The blue part is the inner part of the star. I do not think it has any particular message hidden in it, only that Maegor's architect apparently liked colourful windows.

[ARYa_Nym]

lojzelote, on 05 June 2012 - 05:34 AM, said:

I think it's the Sevenpointed Star.

It probably is. I wonder if the Faith will still be a problem by the time she gets to KL. I don't think the image was alluding to that though.

[isiman]

Hasfast, on 04 June 2012 - 03:37 PM, said:

Martin is there the whole time even if he's not personally writing all the episodes.

No

GRRM is not a show runner, he writes the script for an episode and is involved in the casting, that's it.

[Dead Viper]

Fragile Bird, on 04 June 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

Stannis is an unloved, dour man, who was loyal and expects loyalty in return.  He has already betrayed his wife, with Mel.  He betrayed Renly, by killing him.  He basically betrayed Robert by not telling him his suspicions about Jaime and Cersei, but these are in the past, done already.  What other family betrayals will there be?  Shireen?  He has tried to burn Edric Storm.  How will he betray the men serving him?  And what does he hold so dear, what is it he will betray?  Loyalty and honour?  He's already betrayed his god.  Will he betray Davos?

Right on! I was also wondering who else he could possibly betray.. Then you mentioned Davos...

JayDubya, on 04 June 2012 - 09:03 PM, said:

When Mel told Stannis he will betray everyone, I thought 'Stannis is going to be the King of the Others'

That could very well be the case.. The only way for Stannis to betray the people who are loyal to him would be as the King of the Others. Pair that with Mel's questionable talents for prophecies and misinterpreted visions which has been discussed before and it kind of makes sense.

All in all. I love the show and how it diverges from the books. It's got to the point where I can't be sure what is going to happen next in the show. Fantastic season.