166 replies to this topic

[Reposado]

Trzysztof Trieślowski, on 04 June 2012 - 08:16 PM, said:

I think a better question is what grade would you give it versus TV in general versus what grade would you give it in relation to your expectations for an ASOIAF adaptation.  Because for me the latter might be a mildly disappointed B but for the latter it's an A or at worst A-.

this is the kind of thing i think about all the time. i'm constantly tracking my current opinion of not just shows but characters and episodes.

it's good. but not great. despite its flaws, i have it as the 6th best drama this year. it has things it does well, cinematography, acting, scene composition, but fails in bringing it all together. it loses focus a lot compared the legitimately great shows. but there's a lot of mediocrity on the air and even more dreck.

i have tyrion as a top-5 male character, cersei as a top5 female and theon as a top 5 supporting character.

[Lord Barristan]

Mr. Redlegs, on 04 June 2012 - 08:01 PM, said:

Completely agree and am kind of sick of all the complainers on this forum.  You all need to get a life and quit b!tching about some change just to look cool on an online forum.  "Oh know, he didn't say it that way in the book, waaaaaaa!".  Quit your crying and appreciate that we are even getting GoT on TV.  They stayed true to the main story and the majority of the important plot lines were very similiar to the book. If you thought they would be able to fit even half of exactly what happens in the book in the show then you are extremely naive with ridiculous expectations.  Do any of you work in Television?  No, and I guarantee you have no freakin clue how to make something like this work on TV.  This season was great, the battle of blackwater in particular was amazing, and I agree with some other posters that Dany's book story would have been much more boring...Someone wanting to steal her dragons is much more believable.  I am extremely appreciative that HBO has dedicated the resources to this show that they have, and am sick of all you morons picking out little details they got "wrong".  Grow up, get a life, and enjoy what you have.  I came to this forum to share how awesome GoT is and you idiots are ruining it.

I dont follow your logic... We should just be thankful that HBO is making this show? And I'm criticizing the show to look cool? Ok...

I give this season a B- for many reasons... Some of the stuff was just not as good as the first season. The writing was very poor at times, and the acting to. And I'm not just basing this as a fan of the books. I am basing my opinion as a fan of good tv, shows like The Wire, Sopranos, Madmen, Deadwood, Homeland, Boardwalk Empire...

I mean do you think the dude who plays Jon Snow is a good actor? I sure as hell don't

And the guy who plays Stannis was ACTING. He was not Stannis. Sean Bean became Ned Stark... Maisie Williams is Arya...

But IMO Dillane is Dillane acting as Stannis Baratheon, he has not become the man. The writing for his introduction was way too rushed... You needed to spend time developing Stannis, and not just as a book reader, I'm talking as a critic of the show. In season 1, you go through a lot to know why Ned is the way he is or why Robert was built to win the throne, but not to keep it... We have no idea why Stannis is bitter and wants to kill his brother. No mention of how he felt slighted by Robert, no mention about how he wanted Storms End instead of Dragonstone, No mention of how he wanted a "red hawk" or how he wanted to be hand of the king. Its just one minute Stannis is on Dragonstone, then he shows up --somehwere, not entirely sure where--- to meet with Renly.

Same thing with Robb's storyline. There is almost no talk of the military strategy. Hes fighting a war, but we don't know against who. I never understood why they didn't spend 5 minutes explaining why Tywin was at Harrenhal and how Robb didn't want to march on him.

These are just my opinions, I am critical of things i want to be good. And it has nothing to do with the adaptations of the book, it has to do with better character development and more explanations of what the hell is going on. Why did Renly and Stannis just meet in some field? Why did Robb fight at Oxcross? Who burned Winterfell? These are just things they should be explained, it has nothing to do with books vs. show it has to do with making the show as good as possible.

That being said... There were awesome parts.. Everytime Tyrion was on stage... Varys and Bronn were also impeccable. Joffrey is a brilliant villain.

I loved Arya's story and the kids Gendry and Hot Pie. I love the scene when they talk about what constitutes a battle. The guy who played Jaqen was incredible too

I loved Theon's storyline too, though I don't understand why they finished it like they did. They should have explained who burned winterfell.

Edited by Lord Barristan, 04 June 2012 - 09:08 PM.

[Reposado]

Lord Barristan, on 04 June 2012 - 09:01 PM, said:

But IMO Dillane is Dillane acting as Stannis Baratheon, he has not become the man. The writing for his introduction was way too rushed... You needed to spend time developing Stannis, and not just as a book reader, I'm talking as a critic of the show.

yep, you need to develop these characters or cut them. No more cliffnotes please.

[Mad Queen]

C for this season -- Blackwater and Theon taking Winterfell were by far the best moments; maybe the only great moments. For comparison, I would give the first one a B+.

I'm primarily a fan of the books. That's why I created an account here and before that on the old Ezboard forums, years and years before HBO aired the first GoT episode. With a few exceptions, I think almost every scene and storyline is better in the books. Sorry about that. Just compare the White Walkers attack scene with the ASoS prologue. And let's not even get started on Jon and Robb.

[StannisWins]

Law and Order SVU is C television.

This show is an A on a bad day and an A+ on most days. I mean some people need some serious perspective here.

Edited by StannisWins, 04 June 2012 - 09:28 PM.

[Sand11751]

B- / C. First season was an A.

Non-canon characters and scenes, especially when their inclusion takes time away from important scenes and character interactions.

Key lines / scenes given to other characters. Littlefinger with Hound's lines, Dagmer Cleftjaw...

Unforgivable travesty of Robb's love (not honor-bound sense of duty) for Talisa (not Jeyne? Why? Not as if Jeyne Poole was in season so no possible confusion). Actually looking forward to the Red Wedding now.

[NickSnow]

First, let me reiterate that by no means do I think that this is a BAD show. Not at all; I think it is the best show on television hands down. It is however a poor adaptation, especially season 2.

I would give season 1 an A. I really had no problems with it. Im one of the few who actually liked the changes in season 1. They reflected a new audience and worked well for a visual medium.

Season 1 however is a C+. Very disappointed with it. They seem to have lost the awesomeness with season 1. They are making too many stupid changes that dont make sense. They are ruining characters (see Littlefinger and the Hound). They only scratched the surface of the story in season 2, instead of hitting all the important parts as they did in season 1. I hope that season 3 will be better.

[King Rickon and his Dawg]

I give it a solid B+. I thought Dany's storyline in the book was mind numbingly boring, and I enjoyed most of the changes to her storyline with the exception of the house of the undying. This is because they hyped it up so much in the show and it ended up not being very exciting. I also thought the change in Jon Snow's storyline was totally unnecessary and made the Qhorin fight scene anticlimactic and confusing, which is very disappointing because that was my absolute favorite scene in the book (yes, more than blackwater and HotU). On the plus side: Alfie Allen was a huge scene stealer for me this season. Those Jaime/Brienne scene was fantastic. Ygritte is awesome and has great chemistry with Jon. Blackwater. Stannis, Melisandre, and Davos were pretty much pitch perfect for me. The main problem this season faced was that there were just too many characters and too many story lines that it was impossible to do them all justice. I'm not really sure how they could have done this better given the budget and time constraints. Perhaps three seasons for book 2 and 3 together might have worked?

[Magjee]

S1 - A
S2 - B+

It's not the books, its a TV show and guess what?

I'm entertained.

[Mad Queen]

StannisWins, on 04 June 2012 - 09:27 PM, said:

Law and Order SVU is C television.

No, that's F-.

[Dacie]

C+
would've been a B+ but I did not like the finale at all

A for last season

[turdle]

StannisWins, on 04 June 2012 - 09:27 PM, said:

Law and Order SVU is C television.

This show is an A on a bad day and an A+ on most days. I mean some people need some serious perspective here.

well perhaps if i was able to completely separate the tv show from the book, but i find it impossible not to compare the two. and i feel like hbo has made it especially hard seeing as they made so many changes.  doing that just begs for those who are familiar with both to contrast the two. quite frankley, i haven't trusted D&D since the little finger/ros scene in season 1, and there's been a number of things this season which have given me more reason to distrust them when they stray from the source.

[Arrogant Bastard]

Lord Barristan, on 04 June 2012 - 09:01 PM, said:

Same thing with Robb's storyline. There is almost no talk of the military strategy. Hes fighting a war, but we don't know against who. I never understood why they didn't spend 5 minutes explaining why Tywin was at Harrenhal and how Robb didn't want to march on him.

Robb was too busy letting Talisa interrupt his war councils to actually discuss war.

[Howdyphillip]

Season 1

Just for the record, I don't believe that the changes from this season screwed up anything in the long run, and I don't hold the ideas behind most of these, but last year at this time, these were the things people were saying about season 1...

Now, everyone is giving Season 1 an A

They completely changed the characters of Ned and Catelyn  when they reversed the positions of who wanted to go to Kings landing and who wanted to stay.

They robbed the Hound of every significant line his character had

They created the character of Ros out of thin air and she took up valuable screen time from what the real story was.

They made Ned Stark look like some kind of a cage fighter by having him fight Jaime in the streets.

Varrys was much too effeminate

They ruined the characters of Renly and Loras by making them gay

They completely cut the ToJ dream sequence and now the viewer will never understand about R+L=J

They made Littlefinger a pimp

They made Pycelle a whoremonger

Mark Addy was a terrible choice for Robert because he looked nothing like him,

Just a little reminder for those that are throwing fits about the changes in Season 2

Edited by Holafernando Torres, 04 June 2012 - 10:56 PM.

[The Second Hand]

After the torture scene, I was so done expecting anything other then mediocre fantasy. Heck, The Tudors was better.

[Sxxman]

I'd give it a B+, mostly because there a little too many "calm before the storm" episodes, it's okay to have one or two but it seemed to me that almost half of them were slow.  The Dany and Jon storyline in the first half were pretty dull IMO. There were also a few pointless scenes that could've been used for more character development, the one that comes to mind is Joffrey doing some S&M with Ros and some prostitute.  Other than that I loved the season, Blackwater was arguably my favorite episode of the entire series, acting was great, the special effects were great, dialogue was great. Not as good as the first season but to be fair there are very few people who believe aCoK > aGoT.

[turdle]

Holafernando Torres, on 04 June 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

Season 1

Just for the record, I don't believe that the changes from this season screwed up anything in the long run, and I don't hold the ideas behind most of these, but last year at this time, these were the things people were saying about season 1...

Now, everyone is giving Season 1 an A

if it weren't for the little finger/ros scene in season 1 i would give season 1 an A (that is how i showed all of my friends, i made them close their eyes while i fast forwarded through the scene). but my grade for season 2 is still a C+.

[The Second Hand]

Holafernando Torres, on 04 June 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

Season 1

Just for the record, I don't believe that the changes from this season screwed up anything in the long run, and I don't hold the ideas behind most of these, but last year at this time, these were the things people were saying about season 1...

Now, everyone is giving Season 1 an A

They completely changed the characters of Ned and Catelyn  when they reversed the positions of who wanted to go to Kings landing and who wanted to stay.

They robbed the Hound of every significant line his character had

They created the character of Ros out of thin air and she took up valuable screen time from what the real story was.

They made Ned Stark look like some kind of a cage fighter by having him fight Jaime in the streets.

Varrys was much too effeminate

They ruined the characters of Renly and Loras by making them gay

They completely cut the ToJ dream sequence and now the viewer will never understand about R+L=J

They made Littlefinger a pimp

They made Pycelle a whoremonger

Mark Addy was a terrible choice for Robert because he looked nothing like him,

Just a little reminder for those that are throwing fits about the changes in Season 2

The difference is that most of those changes didn't dramatically impact the fifty or so minutes they were contained within. As each episoded progressed this season, we saw the writing become worse and worse, the acting more droll, and truly interesting and fascinating moral issues dropped at the slight of a prostitute's skant chance of nudity. It was hard to watch, whereas most of season one felt like they had made -- at the very least -- an effort to faithfully adapt the series.

[Sound_of_winter]

I would give this season a B-, there were little things that annoyed me a little bit, but i got over them fast. BUT there were three things that pissed me off.

The death of Bran and Rickon:sure Alot of book readers weren't fooled about their deaths, but i was devastated and actually thought they were dead, it was actually the biggest moment in the book for me ( other than HOTU, and Black water) I just remember reading the chapter where Cat is talking to Brienne about Bran and Rickon being dead, and my jaw dropped! if they left out the orphans in the episode where they were leaving and led the audience to believe that it was Bran and Rickon it would have been a great episode, then on the season finale show them leaving the crypts.

House of the Undying: Let me start off by saying that the visions in the show were AWESOME i was dorking out, i liked the fact that they were new visions, which means even more crack pot theories. But we've had five episodes building up to the house of the undying (when Pryat first mentions it to Danny in the Courtyard) so non-book readers and book readers alike were anticipating something huge! but no, only three visions, if there were more it would have been much better; even if it wasnt the ones from the books. Plus Pryat took out half of Danny's Khalasar, maybe more. Drogon farted fire on his face and Pryat is just standing there.....what?

Season Finale Ending: Im going to get shit for this, but i agree with alot of you that it was a tacky ending. It just looked so cheap and like a George Romero knockoff. If they ended with the three horns blowing, Pyp and Edd running, then zoom on Sam's frightened face it would have been fine. Or when the Wights and Walkers appeared make it night time, and a blizzard. So we don't see them clearly, but know they are there (it would make it so much creepier)

- ps: Why don't they let Arya kill in the show? is it too shocking for her age or something? (this didn't bother me much, but i was just wondering about it)
ALSO: i really don't want anyone replying to this telling me to stop complaining and don't watch the show please don't bother, thank you.

[Gaius Martell]

I think the major problem that this season faced was the sheer number of characters and different storylines going on.  Just think of how many POVs we have in A Clash of Kings:

Jon
Catelyn
Sansa
Arya
Bran
Tyrion
Daenerys
Theon
Davos

When we consider that Robb is getting more screen time than he had in the books, the King's Landing players get their own scenes, and Jaime's early Storm of Swords story is moved into the end of this season, we're getting on average 5 minutes of each POV per episode.  It's simply not enough time to do the stories as much justice as the books do them.  This is only going to get worse, I fear, as more characters become more important and the story continues to branch out, that this cluttered, "bullet point" style story might get even worse.

Hell, George HIMSELF saw that when writing AFFC and ADWD.  Splitting A Storm of Swords into two seasons (as intended) may be the best decision the writers of GOT have made.  There just might be enough time to spend on the plot that it can move forward and still be compelling.