Jump to content

Maggy the Frog, theory about her prophecy


leo0274

Recommended Posts

Hey everyone first time poster.



I too thought Jaime would be the most poetic, but what about Tommen? He was the younger brother, and wouldn't it be kind of ironic if one of Cersei's children (the only thing she genuinely cares for) murdered her. I can't think of an exact reason for Tommen doing so, but it could just be that he snaps after being manipulated for years by Cersei.



What do you all think?


Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey everyone first time poster.

I too thought Jaime would be the most poetic, but what about Tommen? He was the younger brother, and wouldn't it be kind of ironic if one of Cersei's children (the only thing she genuinely cares for) murdered her. I can't think of an exact reason for Tommen doing so, but it could just be that he snaps after being manipulated for years by Cersei.

What do you all think?

Tommen and Myrcella die before Cersei... according to future Maggy gave Cersei

but it's a crapshoot...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dude, haven't you heard of wighting? unTommen is a total possibility.

hence crapshoot....

I still like

Breinne "the beauty" to physically cast Cersei down...

Jamie sides with Breinne, Cersei kills her own kids... (she has aborted her own and killed Robert's because she hated him)

After she does it she realize what she has done... and weeps until

Jamie finds what she has done and strangles her

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Book Marg isn't really regarded as beautiful, like she is on the show..

I think the Queen that will overthrow Cersei will be one of Arianne, Sansa, or Danaerys... all depending on who marries Aegon/sacks King's Landing with him.

If the queen in question also happens to be Daenarys (who is a queen in her own right, even if she is not yet married to Aegon), it could also set the stage for two other prophecy fulfillments:

1. Dany's third betrayal, for love... Aegon standing Daeny up for Arianne or Sansa

2. Tyrion would be present, with Daenarys at the sack of King's Landing. I would imagine, Jaime will also be present, at the very least, to try and save Tommen's life. That puts both of Cersei's younger brothers in a crumbling city with Cersei. Perfect recipe for one of them to snuff her.

Book Marge isn't regarded as beautiful...in a Cersei POV.

Cersei has been mixing Haterade with her wine lately

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the valonqar has to be her actual younger brother. Jaime being younger is a technicality at best. Besides, how's he supposed to strangle her with only one weak hand. Tyrion already strangled one ho, that's foreshadowing enough (and motive enough) to suggest he'll do the same with her.



The younger queen is most likely the one that already toppled her - Margaery, but Daenerys will do so if C's still around KL when D arrives.


Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the valonqar has to be her actual younger brother. Jaime being younger is a technicality at best. Besides, how's he supposed to strangle her with only one weak hand. Tyrion already strangled one ho, that's foreshadowing enough (and motive enough) to suggest he'll do the same with her.

The younger queen is most likely the one that already toppled her - Margaery, but Daenerys will do so if C's still around KL when D arrives.

Cersei has been wrong about everything in the future that Maggy gave her.

Killing her friend did not stop the future from happening

The king was not Rhaegar

She had 3 kids... but aborted one... (2 or 4 would have proved the Maggy's future false)

Cersei has always thought Tyrion was the Little Brother

---was she right on that one?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Book Marge isn't regarded as beautiful...in a Cersei POV.

Cersei has been mixing Haterade with her wine lately

I love this!

I think the valonqar has to be her actual younger brother. Jaime being younger is a technicality at best. Besides, how's he supposed to strangle her with only one weak hand. Tyrion already strangled one ho, that's foreshadowing enough (and motive enough) to suggest he'll do the same with her.

The younger queen is most likely the one that already toppled her - Margaery, but Daenerys will do so if C's still around KL when D arrives.

Then why didn't Maggy just say "your" valonqar?

Cersei is by no means toppled yet.

Not sure if I've shared my theory on this thread yet, so in case I haven't, here it is:

If Jaime is the valonqar, this is how it goes down...

  • Cersei wins her trial. Margaery loses hers and is executed.

In retaliation for Margarey's death Olenna poisons both Tommen and herself with sweetsleep. Killer is dead, nothing Cersei can do.

Myrcella becomes queen, learns that Cersei framed Margaery, blames Cersei for Tommen's death, kicks her out.

Jaime is made Hand at some point, before or after the above. While advising his daughter he becomes close to her. The gap between him and Cersei continues to grow.

Cersei, knowing she's lost Jaime, and even less sane than when we last saw her, goes to visit her daughter. Realizes that Myrcella is the YMBQ, snaps, and kills her last child herself. She probably realizes what she's done afterwards and is horrified but it's too late for that to make any difference.

Jaime walks in, sees that Cersei his killed his darling, beloved daughter--his last remaining child of the three Cersei kept him from--and uses the Hand's chain of office to kill Cersei.

Neat and tidy. Probably won't happen that way, but really that's the only way I could see Jaime strangling Cersei. And I think it would be hugely ironic and a major burn to Cersei if her own daughter is the younger and more beautiful queen who will cast her down and take all she holds dear. She never in a million years would consider Myrcella a threat, just like she'd never believe that Jaime is the valonqar.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...

Cersei:"When will I wed the prince?"
Maggy:"Never. You will wed the king."
Cersei:"I will be queen, though?"
Maggy:"Aye. Queen you shall be... until there comes another, younger and more beautiful, to cast you down and take all that you hold dear."


Cersei:"Will the king and I have children?"
Maggy:"Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you."
Maggy:"Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds," she said. "And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you."


The first part is fairly self explanatory - she marries Robert instead of Rhaegar.

I think there is various ways which the next bit can be portrayed. It is highly unlikely that Margeary will be the "younger and more beautiful" Yes I am sure she is attractive but as far as I am aware her beauty isn't as pronounced or mentioned as much as Dany's Cersei's or Sansa's. And a lot of her power is through her family rather than anything that she has done. And the fact that Cersei is so wound up thinking its Marg makes it a pretty blatant red herring. And yes the WOS was humiliating and Cersei is no longer Queen Regent but she hasn't completely lost everything ...yet. I can't imagine Dany getting on the Iron Throne yet and not sure why she would hurt Tommen (I imagine the Sand Snakes will ultimately be involved in the death of Mrycella) Whatever happens to the children (they will both die) will be in TWOW to give Cersei most of ADOS to stew (I think she will be imprisoned by whoever takes the Iron Throne and won't have a lot of POV chapters but will still be alive. But completely broken

The only person I can see being the valonqar is Jaime. Which I know seems a tad predictable but I would rule out many of the previously named people if she is indeed choked. Stannis would just execute her, Jon will be nowhere near KL or Casterley Rock, Arya wouldn't be strong enough you wouldn't think even if Cersei was a lot weaker (she gets annoyed at herself in AFFC for not being able to fight off the Septas so I doubt she is very strong but Arya is what..12?) and most of the other characters wouldn't kill her in this way - to me choking someone would be in a fit of rage or passion. it would be amazing if it was Arya or Sansa in some sweet revenge but couldn't imagine any of them strong enough. It could be Tyrion but I would like him to rise above that - no matter how much of a psycho she is (becomes) you shouldn't kill your family members. I kind of hope Jaime does it as a mercy killing but could imagine it being due to her playing some part in Brienne's death. He will be stabbed or away to die and they will die together (her first) right near the end of ADOS somehow ending all the war and chaos just like how it was their relationship that got the ball rolling in a GOT


Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't forget Gendry. Robert's son, younger brother to Mya Stone, strong as a bull and prone to be angry/sulky.

I really like this - basically any of Robert's bastards could work, but we know Gendry the best. Or Edric, if he finds out how Robert died? It would be a kind of poetic justice for Cersei as well, since she ordered them all killed out of spite.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The key piece everyone is missing is that Myrcella still has to wear her gold crown.

I haven't missed that at all.

My theory if Jaime is the valonqar involves Cersei snapping and killing Myrcella when she realizes her own daughter is the YMBQ. This of course happens after Olenna poisons Tommen and herself with sweetsleep as revenge for Margaery's execution, thus Myrcella is the queen (and younger, and more beautiful).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What would be the order of events?

1) She already wedded the king. (This was the first)

-) Her children will be crowned and they will die before her.
Joffrey, crowned and dead. Tommen, just crowned.
-) Another queen will cast her down and take all that she holds dear.

4) After her tears dry the valonqar will kill her. (This has to be the last)

I wonder; if her children are dead, what is all that she holds dear? It supposed to be taken away from Cersei by the younger queen. "Cast you down" means that she will lose the crown and "take all that you hold dear" Could this mean the power, the Lannister pride, the gold? It could be all of that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What would be the order of events?

1) She already wedded the king. (This was the first)

-) Her children will be crowned and they will die before her.

Joffrey, crowned and dead. Tommen, just crowned.

-) Another queen will cast her down and take all that she holds dear.

4) After her tears dry the valonqar will kill her. (This has to be the last)

I wonder; if her children are dead, what is all that she holds dear? It supposed to be taken away from Cersei by the younger queen. "Cast you down" means that she will lose the crown and "take all that you hold dear" Could this mean the power, the Lannister pride, the gold? It could be all of that.

What Cersei holds dear are power and Jaime. An argument could also be made for her beauty.

The chronology is why Myrcella works so well for the YMBQ. She's crowned, removes her mother from power, grows closer to "uncle" Jaime, and then Cersei kills her, thus fulfilling the part of the prophecy that states her children will all die before she does. Then there's the tears drowning her when she realized what she's done. Then Jaime walks in. It all fits so beautifully, I'm starting to believe it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...