TheSwordOfTheEvening Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Well set-up with a bunch of foreshadowing, then when it all started really going down...toughest chapter to finish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Vader's Bastard Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 One could argue that the very title of this thread is a spoiler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Arthur Robert Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 I have to admit, the red viper upset me much more, I could'nt even sleep that night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nepaliman_7 Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 After rereading it, there was definitely some foreshadowing. I was more surprised that the Boltons betrayed the Starks, I kind of expected the Karstarks to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jalapenohitchhiker Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I had the exact same reaction. I have never cried while reading a book before but that chapter actually made me tear up. I hated that it had to happen but I also love that it did. Every good story has a major turning point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuzu Bolin Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 I was more surprised that the Boltons betrayed the Starks, Like the title says, it's all a Game to these people. Roose thinks Bran and Rickon are dead so if he gets rid of Robb the North is his. It's like Cat said to Rob about Jon Snow, if he made him legitimate Robb's heir's would never be safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torque Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 The Red Wedding was really a shocker. I read it and went back to somehow find a line or two that I missed that identified it as a dream.I was rather hopeful and excited for Edmund's bedding, which turned out to be red for wrong reasons...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerraPrime Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 [Moderator]Please respect the threads where people are discussing the books in the context of not having finished the books yet. Think about what you're posting, before you post. Further violations of the spoiler rule in these threads will be met with sanctions. Thank you. [/Moderator] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Durden Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Am I the only one who did not feel anything during the Red Wedding? It seems like everyone was deeply hurt lol Robb was never a PoV character and Catelyn was such a **** to Jon Snow. I just don't see what the big deal is. Am I the only one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orell the Eagle Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 I knew things were not going to be good as soon as Robb betrayed the Freys. I was totally on pins and needles just like Cat. I loved all the foreshadowing though: - the band being bad - the bride crying and frightened - the food being gross - Greywind acting up - The fact that Olyvar and some other young Freys were missing - (my personal favorite) Sandor Clegane kept referring to it as the "bloody wedding" and "your bloody brother"I really hope there is some justice later. I keep noting how often the guest right is brought up. Particularly of note is the Bran chapter in the Nightfort where he talks about the Rat Cook. In the Rat Cook story, the punishment wasn't for the other atrocious acts, but for violating the guest right. Another example is Jaimie. He violated the guest right when he pushed Bran out the window and later got his hand cut off.Yeah but despite all these foreshadowing hints, I still never saw it coming. The crappy band I just attributed to the Frey's lack of taste in music (or not wanting to spend the money on a decent band), the crying bride was understandable (i.e. getting cold feet on her wedding day), Grey Wind acting up was nothing too out of the ordinary, and the missing Frey's didn't concern me. It was only afterwards, in hindsight, that I realized I should have picked up on these hints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orell the Eagle Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Also, was it really necessary for Walder Frey to sew Grey Wind's head onto Robb's shoulders? That was just disturbing on so many levels. Walder Frey needs to die a horrible death!And of course, the Red Wedding was a vision Daenerys had in the House of the Undying back in Qarth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Am I the only one who did not feel anything during the Red Wedding? It seems like everyone was deeply hurt lol Robb was never a PoV character and Catelyn was such a **** to Jon Snow. I just don't see what the big deal is. Am I the only one?I doubt you are the only one, but I doubt that that big of a percentage of readers felt the way you do. I was certainly devastated when I read it. I actually threw my Kindle across the room and didn't pick it up for a few days.The hints were of course all there. And I knew something wasn't right. When reading the chapters leading up to it, I felt a deep sense of foreboding. But I certainly did not see the extent or the completeness of the betrayal and defeat coming.Gabriel Gubert,i did have tears in my eyes when i stopped reading, but it was mostly because of Arya, since i thought that the hound had killed her.I've seen this thought expressed quite a bit about that chapter, and honestly I don't understand it. I've seen people talk about whether the HBO series was going to have the "cliff hanger" with Arya and whether the Hound had killed her or not. To me, that was not a cliff hanger, and I don't think it was intended to be. It honestly never even crossed my mind that he might have killed her. He obviously could have killed her at any point if he wanted to. If he wanted her dead, all he would have had to do is let her go through the gate. That would have nearly assured her death. And it was clear to me he didn't want her to go through the gate because he knew she'd be killed, and that he knocked her out to save her life.But you certainly aren't the only one that interpreted that scene that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisa Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 I was spoiled before it happened but it still left me needing a break from the series (probably only a very short one mind, I'm still hooked). I wasn't even a big Robb or Catelyn fan, I liked them but I wasn't going to get invested knowing what happened. But, even so, it left me numb and sad - mostly for Arya and Sansa. The chapters following the wedding were the ones I needed time for because I hated Tywin, I hated the Freys and I hated Roose Bolton, so reading about their triumph afterwards made me furious. I need justice GRRM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Joker Of FunLand Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 I hated Cat more than any other character in the series, i liked Robb and i was disappointed he got killed off, but Cat...the only time i liked her was when she was thinking of Ned and how he liked her hair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktwse Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 First post, yay.I was equal parts devastated and furious when I read it, even if the signs of a betrayal of major proportions were all there.I was so pissed off with Robb for not trusting Grey Wind - on numerous occasions. I was angry with all the parties involved in the betrayals, mostly by Bolton I think. I've got nothing but hatred for them.I was so sad for Catelyn dying believing that all her children are dead.Thinking back, I think Robb's biggest mistake was not marrying a Frey (Roslin, most likely) when they first passed the Twins heading South. Had he done so at that point, the entire Jeyne Westerling situation would have been avoided altogether, the Freys would have been bound by marriage to ensure their loyalty - even if Robb's war didn't go so well, and Bolton would certainly have had second thoughts about his part of the betrayal as well. It could only happen with all of them in on it. Without Frey or Bolton, the Red Wedding could never have happened. And Robb already married to a Frey would have ensured Walder would get his queen, even if she was "only" Queen in the North. Robb could have crossed back using the Twins and secured Moat Cailin even without Bolton, and while that would most likely leave the rest of the Riverlands vulnerable to a Lannister/Tyrell attack, they could have reformed and then marched back south later. That said, I believe Robb had to die. IMO, the Starks bound for greatness are Jon, Bran and Arya, maybe even Sansa. Don't know about Rickon. Robb had fulfilled his role by the time he had to retreat back to the North. Had he actually managed to return, we could have closed that part of the story altogether with a nice and fat "and they lived happily ever after..." He had to die for the story to live on.I hated Cat as well, but I still felt so sorry for her. Everything she did, she did out of love for her children, and up until the Red Wedding, she was the only character to have lost everything she held dear. Robb was the only thing she had left, and she had to watch him die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saxony Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 I was shocked. I put the book down and asked myself, "Did I just read that?" BUT, the three things that I picked up on were Grey Wind, the absence of important people, and something no one else seemed to notice: the fact that he gave Edmure a cute little wife... that REALLY jumped out at me. That was my biggest, "Uh oh...."I'm still shocked actually. I just read it last night. AND THANKS FOR TELLING ME WHAT HAPPENED TO ROBB'S BODY, I haven't read that far yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittlefingerInYourBum Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I didn't understand what was going on. I had to do a double take. AND THANKS FOR TELLING ME WHAT HAPPENED TO ROBB'S BODY, I haven't read that far yet!The title has (MEGASPOILERS) in it. Using your foreshadowing skills of Edmure and his hot wife, you could've figured that some storyline might be given away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saxony Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 The title has (MEGASPOILERS) in it. Using your foreshadowing skills of Edmure and his hot wife, you could've figured that some storyline might be given away.The title of this thread suggests that this would be about the wedding. Not that it's a huge spoiler, but it is something shocking that happens after the wedding. I would have said, "and what they did to Robb's body... ick." You can convey what you're feeling or thinking without mentioning specifics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyria Targaryen Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 It's been a few weeks since I read it. But the thing that upset me most was how over-the-top it was in conjunction with the Arya plot.That said... yes, I would like to see Walder and pretty nearly all Freys (and their northern collaborators) die very horrible deaths. The exception would have been the lackwit Frey that Catelyn murdered after Robb was killed. Sorry, but killing a lackwit is like slitting the throat of an infant. Not cool... not even in this context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcd35 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I've literately only just read both this and the very next chapter. I'm in deep shock and really wasn't expecting it! Felt the need to find somewhere online to share my dismay. SpeechlessBut this is why these are defo the best books I've ever read. I'm now scared to learn what's going to happen next! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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