Walking In Another Poster's Shoes
Posted 26 June 2012 - 08:19 AM
I thought it would be interesting if we tried arguing sympathetically for a character we don't like. For instance, the anti-Cats would argue in her favour and so on.
Grey characters only-so Joff, Ramsay and Gregor are out.
I'll start with Robert B.:
The eldest son of a great House, Robert had almost every blessing-strength, beauty, wealth. But he doesn't seem to have had any stability as a youth. He lost his parents at an early age and never managed to bond with his blood-brothers. His only family growing up seems to have been his foster brother Ned: quiet, serious, solemn, loyal Ned who always stood by him.
Then came Lyanna-wild, beautiful Lyanna, his best friend's sister. Wedding her would have made him and Ned brothers in truth if Rhaegar had not thought to snatch his rights.
Robert was not a cruel man but he was vengeful. Rhaegar had taken the woman he loved and he made Seven Kingdoms bleed in compensation.
Then he weds Cersei and for the first time he is faced with a woman who doesn't fall for his charm, a woman who seems to scorn him. He is not used to being disliked and to be rebuffed by two women who should by rights have been his and in such quick succession combined with the rigorous demands of the kingdom and Ned's anger at the death of the Targerayen children drove him further into drink and debauchery.
Robert's troubles are perhaps all the more pitiable for being his own fault. To look upon a wife that hates you, an heir no better than the king you deposed and to realise daily that you are responsible for it-that is pitiable.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 08:41 AM
(more later, but I couldn't resist )
Posted 26 June 2012 - 08:55 AM
He lived in a very unfair world where the lowborns have almost no rights, they are supposed to listen to "their betters by rights of birth" and put up with their wars, their struggles and never complain. We do not know much about Bronn's past, but we can assume he did not have it easy in his life. He probably lost his family and home early in his youth and was forced to learn to take care of himself by himself. Probably he also experienced war and became desensitised for the pains and hurts of other people, he faced death and destruction and had nobody to tell him how to deal with it.
So he became a sellsword by chance just because it helped him survive somehow - maybe he joined some older experienced fighter as a squire. That person - or more such persons - was not too good role model either, but he got some protection from them and he thought their ways were the only possible to survive. When they died, like his family before, he was alone again, but richer for some lessons. He now thought that cruelty, ruthlessness, and constant struggle must be the only way of surviving in this world, because nobody taught him otherwise.
So we should not judge him because he is cruel and traitorous and selfish and thinks only about himself - we should judge the society that allowed such people to evolve, insted of helping them.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:08 AM
I can understand why she didn't thoroughly think about the consequence before releasing Jaime.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:19 AM
She's been left without a motherly figure that could have told her how to deal with the female condition in Westeros.
Also, being a lady apparently isn't a task worthy enough to earn her the fatherly approval she's always been looking for.
She's been married against her will to a drunkard that cheated on her since the first day (and, with his mind, even during their very wedding night). No wonder she's grown bitter and tends to act recklessly once she's in a position of power.
Also she tries so hard to get Tyrion killed because she genuinely believes that he's guilty and in her mind it's just to prevent him from spreading violence and murder throough the Seven Kingdoms.
So Cersei is actually a victim.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:23 AM
Hes been loyal so far to Dany and seems a competent commander. Capable of following orders as shown by his successful alliance with the Lhazereen....
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:32 AM
Ughhhh, sorry, WK, this exercise is too painful...
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:36 AM
Shower me with some Tyrion love!!!
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:40 AM
Robert saw his parents die which is very sad.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:43 AM
Posted 26 June 2012 - 09:48 AM
Shower me with some Tyrion love!!!
Tyrion is a good man who has been let down by the people who should have been his family. It takes a very strong will to resist breaking under the emotional trauma Tywin put him through as a child: the snide remarks, the put-downs, the constant reminders that, no matter how hard he tried, Tyrion would never amount to anything in his father's eyes. His brother joined the KG when Tyrion was only eleven, leaving him to grow up with a father who hated him and a sister who blamed him for her mother's death.
All this combined with Tysha led Tyrion to a very painful realisation: the world would only love him because he was a Lannister-the same reason his family hated him.
Whatever his faults may be, I can say from personal experience that one of the worst things a child can go through is having a disability and a family who doesn't love you. The depression and self-doubt it breeds, the thought that maybe, just maybe everyone else is right and that you were born to be a curse and a burden to your nearest and dearest-it's not surprising that he ends up closing people off.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 10:11 AM
Tywin was neglected as a child, but was conscious of his station. He restored the power of the Lannisters, ruled the kingdom for 20 years, and made of his grandchildren, kings and princesses. Men were in awe of him when they would laugh at his father; men trembled at the roar of the lion where they would view it as a meeeoooow while his father ruled; men would pay their debts or dread what would come to them where they would borrow more when his father ruled.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 11:14 AM
Posted 26 June 2012 - 11:17 AM
I did say Ramsay isn't allowed.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 11:34 AM
Posted 26 June 2012 - 11:52 AM
Jorah may be flawed but he's not a bad man, he's just being a bear. Sorry couldn't resist Now for real:
When he agreed to betray Dany and Viserys he didn't know them, at least not Dany. When face with the choice of Dany's death with the wine seller incident he chose Dany. He probably only continued to betray her a while longer driven by his desperation to go home.
When he finally comes around he becomes completely loyal to Dany and despite of his attracttion to her he's always willing to advise her even when it involves telling her something she doesn't want to hear. Part of Dany's success is due to all the good advice she's received from Jorah.
About Lynesse, we can commend him for always putting her well being above his own to the point that it led to his exile.
Winter's knight I hope you can appreciate this was very hard to write!
Posted 26 June 2012 - 11:56 AM
Posted 26 June 2012 - 11:57 AM
Oy, I just spoke in defence of King Bob-I know how it feels. T_T
But seriously, I think it helps to see the other side of the argument-I dislike him a little less now.
Posted 26 June 2012 - 12:10 PM
Posted 26 June 2012 - 12:22 PM