415 replies to this topic

[Fez]

According to ESPN, the Nets are still in talks about Howard

Quote

The Nets and the Orlando Magic are discussing a trade that would send Howard to the Nets for Brook Lopez, Kris Humphries, MarShon Brooks and the Nets' first-round picks in 2013, 2015 and 2017, sources said. Lopez and Humphries, who are both free agents, would go to Orlando in sign-and-trade deals.

The move would be the Nets' second blockbuster trade this week and give them a big three of Howard, Deron Williams and Joe Johnson that could rival the NBA champion Miami Heat's heralded trio of LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh.

That doesn't seem like such a good idea to me. The Nets will have all the same problems the Heat did in filling out their roster, and won't have nearly as talented a "big three' (LeBron is that big a difference imo). If they still seriously thought they could get Howard, why did they also go get Johnson?

Or, in Soviet Russia does you restrain salary cap?

[Morpheus]

Yeah, that doesn't sound good, I think a Williams/Howard centered team could still leave some room to fill other spots, Albatross Johnson throws that out the window.

I just can't see the reasoning behind getting Johnson, he is a solid player but not at the level of Williams or Howard. If Williams does leave, then they are stuck with Johnson as their centerpiece which is certainly less than desirable.

[Maithanet]

Morpheus, on 03 July 2012 - 07:52 AM, said:

Yeah, that doesn't sound good, I think a Williams/Howard centered team could still leave some room to fill other spots, Albatross Johnson throws that out the window.

I just can't see the reasoning behind getting Johnson, he is a solid player but not at the level of Williams or Howard. If Williams does leave, then they are stuck with Johnson as their centerpiece which is certainly less than desirable.

It seems like the Nets were sufficiently worried about Williams leaving that they felt like they had to bring in a second All-Star, no matter what.  And Joe Johnson is an all star; if his salary were half what he's making, this would be a fantastic deal.  But instead, you have a team that is essentially maxed out salary-wise and that can't possibly win a championship talent-wise.

It's just crazy because Williams/Howard/Wallace seemed within reach, and that is a core that A) isn't over the salary cap yet and is much more balanced than the Heat's Big Three (albeit less talented).  They could round out such a roster with players to complement Williams offensively and Howard defensively, and potentially be good at both ends.  But instead, they have Joe Johnson.  And they'll have him for a while now.

I'll give the Hawks credit.  Up until these rumors started swirling, everyone thought that Johnson contract was untradeable.

[Exa Inova]

The board must hate me. Couldnt create a new topic. whatever.

No interest in the fact that Odom goes to the Clips? No one? Ok, non issue.

Looked at the FA list and saw a few interesting names; Rashard Lewis got waived. Still a 5 million a year player in my book. And since Ray Allen probably wont play for the Heat they should/could consider Redd.

Kudos to the Hawks for ridding themselves of Iso Joe. But Who says the Nets will keep him. He got traded once, why not twice. I wouldnt go house huntin' if I were Iso.

[Howdyphillip]

Exa Inova, on 03 July 2012 - 08:30 AM, said:

No interest in the fact that Odom goes to the Clips? No one? Ok, non issue.

Before playing again, the NBA should mandate that he knock on the door of every single Dallas Maverick fan and apologize for being an ass hat,

[Jaime L]

Amazing. If the Nets are able to somehow get Dwight Howard I take back everything I said. That absolutely is taking a title shot and a big 3 of Williams, Johnson and Howard is as good as any out there. Thing is everything I read yesterday said it was impossible - not just undesirable because it puts you in the luxury tax, but impossible. But I guess everything becomes possible when you have a crazy Russian billionaire owner. Opulence he has it.

Anyway my understanding is that if they somehow pull off the trade with Orlando (and I still don't know why Orlando would do it if all you're getting is Brook Lopez and 3 #1s), Williams/Johnson/Wallace/Howard alone will put them $9 million into the luxury tax and that's before filling out the roster.

On the one hand everyone has been talking about how onerous the new luxury tax will be but on the other if it's truly a soft cap - that you can go deep into it, you just have to pay a ton extra - maybe this can work? I dunno, feel like it's hard to separate fact from fiction right now. Bucher early this morning was reporting that Dallas would be Howard's top destination if the Nets can't get it done. But then Broussard reports an hour later that the Nets and the Magic are once again hot and heavy in trade talks so I don't know what to believe.

Guess we gotta see how it pans out but it's getting really interesting.

[Morpheus]

If the Nets somehow get everything in order, what on earth would the Mavs do after losing out on both Willams and Howard?

Edited by Morpheus, 03 July 2012 - 11:08 AM.

[slothman92]

Morpheus, on 03 July 2012 - 10:28 AM, said:

If the Nets somehow get everthing in order, what on earth would the Mavs do after losing out on both Willams and Howard?

Wonder why we did not resign Chandler

[Jaime L]

Morpheus, on 03 July 2012 - 10:28 AM, said:

If the Nets somehow get everthing in order, what on earth would the Mavs do after losing out on both Willams and Howard?

They got kind of a game of thrones thing going on vs. the Nets. Mark Cuban vs. Russian Mark Cuban: either you win or you die.

And it's not looking good for Cuban*: Howard says Brooklyn is his top choice and the early rumblings were that Williams was leaning towards staying. If they whiff on both Donnie Nelson was talking about making a run at Chris Paul next year. But man that means giving up another year of Dirk's prime - they already gave up a title defense last year chasing unicorns - and even here who's to say they'd be all that likely to get Chris Paul? If Williams decides on the Nets probably makes the most sense to fight Toronto for Steve Nash this year and reunite him with Nowitzki. That doesn't put them back into title contention but at least it may be enough to keep the fans from showing up with pitchforks.

*Except for when he went on First Take and eviscerated Skip Bayless. That looked very good.

[Relic]

Jaime Bollocks, on 03 July 2012 - 10:13 AM, said:

Amazing. If the Nets are able to somehow get Dwight Howard I take back everything I said.

Ditto.

[Howdyphillip]

I am starting to get more than a little nervous for my Mavs. I keep telling myself that Dirk/Howard/Williams means a trip to the finals in the west, but Johnson/Howard/Williams do not mean that in the east. It is my only hope...

Edited by Howdyphillip, 03 July 2012 - 11:35 AM.

[Morpheus]

Word is the Mavs were not exactly  encouraged by their meeting with Williams

http://aol.sportingn...ade-free-agency

[Rhom]

So the Nets would give up their first round picks in 2013, 2015, and 2017 for Howard.  Presumably it wouldn't be a big loss because they plan on those picks being in the late 20's at the least.

But what's the word on Howard's back?  Is there any talk of the picks being conditional?  What if he has a relapse and the Nets tank.  Would Orlando have access to that high pick?

[Triskele]

Is there now some kind of scenario in which Howard goes to the Nets and Williams does not go to either the Nets or the Mavs?  That also seemed impossible a day ago.

[Morpheus]

It is all very confusing. I keep reading that the Magic are really not interested in the Nets offer as it isn't very good, and are continuing to seek other bids for Howard. Obviously Howard's insistance on going to Brooklyn is an obstacle, but if another team is willing to make a better offer in the hopes they can entice Dwight to stay over the course of next season, Orlando may take that. Of course, Dwight has proven to be such a fickle asshat that it would need to be  a desperate team indeed that would risk so much in an attempt to convince him to give up his Brooklyn dreams.

This will just continue to be the source of rampant specualtion until a deal is actually struck between the Magic and...someone. Deron Williams is expected to make a decision possibly by the end of this week, so that at least will be put to bed.

Edited by Morpheus, 03 July 2012 - 12:35 PM.

[Rhom]

Morpheus, on 03 July 2012 - 12:31 PM, said:

It is all very confusing. I keep reading that the Magic are really not interested in the Nets offer as it isn't very good, and are continuing to seek other bids for Howard. Obviously Howard's insistance on going to Brooklyn is an obstacle, but if another team is willing to make a better offer in the hopes they can entice Dwight to stay over the course of next season, Orlando may take that. Of course, Dwight has proven to be such a fickle asshat that it would need to be  a desperate team indeed that would risk so much in an attempt to convince him to give up his Brooklyn dreams.

I keep hearing that the deal isn't good, but what's the problem?  Brooke Lopez was highly regarded when he came out of Stanford a couple years ago.  MarShon Brooks seems to be thought of as an up-and-comer.  Kris Humphries brings some press I suppose.  Three first round picks is nothing to sneeze at.  Yes, in the NBA if it isn't a lottery pick you aren't likely to find a future superstar... but I don't know what team could possibly offer more than that.

(Unless they think they have a real shot at convincing LA to give up Andrew Bynum... but they're getting rid of one headache in Howard, don't know why they'd want a second.)

[Morpheus]

I keep hearing that the Magic's desire is simply to have the pieces to remain a playoff team, they know they can't get equal value for Dwight so I don't think they could hope for more beyond that. I don't know that the Nets deal gives them much hope there. Maybe it is just unrealistic, barring a trade for Bynum, because the East could get a lot more competitive if they make a deal with the Nets.

Edited by Morpheus, 03 July 2012 - 12:47 PM.

[Morpheus]

And the Raptors are trying to fuck the Knicks' shit up over Steve Nash, giving Landry Field way more than he is worth

http://www.businessi...ks-trade-2012-7

Edited by Morpheus, 03 July 2012 - 01:11 PM.

[Fez]

Does the NBA CBA allow teams to pick part of the salary (and cap hit) of a traded player? if they had to, could the Nets make the centerpiece of their offer to the Magic be Joe Johnson where like 1/3 of his salary and cap will be covered by the Nets?  If its truly a soft cap then its not like Russian Mark Cuban will care I'd think.

[Jaime L]

Rhom, on 03 July 2012 - 12:38 PM, said:

(Unless they think they have a real shot at convincing LA to give up Andrew Bynum... but they're getting rid of one headache in Howard, don't know why they'd want a second.)

You have to think that's clearly what the Magic would and should want but Howard keeps poisoning the well with his declaration that he'll only re-sign with the Nets. You know at least Lebron went where he did because he wanted a ring...Howard seems only interested in being in New York and hanging with Jay-Z.

Anyway, now that they're out from Joe Johnson's albatross contract Atlanta could also make a better offer than the Nets if they're willing to make Al Horford the centerpiece of the deal and I assume Danny Ferry would.

Orlando has (or should have) no loyalty to anything Howard wants so if either LA or Atlanta were willing to put those offers on the table unconditionally I would be signing the deal before the ink dried.

Trzysztof Trieślowski, on 03 July 2012 - 12:22 PM, said:

Is there now some kind of scenario in which Howard goes to the Nets and Williams does not go to either the Nets or the Mavs?  That also seemed impossible a day ago.

It's sounding more and more like Deron Williams is gonna sign with the Nets regardless but everyone is pessimistic that they have enough assets to entice the Magic to trade Howard there. That said, if they are now able and willing to fit them all in with the steep luxury tax then it really only delays things a year (assuming Howard means what he says for once).