VaramyrSixchins Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Can someone refresh my memory as to why Mel made the switch?For the very good reasons others pointed out, but there's also the possibility that Mel wants a little king's blood on tap should the need arise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 I've seen a few people say recently that Stannis definitely knows about the glamor. I'm gonna read those chapters again...But until then... if you believe Stannis knows, why are you so confident? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monctonvike Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 I really don't think he knows at all. There seem to be only subtle hints that he may know. Until I see more I would say he doesn't. It is too bad as this could end up getting him killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 "Our false king has a prickly manner," Melisandre told Jon Snow, "but he will not betray you. We hold his son, remember. And he owes you his very life.""Me?" Snow sounded startled."Who else, my lord? Only his life's blood could pay for his crimes, your laws said, and Stannis Baratheon is not a man to go against the law . . . but as you said so sagely, the laws of men end at the wall. Jon saved Mance with the argument that the laws of men end at the wall. Melisandre doesn't give a rat's arse about the laws of men, if she saved Mance without Stannis' knowledge this explanation makes no sense. Stannis obviously does care for the laws of men, it is Stannis who has been swayed by Jon's argument and thus Jon saved Mance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerWalterPuffsAlot Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Jon saved Mance with the argument that the laws of men end at the wall. Melisandre doesn't give a rat's arse about the laws of men, if she saved Mance without Stannis' knowledge this explanation makes no sense. Stannis obviously does care for the laws of men, it is Stannis who has been swayed by Jon's argument and thus Jon saved Mance. I took that as she was justifying why she could do something behind Stannis' back. But it def makes sense your way a lil more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Stannis gives "RattleMance" to Jon. It makes no sense for Stannis to give Jon Rattleshirt as Stannis knows Jon hates Rattleshirt. It makes every sense however that Stannis gives Mance to Jon, and to then act like it's a gift, even if Jon isn't aware of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drunkard Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Melisandre says that the ruby on Rattleshirt's wrist ensures his loyalty to Jon; she could've said the exact same thing to Stannis, and she has a history of bending the truth to make him do things he wouldn't otherwise do. Jon may hate Rattleshirt, but if Stannis thinks his loyalty is magically assured that's no longer a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 Of course. He is the one who let him live in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickdt Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well, Stannis is capable of doing such things. Either lord would have chopped off Davos head for smuggling, but Stannis remembered that without Davos SE would have fallen during RR. In place of its head, he cuts off Davos fingertips. That is why Davos is so extremely loyal to Stannis, because he knows when Robert was the one in SE, he would have lost his life. Stannis can show compassion, when it is most needed. He knew Jon hated RS and therefor, he choose RS to take Mances place and with Mels help, everybody thought Mance was death. So yeah, Stannis knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bironic Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well, Stannis is capable of doing such things. Either lord would have chopped off Davos head for smuggling, but Stannis remembered that without Davos SE would have fallen during RR. In place of its head, he cuts off Davos fingertips. That is why Davos is so extremely loyal to Stannis, because he knows when Robert was the one in SE, he would have lost his life. Stannis can show compassion, when it is most needed. He knew Jon hated RS and therefor, he choose RS to take Mances place and with Mels help, everybody thought Mance was death. So yeah, Stannis knows. Don't agree with you on that. Robert was known to be openhanded and merciful. Robert surely had faults, but he always rewarded those who served him loyally. I'd rather see Robert not chopping off Davos Fingers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watermelon Knight Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Stannis doesn't know. After he discovers the truth, he will rush back to confront Melissandra only to face her utter contempt since she will have finally hooked up with the true AA. With the full strength of the Wildings in his control, AA's puissance will eclipse Stannis's leaving the pretender to face a choice: bend the knee or die. The true Lightbringer (Longclaw) will be the sword that beheads Stannis. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatsHisFace Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 When I first read it, I didn't think Stannis knew, but now I'm not so sure. Mel always talks about the power of king's blood and proved her point to Stannis with the leeches she burned off of Edric Storm. Mel mentions that Mance has king's blood. This is the the entire reason for the baby switch plot that Jon concocted. Jon was afraid that Mel would convince Stannis to burn either the Mance baby or Measter Aemon (for his Targ blood). So Jon believes that Stannis can be talked into burning the baby for its king's blood, but Stannis already burned Mance, the source of the king's blood. However, Stannis didn't expect anything in return from Mance's death. No powers, no gifts, nothing. This gives me reason to believe that Stannis is in on it, but it may just be an oversight by GRRM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drunkard Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 When does Mel ever suggest that Mance has kings blood? The entire reason for the baby swap was Jon hearing the muttering of a feverish queens man, and preemptively acting just in case they were evidence of something to come. As it turns out they weren't, as neither Stannis nor Melisandre give a damn about the child or Aemon's sudden evacuation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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