Long Price Quartet vs. The Black Company vs. Prince of Nothing

[1918me]

I've seen these three series recommended a lot on this board, and since I'm lacking reading material right now, I've decided to finally try one of them, but I'm debating on which one I should check out first. They all seem really cool in their own rights, but I was wondering if anyone had any preferences/suggestions?

[Horza]

All really different, depends what you want.

Long Price is an epic series with a very intimate, personal focus at times. I like it quite a bit.

Prince of Nothing is an epic epic with Characters Who Are Embodiments Of Ideologies. I didn't go past the first trilogy.

Black Company is told in first person, it's quite different from the other two and pioneered a bunch of fantasy tropes, so while it was pretty unique at the time of writing some of it might be a bit over-familiar (esp. if you've read Malazan) I've read the first and will read some of the others eventually.

[Xray the Enforcer]

Agreed with Horza's take. All three are very different, and it really depends on personal tastes. I have enjoyed all three, although it's useful to pinpoint exact terminology of what we're talking about here in terms of books:

The Books of the Black Company (omnibus trilogy, first three books of a longer series, possibly now complete)

Prince of Nothing trilogy (first three books of a longer series, not yet complete)

The Long Price Quartet (four books of a complete and finished series)

Black Company is essentially a fantasy take on the Vietnam tale (this was a whole class of books that came out in the 70s and 80s). First person POV and the POV is pretty fun. Shamelessly bogarted by Erikson to make Malazan. Lots of swashbuckle and absurdity. I've read at least 6 of these books so far.

Prince of Nothing is all about using archetypes to flog a philosophical/ideological debate. Lots of wizards and shit, but also a lot of ponderous exposition. I read the first trilogy and decided to stop there.

Long Price Quartet is a character-driven fantasy about the price of imperialism, xenophobia and trying harness power that you shouldn't have (the Andats). While there's some crazy shit that goes down, it's essentially melacholic/tragic.

Of the three, I am most fond of Long Price and Black Company.

[1918me]

Thanks, that's really helpful! I think I'll probably go with Long Price Quartet first, although I'll definitely end up trying all three at some point.

[RedEyedGhost]

Thanks, that's really helpful! I think I'll probably go with Long Price Quartet first, although I'll definitely end up trying all three at some point.

The Long Price is my favorite work of fiction. You can't go wrong with that choice.

[Kalbear]

Long Price is one of the better fantasy stories to come out in a long time. Partially because the characters are so good, partially because the story is so astoundingly sad and awesome, partially because the twists are incredible, and partially because unlike so many other fantasy novels it feels like a totally different world instead of 'England with nukes in the 1300s'.

Of the three, it is easily what I'd recommend first. It's also quite short, so it should be fairly simple to get into.

Be warned: the first book is the worst of the lot. It isn't great (Abraham actually told me this at Denver con) - but it gets better. Really, really good. A betrayal in Winter is phenomenally good, and an Autumn war is incredible.

That being said - all three series are good, but appeal to different fanbases. I'll be very generic here.

If you like Erikson, you'll love Glen Cook.

If you like Donaldson, chances are you'll like Prince of Nothing.

If you like Martin, chances are you'll really like Abraham.

[Rhom]

The Long Price is my favorite work of fiction. You can't go wrong with that choice.

Strong statement there. May need to bump that up on my reading list.

[AUyushu]

Long Price is one of the better fantasy stories to come out in a long time. Partially because the characters are so good, partially because the story is so astoundingly sad and awesome, partially because the twists are incredible, and partially because unlike so many other fantasy novels it feels like a totally different world instead of 'England with nukes in the 1300s'.

Of the three, it is easily what I'd recommend first. It's also quite short, so it should be fairly simple to get into.

Be warned: the first book is the worst of the lot. It isn't great (Abraham actually told me this at Denver con) - but it gets better. Really, really good. A betrayal in Winter is phenomenally good, and an Autumn war is incredible.

That being said - all three series are good, but appeal to different fanbases. I'll be very generic here.

If you like Erikson, you'll love Glen Cook.

If you like Donaldson, chances are you'll like Prince of Nothing.

If you like Martin, chances are you'll really like Abraham.

I'd agree on Cook and Erikson, but not really on the other comparisons. Martin and Abraham are nothing alike other than both are excellent writers (at least if we are talking about the Long Prince series). I don't think Donaldson and Bakker are anything alike either other than both have lots of philosophy in their fantasy (and I could see some similarities between Akka and Covenant, but that's about it).

I love Cook and Erikson, love Martin. I found the Long Prince decent, but it's not something I've really recommended to any of my friends who read fantasy. It's such a slow mood driven piece, without any great action or really any interesting characters except for the main character (well the andat are interesting as well, but so little is done with them they might as well be ornaments). He's an exceptional writer, but that series is just merely good not great for me. I will say I'm about half way through the first book of Dragon's Path atm and have found it excellent so far.

I didn't like Donaldson's first two Convenant trilogies at all really, but I enjoy the PON books. Bakker can be annoying with some of the more ridiculous parts of his rapey bad guys and his tendency to wank on the page with his philosophy, but overall his series is excellent.

[Spring Bass]

I'll fourth or fifth reading the Long Price Quartet first, and I'm saying that as a big fan of the Prince of Nothing. Aside from being very good, it's also more accessible than Prince of Nothing and (to a lesser extent) the Black Company.

I seem to be the only person on this forum for whom A Shadow in Summer was their favorite book in the Quartet. Go figure. I enjoyed it more than A Betrayal in Winter or The Price of Spring, and much more than An Autumn War.

[Castel]

I've got to be in the minority here but I've always thought that Black Company was overrated. I didn't see anything interesting in the first two books I read except perhaps an interesting take on his Nazgul expies, and then he brought in that tired Chosen One trope that I associate with old 80s fantasy and hate. It's not just the prophecy section that I dislike (Bakker has that as well), it's the way it's done, it feels like a convenient contrivance.

It may have been good in it's time, and it certainly was an enjoyable read, I didn't find it that challenging or thought-provoking.

Prince of Nothing is good, but only if you can stand terrible characters, far more so than you would have to in say, Martin's works. It's easy to fall into a rut and not really give a damn about anyone because they're all either terrible or timid sheep.

The writing is good, although at times the prose makes me feel like I'm reading a Star Wars spacefight, I have no idea what's going on. I got invested and began to enjoy it later on. It can be hella disturbing though.

I haven't read the Long Price quartet.

[Shryke]

All 3 are good but very different in feel. (ok, Black Company goes to shit after the initial trilogy, but whatever)

Black Company are like war novels. Fairly low level, sparse on filling in all the blanks and not really about big world shattering change or anything.

Prince of Nothing is a fantasy epic with everything that entails. (though darker and more philosophical)

Long Price is epic in scope, but isn't really like your traditional fantasy epic and is more of a character focused series. There's big events, but the books aren't told in an epic style. It's very low key in many ways.

[Billy Quizboy]

Glen Cook > *

[Marcus Cicero]

This is one of my hangups with Long Price. I don't want to spoil anything for the OP, but it seems that not only is this series loved by this board but that it's loved for it's characterization. I found that to be the weakness of the series and not the strength.

I liked the prose plenty well, and I loved the andat concept, and so the real implications of said andat really kicked in during the latter half of the series. But the characters felt wooden to me.

I think I've said this before, and it's a harsh critique to compare to Martin, but here't goes. If you give me a random line said by a character in ASOIAF, I would have a very reasonable chance of being able to apply it to a given character. That's true of many books.

In Long Price, I feel like I'd have nearly zero chance. It could be Otah, it could be Maati, it could be Cemai, it could be Idaan...their actions do distinguish them, but their personalities don't really shine through the way that I would like.

Well put. This is one of the reasons I didn't immediately continue the series after finishing A Shadow in Summer. I plan on finishing it at some point, seeing as everyone says it gets better, but I don't know when.

[Billy Quizboy]

Seriously though, all of them are great. I don't know if the second Long Price Omnibus is out in the US though.

[RedEyedGhost]

Strong statement there. May need to bump that up on my reading list.

You should have read it years ago :P

Seriously though, all of them are great. I don't know if the second Long Price Omnibus is out in the US though.

November 27th.

[Errant Bard]

it seems that not only is this series loved by this board but that it's loved for it's characterization. I found that to be the weakness of the series and not the strength.

I liked the prose plenty well, and I loved the andat concept, and so the real implications of said andat really kicked in during the latter half of the series. But the characters felt wooden to me.

Hmm, I'm not sure the board is talking of characterization in that way, at least I cannot remember raves about how the characters feel distinct and deep. To me, the main draw is that the whole feels consistent and real, there was no point where I was kicked out of the story by the realization this guy or this other was the <insert archetype> and everything would revert to foreseeable status quo by the end. In that way, a certain lack of flashiness works for me: people in reality are not really that different from each other, even if they have a distinct personality, so what we get is a good reflection of situations in real life, and the absence of return to status quo is what seals the deal: people are just people, but some stuff they do makes the world change, inexorably, then they die but the world goes on.

If we compare this to ASOIAF, it's day and night, in regard to predictability, world changes, genericity and relatability. I don't read ASOIAF for the story, I read it to see how Martin will manage to write the inevitable -for the writing tricks- but when I read the Long Price, I read it to see what would happen. In a way, it's the inverse of you: having characters who are all that "special", where as you say, you can guess who said a random sentence given to you, ends up feeling gimmicky to me, the real value lying in what's said or asked with them (hence why AFFC is the best book of the series.)

[MisterOJ]

FWIW, I loved Black Company for some easy reading. It was a fun little read.

OTOH, I just started The Long Price last week and I am having a really hard time getting into it. I can tell he is just setting up all the characters, but I just want something to happen already. It's very tedious so far, but I'll muddle through. This book will probably take me a while, because it just isn't holding my attention very good right now.

[wolverine]

Prince of Nothing is my favorite of these three. I have read up through the first book in the second trilogy and I thought it was excellent. I don't understand the comparison between Abercrombie and Martin at all. I have actually only read the first book of The Long Price and like MisterOJ the first book did not hold my interest very well, but many have said that they feel the first one is the weakest one.

[Errant Bard]

many have said that they feel the first one is the weakest one.

Even if it's the weakest, the difference is not all that great, you should not expect some dramatic changes in storytelling in the next three.

[Shryke]

I don't think the first book is the weakest (I think it's one of the stronger ones)

The Long Price quartet is just not a series that's action-packed.