145 replies to this topic

[Brownk48]

I find Jojen's depression very odd during A Dance with Dragons.

He has been one of the most level headed and mature characters throughout this story, which has lead him to earn the nickname "little grandfather" back in Greywater Watch.  He has seemingly never had a fear of death throughout the story because he keeps claiming that this is not the day that he dies; which proves that he might have an idea when he will meet his demise and acknowledges his fate.

What I find weird is his new attitude once getting to the cave.  One would think that someone as mature as him would find relief and honor in fulfilling what he believes is his destiny of freeing the winged wolf from his chain; however, it's the quite opposite, he's maligned and will not elaborate on his thoughts.

I honestly believe that he's too honorable to be fearing about his own future and that his depression is due to what's going to happen in the seven kingdoms during TWoW.  Perhaps he was tricked by Bloodraven into bringing Bran to him and now he is having greendreams about what the two will accomplish together.

It seems like he desperately wants to leave the cave and fight the one thing that he has always said is inevitable; his own greendreams.

What do you think Jojen's future holds? Does he have second thoughts about bringing Bran to Bloodraven? Is he fearing his family's demise in Greywater watch? Is he fearing the Long Night?

[CerseiLover89]

I also think that Jojen is having second thoughts about bringing Bran to Bloodraven. I haven't quite figured out why yet, but I just get a bad feeling about Bran. I'm really not sold on the going into a tree being a good thing. Albeit it does make for a pretty cool way to show us CoF & what not.

[Where Boars Glow]

Future = paste

[The Third Reed]

Where whores go <-, on 17 December 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

Future = paste

Still waiting for some evidence on that one, a year and a half on.

[Where Boars Glow]

The Third Reed, on 17 December 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

Still waiting for some evidence on that one, a year and a half on.

You don't remember the part where Bran said "This paste smells like someones old grandfather" ?

[Brownk48]

I feel that Jojen is kind of acting in a similar manner to when he was afraid to tell Bran about the greendreams he had about the fall of winterfell and Bran's death... I don't believe in the paste theory; I just think he's having some serious greendreams regarding his home, the others, or Bloodraven and Bran's future together.

[StuSeaworth]

Brownk48, on 10 December 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

He has been one of the most level headed and mature characters throughout this story, which has lead him to earn the nickname "little grandfather" back in Greywater Watch.  

Maybe not relevant to the topic, but didn't Old Nan give him that nickname?

[andrew_]

Jojen will die. It is known.

[Koekfabriek]

I thought that Meera said to Brann that Jojen has seen his own dead when he came back to GWW (if I am wrong please correct), It is kinda depressing knowing after the cave adventure you are going to day coming safe back home.

[TyrionsFlagon]

andrew02, on 18 December 2012 - 09:54 AM, said:

Jojen will die. It is known.

Valar Morghulis

Edited by TyrionsFlagon, 18 December 2012 - 05:09 PM.

[cold-king1990]

whether or not Bran ate a portion of Jojen paste or not is insure, im leaning towards it though, because it seems to me he could be sad that his time is at an end and on top of that meera becomes depressed somewhat and jojens no longer seen or spoke to by the end of ADWD

[The Mountain That Flies]

Might Jojen just be depressed because he no longer has a function? His entire arc from CoK through most of DwD was educating Bran and getting him to Bloodraven. Now that's done, but he can't really leave the cave, so he's just suck there, watching Bran grow further beyond him and being left with nothing.

[The Chequered Raven]

andrew02, on 18 December 2012 - 09:54 AM, said:

Jojen will die. It is known.

I think so, too.

During the voyage he has stated more than once that he know his death. In dangerous situation he has often said to Meera "this is not the day I die!" But he has never said when or how he will die.

If you know your death, it is quite relaxing in dangerous situations knowing it's far away. But it will be also depressing if you know it's real close now...

Also his story-arc seems to be fullfilled. He has said that he has seen (in his greendreams) the winged Wolf (=Bran) in chains, and that it was his Job to unchain him.
What he had done. He has brought him to the 3EC, helped him to improve his warging-skills, and within the cave his job as a teacher seems to have passed on to the CoF and the 3EC.

[ross1983]

"he wants to go home" meera told bran "he will not even try and fight his fate. He says the greendreams do not lie."
Jojen will die unless meera and bran, with his new powers, will fight for him. I know jojens dreams haven't been wrong yet, but the future is never certain.

[Whitering]

Acch, I don't want Meera to die, it's only a little better than Arya, they are cut from a similar cloth and could be super friends, if Arya wasn't a little sociopathic by this point.

I never for a moment thought of Jojen paste before coming to these forums after reading the book. I will stick with my initial belief.

[Fire Eater]

I think Jojen knows the day he dies is coming. Meera states: "He will not even try and fight his fate. He says the greendreams do not lie."

I don't buy into the Jojen paste theory, since there is no evidence behind it.

Edited by Fire Eater, 20 December 2012 - 07:03 PM.

[The Third Reed]

Fire Eater, on 20 December 2012 - 07:02 PM, said:

I think Jojen knows the day he dies is coming. Meera states: "He will not even try and fight his fate. He says the greendreams do not lie."

I don't buy into the Jojen paste theory, since there is no evidence behind it.

Mwah.

[George W. Lannister]

I think Jojen is the pink wax on "the Ramsay letter" sent to LC Jon Snow. Bran faked it all and sent the raven in order to get Jon down to Winterfell to assume his Starkness!

[Lord Ben]

I think he's a frail kid with a lot on his mind who just made a journey the First Ranger would have been hard pressed to make.

I think if he was sacrificed for Bran it would have been a bigger moment than just a hint of it.  I think his fate lies at the Neck but he wants to go home anyway.

[sumant30]

Quote

If you know your death, it is quite relaxing in dangerous situations knowing it's far away. But it will be also depressing if you know it's real close now...

Also his story-arc seems to be fullfilled. He has said that he has seen (in his greendreams) the winged Wolf (=Bran) in chains, and that it was his Job to unchain him.
What he had done. He has brought him to the 3EC, helped him to improve his warging-skills, and within the cave his job as a teacher seems to have passed on to the CoF and the 3EC.

This is quite sensible theory on jojen being depressed.

Quote

I think Jojen is the pink wax on "the Ramsay letter" sent to LC Jon Snow. Bran faked it all and sent the raven in order to get Jon down to Winterfell to assume his Starkness!

Nice imagination dude.