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Spoiler free impressions of aMoL...


fionwe1987

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Larry, you wrote in your The Gathering Storm review:

It looks like Sanderson's next WoT books didn't work for you.

Nope. They most certainly didn't and in hindsight even TGS was flawed, in terms of what followed. I'll cover that when I write the review later this week.

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Larry:

The complaints I had in the last book are only amplified here: structural mess, even poorer dialogue than usual for this series, and a few other matters. I'll write a review this weekend, but it was underwhelming, at least the first 1/3 (and skipping around the rest, including reading the final 50 pages) that I've read so far. No way that the remaining pages to be read can redeem this steaming pile of elephant shit.

Hmm.

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What's bugging me most about aMoL after 250 pages is the lack of any evident effort at pre-modern language and diction. I mean, really: "understated powers of cognitive expression." (To add insult to injury, that doesn't even mean what Sanderson thinks it means.) There's no subtlety or subtext; characters ruminate on or describe exactly what they're feeling and what their arc has been. And after a prologue that interwove several storylines to good effect, the movement among different settings in the main text seems almost designed to sap momentum and whatever atmosphere of imminent doom has been generated. I haven't read a WoT book in years, so I don't know to what extent I'd have these same complaints about earlier volumes, but aMoL is only working for me as "turn-your-brain-off-except-to-laugh-at-the-ludicrous-dialogue" entertainment. Which is a shame, since some of the ideas are interesting in the broad strokes, and you can see how Jordan was trying to address certain potent themes.

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Brendan - Those are widely-held criticisms of Sanderson's handling of WOT. I don't know whether or not it applies to his own writing, but he has a knack for taking previously mysterious and subtle characters and warping them nearly into caricatures (case in point: Talmanes). I think this is a result of the characters not being his own, meaning he has a lot less internalized knowledge about them to draw from in comparison to Jordan.

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I read all the spoilers as they came out, and grabbed the book yesterday. I'm about 300 pages in and I'm enjoying it despite the spoilers. Only one part has been dampened for me as now I'm expecting it to happen and the final scenes with these characters are tarnished by my knowledge of whats to come. Other than that, if I didn't have to work today I'd have likely stayed up all night reading.

I'll never understand people who complain about how shitty something is they're voluntarily participating in, yet they keep voluntarily participating. Makes me think these people get off on complaining or just love to wallow in (what they believe is) shit. In which case, I can point out several lovely hog farms for your enjoyment.

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Brendan - Those are widely-held criticisms of Sanderson's handling of WOT. I don't know whether or not it applies to his own writing, but he has a knack for taking previously mysterious and subtle characters and warping them nearly into caricatures (case in point: Talmanes). I think this is a result of the characters not being his own, meaning he has a lot less internalized knowledge about them to draw from in comparison to Jordan.

I didn't really notice it in the previous 2 books, but it really stands out here. Especially with characters like Matt, Talmanes and Aviendha.

On page 375 now and I'm mostly enjoying it.

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I didn't really notice it in the previous 2 books, but it really stands out here. Especially with characters like Matt, Talmanes and Aviendha.

Yeah, I've noticed it a bit in the last two books but it's definitely more noticeable in this book, it's a bit jarring sometimes. Still other than that it's pretty enjoyable so far.

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What's bugging me most about aMoL after 250 pages is the lack of any evident effort at pre-modern language and diction. I mean, really: "understated powers of cognitive expression." (To add insult to injury, that doesn't even mean what Sanderson thinks it means.) There's no subtlety or subtext; characters ruminate on or describe exactly what they're feeling and what their arc has been. And after a prologue that interwove several storylines to good effect, the movement among different settings in the main text seems almost designed to sap momentum and whatever atmosphere of imminent doom has been generated. I haven't read a WoT book in years, so I don't know to what extent I'd have these same complaints about earlier volumes, but aMoL is only working for me as "turn-your-brain-off-except-to-laugh-at-the-ludicrous-dialogue" entertainment. Which is a shame, since some of the ideas are interesting in the broad strokes, and you can see how Jordan was trying to address certain potent themes.

That's Sanderson for ya. Especially the blatant inability to stick to any sort of level of diction established for a setting.

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i was hoping for a favor from someone knowledgeable about WOT.

I would like to finish this series but I haven't read a WOT book since 2003. Crossroads of Twilight was the final book that I read. Now, it has obviously been a while, but someone around 2007-8 I decided to just wait till the whole thing was done.

Now I don't want to read 10 books that I have already read but I need a refresher. I feel I should read some before jumping into book 11. So could someone make a quick list of must read sections?

for example, all of book 6, the final third of 8 and the second half of 9.

in other words, where is the important stuff? or should i just read summaries?

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i was hoping for a favor from someone knowledgeable about WOT.

I would like to finish this series but I haven't read a WOT book since 2003. Crossroads of Twilight was the final book that I read. Now, it has obviously been a while, but someone around 2007-8 I decided to just wait till the whole thing was done.

Now I don't want to read 10 books that I have already read but I need a refresher. I feel I should read some before jumping into book 11. So could someone make a quick list of must read sections?

for example, all of book 6, the final third of 8 and the second half of 9.

in other words, where is the important stuff? or should i just read summaries?

Personally I would just read summaries. If you are just reading key sections or just reading summaries, then the adventures of tertiary characters are going to get left out either way. You'll just have to accept that you won't remember every single character and what exactly they are up to. But I feel totally caught up from having read Leigh Butler's reread blog. Some people find her commentary annoying, and I find it enjoyable for the most part. That's a pretty detailed reread though, you might not need that much just to dive into book 11. Hell, you might not need anything at all, you'll probably get by fine just starting in book 11, so long as you had something like a character index.

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Personally I would just read summaries. If you are just reading key sections or just reading summaries, then the adventures of tertiary characters are going to get left out either way. You'll just have to accept that you won't remember every single character and what exactly they are up to. But I feel totally caught up from having read Leigh Butler's reread blog. Some people find her commentary annoying, and I find it enjoyable for the most part. That's a pretty detailed reread though, you might not need that much just to dive into book 11. Hell, you might not need anything at all, you'll probably get by fine just starting in book 11, so long as you had something like a character index.

that is pretty detailed. it's not too long. i'll try that first and if i don't like the commentary aspect maybe i'll switch it up. thanks

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Picking up the book tomorrow at the Lexington signing... but had to make a stop by my local Barnes & Noble today and had to tear my eyes away from the multiple displays strategically placed throughout the store!

So tempting...

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I'll never understand people who complain about how shitty something is they're voluntarily participating in, yet they keep voluntarily participating. Makes me think these people get off on complaining or just love to wallow in (what they believe is) shit. In which case, I can point out several lovely hog farms for your enjoyment.

That's because you approach reading this from the prospective of a (potential) fan. I am not afforded that as I review as a freelancer on occasion, so my reading is as focused on discerning what does and doesn't "work" as much as anything else. Compared to what I like best, this (and the series) has horrid writing, characterizations, plot execution, etc. Not going to put lipstick on a pig or perfume with rose scent a turd. Sorry.

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That's because you approach reading this from the prospective of a (potential) fan. I am not afforded that as I review as a freelancer on occasion, so my reading is as focused on discerning what does and doesn't "work" as much as anything else. Compared to what I like best, this (and the series) has horrid writing, characterizations, plot execution, etc. Not going to put lipstick on a pig or perfume with rose scent a turd. Sorry.

But why choose to read the 'turd' in the first place? It's not like it's turning out to be any different than your expectations. And why choose to to spread it around so much more than pretty much any other book you read?

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But why choose to read the 'turd' in the first place? It's not like it's turning out to be any different than your expectations. And why choose to to spread it around so much more than pretty much any other book you read?

Because I had chosen to review the previous books and was closing it out? Because I thought it wouldn't be as poorly-written as it turned out to be compared to the others? Because I'm going to have fun with this on Twitter as an experiment in short-form commenting before writing a formal piece? Because you might have missed my coverage of hundreds of other books because they aren't as personally important to you as this book might be?

It's a matter of perception, Ken. After all, I wasn't the one who posted a positive (or negative) review on as many outlets as possible as some others commenting here have done on occasion ;) But fair is fair, I suppose: I'll post my review of George Saunders' Tenth of December here shortly. It's the antithesis of AMoL when it comes to writing quality.

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But why choose to read the 'turd' in the first place? It's not like it's turning out to be any different than your expectations. And why choose to to spread it around so much more than pretty much any other book you read?

I was wondering this myself. When it's the last book in a series, it's going to sell. No review, good or bad, is going to sway the people who have rad the previous 13 tomes. For your blog followers? You could've just posted a "Not going to read it because the last two Sanderson installments leave me with no confidence. etc" and been done with it. Why subject yourself to 800 pages of torture when you could read two or three books you could potentially enjoy with the same effort.

I don't mean to target you individually, Larry. I have the same question to anyone who has disliked the series over the years (and there have been times when I've been fed up too) who now expect something different at the curtain call.

ETA: post was written while Larry responded.

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I was wondering this myself. When it's the last book in a series, it's going to sell. No review, good or bad, is going to sway the people who have rad the previous 13 tomes. For your blog followers? You could've just posted a "Not going to read it because the last two Sanderson installments leave me with no confidence. etc" and been done with it. Why subject yourself to 800 pages of torture when you could read two or three books you could potentially enjoy with the same effort.

I don't mean to target you individually, Larry. I have the same question to anyone who has disliked the series over the years (and there have been times when I've been fed up too) who now expect something different at the curtain call.

ETA: post was written while Larry responded.

If you saw my review of the first Sanderson WoT book, it was guardedly optimistic. The next volume destroyed that, but not to the point that I wouldn't finish it off. So that's why I took it up. I knew the spoilers weeks before release date, so it's not the plot elements that I found to be wretched, but rather the execution of them. And here's another thing: when I will write the review tomorrow, I'm going to explore this in depth, which means touching upon what was positive as well as what were deficiencies. Some people refuse to write negative reviews because it takes something out of them, but for myself, writing critiques sometimes allows me more insight into not just what was bad, but also why some might enjoy it despite its poor qualities.

But sometimes people just have to read poorly-constructed novels/series in order to better understand what "works" in the better ones. But in order to do that, fan cards are to be turned in, I guess.

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i was hoping for a favor from someone knowledgeable about WOT.

I would like to finish this series but I haven't read a WOT book since 2003. Crossroads of Twilight was the final book that I read. Now, it has obviously been a while, but someone around 2007-8 I decided to just wait till the whole thing was done.

Now I don't want to read 10 books that I have already read but I need a refresher. I feel I should read some before jumping into book 11. So could someone make a quick list of must read sections?

for example, all of book 6, the final third of 8 and the second half of 9.

in other words, where is the important stuff? or should i just read summaries?

Encyclopaedia-WoT has really good chapter summaries with annotations indicating important stuff / plot points that come up later / links between shit that was already mentioned 10 books ago etc.

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3 days for the mobi/epub ebooks to hit the web. Must be a new record.

ETA: If someone wants the hardcover pm me your address - I'll amazon it over to you. Its not about cost, its about convenience.

That is, if you trust me with your address :leer: UK only.

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