Theories for TWoW, round 2 [SPOILERS]

[jbent87]

This book is going to make A Storm of Swords look like a happy fairy tale in comparison.

It is going to be dark, both psychologically and figuratively with the Wall coming down, The Long Night beginning, and the death and betrayals of cherished and beloved characters by the handfuls.

Martin will leave nothing but embers of hope left for the readers as the Song of Apocalypse plays out. These boards on this forum are going to erupt with rants, rages, doom, gloom, tears, and mutterings.

TPTWP will have a new meaning... The Pain that was Promised

Readers will question more than ever why they decided to jump into this story and blame everyone who introduced them to these works. They will be left with a stomach that wont settle, a bad taste in their mouths, and a silent question on their lips..."Why?"

The writing of course will be Martin's finest and we the readers will have our souls flayed begging Martin to cut out our heart as we will masochistically turn each page unable to stop.

Only once the book has been read completely and our soul completely devoured will we be able to put it down as the shock settles in.

People will ask you how good it was, only to see the " empty horror of being mind flayed" expression you will be wearing until a Dream of Spring.

come on man. Can't make a post like this and not give any examples/theories.

[Plaxor]

Might as well give some wild theories for fun.

Sansa

Sansa will come into her own and take control of her life. I imagine that she'll decide to abandon her Stark name, and wholly become Alayne. She'll defy Littlefinger, perhaps to the point of his exile from the Reach. I can't see her killing him, but there is some possibility that she could have someone else kill him. If so, it would be rape/heat of the moment/didn't know what she was saying.

The problem with her killing him directly, especially if planned, is that she would associate it too much with Joffrey. She simply knows him too well, empathizes with him on some level.

She could kill someone she doesn't know however. I actually could see her killing Breanne, out of a panicked need to preserve her identity. Still, I don't think readers would like to see this, since it would invariably result in Sansa backtracking into PTSD or becoming soulless.

I actually think that the controversial thing that will happen is that she will marry Robert. That it will be her choice, out of defiance and that she will possibly have to consumate the marriage. Robert will die of course.

If not, she will somehow end up in control of the Reach, and decide to send her armies NOT to support Stannis, but to support Tommen against Aegor. The reason being that Sansa has come to believe in protecting people rather than conquest. So she would be looking to stabilize the kingdoms rather than conquer them.

Arya

I don't think she will be assassinating anyone big this book. I do think that she will completely lose her identity as Arya though, GRRM seems to be building this theme thoroughly. If anything, I think she would be sent to kill someone in kings landing, not Tommen, but either Cersei (should she manage to rethrone somehow), Qyburn, or possibly Maes Tyrell. She'll end up 'killing' Robert Strong, because he will get in the way. If she intends Qyburn, then Strong would probably still work out for her. The High Sparrow would find out about the zombification, and execute Qyburn.

Other Kills:

Aegon-No, Arya doesn't know him, and no one can really afford to pay.

Euron-Maybe, but I really think she would go after someone she knows, or at least someone around people she knows.

Ramsey-No, would be dumb.

Stannis-I could see it, but it would still be dumb.

Mel-Maybe, only because it would be shocking.

At the very least, she'll definitely graduate, and probably wander the world for a while. Perhaps even end up on another POV's boat, but 'forget' that she should know them.

Cersei

Robert Strong will win, most likely. Well, he'll win, but he might accidentally reveal his nature to the Septons. Which would effectively count as a loss. In which case, Qyburn would die, and Cersei would narrowly escape to wander the kingdoms disguised as a peasant.

I don't think she'll hang around KL regardless of what happens, there isn't anything for her to do there, other than be shocked when Tommen dies. Or kill Margaery. Personally, I think she's done with evil, other than small things.

I imagine that Cersei will pull a Tyrion, and have an identity crisis while wandering poor. She'll be utterly distraught the whole time, much more than she is now. (I get more of an annoyed venturing on sad for most of ADWD). She'll try to find Jamie, and possibly Maggy, she might even become repentant and wish she could apologize.

Her prophecy is hard to navigate beyond there. Tyrion seems set to kill Cersei, but it feels...too evil and obvious (maybe in self-defense?). Jamie could do it, but I don't know how it would happen. As well, Jamie is moving away from being a carefree killer, so it would be out of character. Anyway, it wont happen in WOW.

Tommen will die, presumably through the Robert Strong fiasco. He'll be discovered, and mob-killed. Myrcella will live till the next book.

Jamie/Breanne/LS

The Breanne he sees is actually a Glamour, made by Thoros who has increasing powers. It's intended to trap Jaime so he can be killed/to prove Breanne's innocence. Breanne will be still imprisoned by LS, and waiting for Jaime to provide witness.

Jaime will prove himself to the overtly rigid LS, not using a sword for the first time in his life.

News of the Arya/Ramsey wedding will come to them, and they will head north as a group. Whether this will mean that LS ressurects refrigerated Jon or not, who knows. If it comes to it, LS will kill Ramsey.

It seems coherent to have LS save Jon, but I don't like seeing the same trick twice. It would be played off as Cat finally accepting her husband's son.

Bran

Well, I'm really not sure. He'll do more greenseeing I guess? He'll probably have something to do with hardholme, but I can't say what.

Davos

Davos will get to play the role of mr. exposition/plot device this episode. He'll provide information about the North, save Rickon, and take the Skagos ships towards Eastwatch, only to end up at hardholme in a storm. He'll save the wildlings there, by accident.

Stannis/Mel

He'll winlose the battle of winterfell. Meaning that it will be a victory, but at too much of a cost, and nothing will really change. He'll turn around upon hearing of Jon, and execute a bunch of people. The Queensmen will be quite surprised, and Lady Baratheon may have suicided.

He won't execute either of the Greyjoys. Mel will set them free to do something, defying Stannis.

Stannis will be forced to meet the first wave of Others/Wights. He is likely to die in this novel, revealing to Mel how bad she is at her job.

Mel will have an interesting place in this novel. I presume that Euron will attack Oldtown, and that this is the vision that Mel saw, not the wildlings. Perhaps this will be the reason for Mel releasing the Greyjoys, because she knows what will happen in the climax. The remaining Queensguard would follow Mel, in the case that everyone else is dead. They might form a party, and take a boat to oldtown, only to be replaced by LS/Breanne/Jaime.

By this time the wall will be effectively abandoned, more than likely LS/Breanne/Jamie would come upon an empty Castle Black, ultimately finding Jon's body. Remaining forces, would be either with Davos or in the Shadowtower/Moles town.

Sam/Euron

Sam will become a de-facto Maester. We'll get to know all the Archmaesters, mainly Ryam and Peristan. I think this because GRRM took the time to describe that Ryam has no Valaryian steel link, and Peristan is history. They will play as foils, with one being prosaic, and the other more poetic. One of them will realize what the horn is, and it will be crudely repaired.

Oldtown will come under attack by Euron+Controlled Dragons, with the primary intent of getting in the citadel. The town will burn, and Sam will blow the horn. It will either raise an army of burning dead, or other 'mystical' creatures from Oldtown. They won't be under Sam's control, and simply will kill everything. The citidel will survive, as will Euron. A dragon will die through Sam's actions.

Victarion

He'll get to Meereen not to find Dany, but he'll find Dragons. He'll sack the city, and Moqorro will blow the horn. Vic will believe the horn is his, but it will still be Eurons. The dragons will fly to Oldtown. He'll travel with Selmy to find Dany.

Dany

She'll be taken toward Vaes Dothrak, to fulfill her duty. Someone will see the dragon and Tyrion/Second Sons will go save her. Not sure what will happen to Barristan, but he will likely abandon the city to seek out Dany.

Tyrion

I'd like to think that he either ends up in Valyria somehow, or that he runs into his uncle Gerion. Either way, it would be a nice easter egg for him to recover Brightroar. He might seperate from the group with the second sons, and pass through Valyria, but GRRM said that it's not likely that anyone will travel to Varlyria, so unlikely. He may also meet the sailor's wife on the way back, since Tysha needs to be resolved, but if that happens this book is still a question.

He'll end up absolved of his crimes, so long as Cersei/Strong have winfail.

Jon

Did this one in the other thread.

Others

Aurayne Waters will matter, mainly because that anecdote is both hilarious and awesome. The Master of Ships has the kingdom build 100 ships, then he steals them and becomes a pirate king.

Harrold Harding will end up being a douche, and Sansa will know it.

Ramsay will die. Asha will kill him, at some point after the battle of winterfell. Roose will be killed by either Ramsay, by accident, or will slip away to be killed by Arya/LS sometime later.

Theon will live, and will slowly remember who he is. Stannis won't kill him, either due to a Mel hand-wave or by logic comparable to Davos' punishment.

Littlefinger will discover LS, and abandon Sansa. Maybe.

Varys will appear randomly to make chaos.

Kings landing will implode, without a suitable heir approoved by the sept.

I'm not sure what the dornish will do, other than the obvious. Maybe marry Myrcella to Aegon.

I think that's everyone?

[Mia B.]

-then it will go into the transition of whats going on with Aegon's forces conquering the Stormlands and such, maybe even have the "official half book cliffhanger" of Cersei's trial by battle.

I'm 99% convinced Aegon is fake, like many others. However, I really hope GRRM does not dedicate too much of the book to him and his story

[Talking Hodor]

Wildly flailing about and getting a lucky strike while your foe is distracted does not equal skill-at-arms

In all fairness, Sam has gotten a lot better at fighting and being courageous. Plus he can shoot well when he doesn't get flustered.

[wargalicious]

Dragonstone is going to ERUPT. (possibly with hardhome and Valyria, as well.)

[wargalicious]

One of the Starks will burn to death while another Stark watches.(posssibly in ADOS.)

[wargalicious]

All those kids that Doran Martell loves watching play in the pools? Dragon bait.

[wargalicious]

When the dragons attack King's Landing, hidden caches of wildfire will go off and that whole city is toast.

[gvewolf243]

Wall comes down and Others make it to King's Landing.

[Budraven]

Lord Tywight Lannister rises from the grave and gets killed by Tyrion again :laugh: :smoking:

[Budraven]

Here's an interesting thought..

So the crypts of Winterfell have always played a pretty significant role throughout the series.. I think in TWOW we're going to see one of the Starks back in the crypts and something is going to be revealed, or found. I believe it's going to be Arya or Jon back in the crypts, and they're going to pass their father's and brother's statues, and for whatever reason stop at Lyanna's. I believe Darksister is going to be in/around Lyanna's tomb, and that's how Darksister will be brought back into the game, as well as connecting the dots for Jon's heritage

[Ser Chester]

This is my theory on the fate of Tywin's Children: Brienne of Tarth is taking Jaime to see Lady Stoneheart. Lady Stoneheart will try to kill Jaime, and Brienne will throw herself in between them. I think Brienne is going to kill Lady Stoneheart to save Jaime because she loves him (love over honor, showing how Brienne has grown from a person who just follows orders to a person who will make her own decisions). After the fight, Brienne dies of her wounds and Jaime swears that he will make good on his oath to keep Sansa safe. He will keep Oathkeeper, but will head back to King's Landing when the Brother's Without Banners tell him about Cersei (he burned her summons, but once he hears of her penance walk and all of the horrible things that have happened to her, I am pretty sure he will return). Tyrion will meet with the Mother of Dragons,but of course Khaleesi would never trust a Lannister, especially if this Lannister is the brother of the man who killed her father. Seeing Dany's forces, and seeing how he spent so much time brooding about his actions back at King's Landing, and that he is Tywin's true son (more so than Jaime and Cersei and all of the little incest babies that came from them), he is going to escape and head back to King's Landing to warn his brother... and his sister... of the shit that is about to come from the east. Now, even after everything she has done to him, I don't think Tyrion hates Cersei. Most of the bad shit that happened to him in the first three books came from Joffrey, and Tyrion new just how hard of a time Cersei had trying to control that son of a bitch. Of course, she hates him because he killed her mother (not his fault), her father (he deserved it just a little bit) and her firstborn son (he didn't do it, but who else is she suppose to blame). Cersei will win her trial by combat, and now Tywin's children will be having a bit of a reunion. After everything she has gone through at the hands of her own people, Cersei will want to burn King's Landing to the ground. When Jaime hears of this, he will confront her. Tyrion will be there as well, having sneeked back into the city. I don't know where this scene will take place, I'm hoping at the foot of the Iron Throne. Cersei will reveal that she has already given the order to Qyburn to light the Wildfire that the Mad King had stored around the city. Jaime will be in a fit of rage, and will run at Cersei with Oathbreaker, hoping to kill her. Cersei, now only a shell of her old self, will try to move back, cowering on the floor. And as all this is happening, Tyrion will take pity on his sister. He will step inbetween Jaime and Cersei, trying to persuade Jaime that the only important thing is protecting the family legacy, like Tywin had always wanted. He thinks there is still time to find Qyburn and stop the destruction of King's Landing. Jaime starts to listen to him, lowering his sword, when all of a sudden Tyrion gets a knife through his chest. Cersei has stabbed her brother, and whispers "You killed my son, now the debt is paid." Before Jaime can react, there is a large explosion and the ground shakes, dropping him to the floor. Cersei runs for the exit, but Jaime doesn't follow. All Jaime can think about is Tyrion lying dead on the floor in front of him. He holds Tyrion and sobs as King's Landing burns around him. As the fire breaches through the doors of the floor room, Jaime picks up Tyrion's body and runs through the same door Cersei exited through. Back to Cersei's POV, she will be escaping the burning city with Qyburn and Robert Strong, and when she goes to fetch Tommen, she will watch as he burns in the fire that she set (since she's responsible, the prophecy came true). Thinking that Jaime also perished in the fire, she will have nothing left to loose and flee to Castely Rock. All of this is what motivates Jaime to later kill her (another correct prophecy) and also explains Dany's dream in the first book (about King's landing being nothing but ash). Jaime will lay Tyrion to rest and flee the ruins of the city. Eventually I think he will be found starving and nearly dead with nothing but his clothes and Oathkeeper by none other than Sandor Clegane. That's all I came up with!

[OmnomnomPomelo]

I don't know any o you wrote this before or not, because I didn't read every single post. But I have a -maybe crazy- idea, what I can imagine for the next 2 books:

1) Martin writes a book about ice dragon (I don't know it)
2) Old Nan said there were ice dragons in Westeros.

3) Beyond the Wall they tried to make a city, Hardhome, which got destroyed as fast as Valyria. They say that it was burning so much, and later ashes were raining from the sky.

4) After that nobody went there, and said that they heard not-human voices in the caves nearby Hardhome.

5) 2 dragons' (Sheepstealer and Cannibal) whereabouts are unknown after "The Dance of Dragons" historical event.

6) Bloodraven told Bran he will fly.

7) Melisandre thinks that "the Other" chose a boy (with his wolf) as its champion.
8) Moqorro's prophecy is about a young and old, bright and dark, true and false dragon. (and a little man, who casts big shadow)

Hardhome could be destroyed by dragon(s) which then lived in the caves.

So I think that Moqorro's prophecy is about mostly Dany and Bloodraven, and Tyrion. How comes Tyrion into a dragon prophecy and thus to Bloodraven? Barristan Selmy said that Aerys wanted to get Joanna Lannister (Tywin's wife) so much that according to the rumors he raped her. Also in Jaime's dream Joanna implies that Tywin had only 2 children. Meaning that Tyrion might be a Targaryen-Lannister bastard, born from Aerys and Joanna.

Bloodraven is a sympathetic guy to me, in the tales of Dunk&Egg he seems to be a guy like Tywin Lannister, but he is controlled by the king. But as we know in The Song of Ice and Fire's world every character has their own truth, I mean when we read chapters of Cersei we think that she has to do it, she can't do anything else, the same goes for the POVs. So I can imagine that Bloodraven think that he has to demolish humanity and thus he wants to use Bran to help the Others. And if there were dragon beyond the Wall, it means that there should be dragon bones too, and we know that if something/someone dies beyond the Wall, it doesn't stay to be dead for so long...

So wouldn't it be cool that with the Others' big attack on the Wall a freakin' undead dragon rises to the sky which is warged by Bran?
I think it'd be awesome ^^

[Sword of the Morgan]

The Boltons will come to an end, on that much we can all agree

Tyrion, Victarion and Barristan will participate in the Battle of Meereen

In the Battle of Ice, Stannis will manage to trick Hosteen Frey into charging along the ice, and falling through. Then, after Manderly's forces arrive, they take the Freys in the rear pushing them into the lake. Manderly comes to WF with Stannis's sword and a few heads to convince the Boltons that Stannis is dead, and that "Arya" was taken to the Wall to Jon Snow. The Boltons leave for the Wall, and Manderly delivers WF to Stannis. When the Boltons reach the Wall, Jon kills Ramsay Bolton in single combat, and he kills Roose as well, avenging both Robb and Rodrik Cassel.

Euron's forces attack Oldtown, and Sam puts an arrow the eye of the Crow's Eye, and Connington's forces arrive to take the Ironborn by surprise and aid Oldtown. Lords Hightower and Redwyne swear Aegon fealty for aiding them when they received no help from KL.

Davos finds Rickon, and brings him to STannis with the forces of Skagos as well.

Pretty cool overall.

[Liver & onions]

Benjen Stark will reappear around the end of the book beyond The Wall at the Weirwood grove where Melisandre is burning Shireen to resurrect Jon. He will have in his possession Dawn and with it, will stab Mel through the heart to forge Lightbringer...only he will keep it for The Others and in turn become the new Night's King and thus being "the blue eyed King who carried a red sword and cast no shadow" that Dany saw in The House of the Undying. He'll bring down "The Winds of Winter" upon Westeros and winter will truly be coming.

[Liver & onions]

Euron, working with Bloodraven will gain control of a dragon and bring it to Westeros for Bran to warg.

[OmnomnomPomelo]

Benjen Stark will reappear around the end of the book beyond The Wall at the Weirwood grove where Melisandre is burning Shireen to resurrect Jon. He will have in his possession Dawn and with it, will stab Mel through the heart to forge Lightbringer...only he will keep it for The Others and in turn become the new Night's King and thus being "the blue eyed King who carried a red sword and cast no shadow" that Dany saw in The House of the Undying. He'll bring down "The Winds of Winter" upon Westeros and winter will truly be coming.

Dawn is the sword of House Dayne and Ned brought it back to them after he killed Arthur.

[The Reckoner]

Danaerys will have meaningful interaction with Lady Stoneheart. Both characters are united by the theme of motherhood and revenge; Daenerys against The Usurper, Lady Stoneheart against the Lannisters and Freys. Both are also tied to the Red God: Danaerys through her dragons, Lady Stoneheart through Thoros. Euron will use his dragon(s) to take the Iron Throne from Aegon, and be sitting it when Dany makes it to Westeros.

[OmnomnomPomelo]

Little off-topic:

I think the most epic ending for Jaime would be that he goes back to King's Landing. Both Myrcella and Tommen die which drives Cersei crazy, so she sets whole King's Landing on fire with the wildfire. Jaime, seeing how mentally unstable and pathetic Cersei became, kills Cersei, then going up to the Iron Throne and thinking about how fucked up life he has. Sits unto the throne and says like "I shouldn't have stand up from there when Ned Stark broke the gates" and fire engulfs him.

[Mithras]

The North

A fight between the NW and the wildlings ensues after the assassination. Because of the confusion, Bowen and his cronies persuade other brothers that the wildlings attacked and killed Jon. Team Selyse helps the NW. The wildlings are driven away. Selyse appoints Bowen as the LC. Jon is mistaken for dead but he actually falls into a coma. His body is put into an ice cell by Bowen to show the Boltons when they arrive (based on the PL). Mel feels increasingly troubled and confused about this whole thing and her visions. After three days, Bowen comes to the ice cell and finds Jon’s body missing. He does not know that Val has secretly smuggled Jon’s body with the help of Wun Wun. Jon’s body is taken before the Whitetree to be healed by Bran. On the way, Jon finishes his dream in the crypts and learns R+L=J.

The Weeper takes the Shadow Tower and puts the entire garrison to sword. The wildlings start rebelling against this new NW. Things go bad and the majority of the wildlings take Weeper as their leader. Selyse and her knights retreat to Nightfort for safety.

Davos comes to Skagos. He starts to nurse doubts about the official story of how Rickon/Asha got there as told by Manderly. It does not feel right. In Skagos, Davos is captured and sent to prison. He manages to get out of the prison and convince the Skagosi to send their aid by using his diplomatic skills. They land at Eastwatch with a Skagosi host.

After waking him up, Bran tells Jon to go to Eastwatch. He also tells him that it was Stannis who wrote the PL and explains why he had to speak like Ramsay because he did not fully trust Bran that he could direct the bird to CB. Jon unites with Rickon, Shaggydog, Osha, Davos and the Skagosi host at Eastwatch. They are joined by the giants. They quickly go to Hardhome and save the surviving people. They bring them back and pass South of the Wall at Eastwatch. With a Skagosi host stiffened by the giants and the wildlings rescued from Hardhome, Jon starts for Castle Black to have a “conversation” with Bowen. Bowen flees before Jon comes. Jon defeats the Weeper in a duel and once again becomes the de facto leader of the wildlings.

The Freys drown in the frozen lake. Stannis wins the Battle of Ice. He sends Theon, Asha, Tycho and a bunch of men to the Wall. They come to the Shadow Tower. Unbeknownst to them, Weeper is in charge now. He takes them as captives and during the fight, Weeper slays Asha. Theon is blinded by Weeper. After Jon slays the Weeper, he lets Theon go as requested by Bran. Theon starts to act like the messenger of Bran.

After the Battle of Ice, Stannis and the Manderly men shake hands. It is possible that the Manderlys carry a letter from Davos written after hislast POV and before departing for Skagos. Stannis fakes his death and sends the Manderlys and the Karstarks with his sword and the head of Arnolf Karstark as his own head.

It is revealed that Stannis had sent some of his men with the captured ironborn ships disguised as ironborn and have them attack Barrowton. This way, he wants the Dustins to return to defend their lands against this “ironborn” attack.

Roose now thinks that fArya is sent to the Wall before the Battle of Ice. Hence he prepares his men to put an end to the presence of Stannis at the Wall and see the body of Jon as Bowen claims to have. With the dwindled army and the presence of Stark loyalists, Jon now realizes that he can defeat Roose with his army of wildlings, Skagos, and the giants. He makes his plans and decided to face them at Longlake. Jon ambushes the Boltons with his wildlings. After the battle is joined, the giants come out and take the Boltons in the rear. Jon slays Ramsay and Roose on the battle field. Meanwhile, the gates of Winterfell are opened to Stannis after the departure of Roose and he takes the castle. He goes North to deal with Roose but sees that the battle is already won. He comes late to this new Battle of Longlake like Sleepy Jack did once. On the battle field, Stannis, Davos and Jon have words.

Rickon is installed to Winterfell as acting Lord Stark in Bran’s stead because Jon and probably Rickon too insist that Bran is alive. The North declares for Stannis. Jon returns to his duty and try to reinstall the defenses at the Wall. I think it is possible that the Others will make an attack to Skagos with the “dead things in the water” and Jon will have to deal with it too.

Meanwhile, Bran gives us more info about the Others, whereabouts of Benjen and other important stuff possibly related to prophecies. I think Bran might send Theon along with Tycho to Braavos first to fetch Arya back. There is a foreshadowing about Arya during her boat trip. Her ship was about to crash a tree which looked like a kraken. Theon might qualify as that kraken. I think Arya returns to Westeros with Theon but depending on circumstances, she might go South to do some killings without seeing Jon. Bran then sends Theon to Iron Islands after the death of Euron. Theon warns Aeron and the ironborn to leave the Old Way but Aeron will not listen. Bran sends the Hammer of the Waters to Pyke to slay the newly crowned Aeron. The ironborn take that as the wrath of the Drowned God and believe Theon's words.

After rallying the North and settling the dust, Stannis turns his eyes to South. In the Vale, LF is slain by Sansa but after killing her, she flees. Stannis thinks of securing the Vale and filling the power vacuum with a marriage alliance between SR and Shireen and promising justice for Lord Arryn, Robar Royce etc. However, Tyrion sees the opportunity too and he presses the Vale on the behalf of Dany. The Vale Lords remain divided and undecided because fAegon is an option for them too. The matter is decided with a battle between Stannis and Dany. Stannis is once again defeated but he manages to retreat to Nightfort. The Northmen abandon Stannis after the defeat and declare Bran as the King of Winter.

I think this is end of Northern arcs as far as TWoW is concerned but there might be editoral cuts before the books is released.