At the end of Dance...we have Dany sharing dinner to Drogon somewhere in the Dothraki Sea. Some posters assume Dany is going to jump on her dragon's back and lead the khalasar to Mereeen.
But I would argue that Dany has showed no control over her dragon. She may be able to ride it...but she does not have the skill or the spells to completely manipulate the Dragon.
I am guessing..at some point...someone or something will assist Dany in controlling her Dragon. thoughts?
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Will Dany need assistance (ie scorcery) to control her dragon?
Started by
angelodebo
, Jan 25 2013 01:02 PM
63 replies to this topic
#2
Whitering
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 03:10 AM
You are probably right, we've all been presuming that Tyrion will bring her some of his foreshadowed Dragon knowledge, and then this horn showed up, so we'll see what happens.
#3
LordStoneheart
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 03:49 AM
I don't know, the scene in the pit seemed to show that Drogon still had love for her. I think they'll listen to her as soon as she exerts more domineering control. Didn't she hit him and then he lets her climb on his back? I don't recall the scene very well.
#4
Razha
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 05:06 AM
I rather thought that scorcery could be used to take dragons from her. That is scorcery could be stronger than her "motherly" influence, at least in case of Viserion and Rhaegal.
In case of Drogon, I think she will gradually learn to control him (just like in horse riding - it takes time to learn the tricks and gain the confidence, and Drogon is a veeeeery unruly "horse")
In case of Drogon, I think she will gradually learn to control him (just like in horse riding - it takes time to learn the tricks and gain the confidence, and Drogon is a veeeeery unruly "horse")
#5
The Bastard's Bastard
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 05:15 AM
i wonder how Aegon the Conqueror and his sisters (and all the other dragonriders in westeros) controlled their dragons ... im quite sure a mere slash from a whip wasn't enough to control balerion the black dread. if they had some sort of dragon binding horns of their own where are they now? hidden in the red keep or destroyed with summerhall?
#6
Ser Ennepe
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 05:58 AM
BastardsBastard, on 27 January 2013 - 05:15 AM, said:
i wonder how Aegon the Conqueror and his sisters (and all the other dragonriders in westeros) controlled their dragons ... im quite sure a mere slash from a whip wasn't enough to control balerion the black dread. if they had some sort of dragon binding horns of their own where are they now? hidden in the red keep or destroyed with summerhall?
Same could have happened with his Sisters and their dragons. So they maybe didn´t needed Dragonhorns.
(That´s just speculation and I bet there is someone with a better explanation or theory
)
#7
The Bastard's Bastard
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 06:12 AM
angelodebo, on 25 January 2013 - 01:02 PM, said:
At the end of Dance...we have Dany sharing dinner to Drogon somewhere in the Dothraki Sea. Some posters assume Dany is going to jump on her dragon's back and lead the khalasar to Mereeen.
But I would argue that Dany has showed no control over her dragon. She may be able to ride it...but she does not have the skill or the spells to completely manipulate the Dragon.
I am guessing..at some point...someone or something will assist Dany in controlling her Dragon. thoughts?
But I would argue that Dany has showed no control over her dragon. She may be able to ride it...but she does not have the skill or the spells to completely manipulate the Dragon.
I am guessing..at some point...someone or something will assist Dany in controlling her Dragon. thoughts?
#8
NathanStark
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Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:54 AM
I always considered Dany to have a magical bond with the dragons. With that being how she hatched them in the first place. It all kinda stems from my belief in the "dragon has three heads" and "the prince that was promised" and "azor ahai reborn" being three people not one, with Dany at the center. And that they will be able to "tame" the dragons naturally.
I suppose I always thought of it a bit like the Stark children and their direwolves, that there was a supernatural bond between the dragons and their supposed riders.
I suppose I always thought of it a bit like the Stark children and their direwolves, that there was a supernatural bond between the dragons and their supposed riders.
#9
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Posted 29 January 2013 - 11:15 AM
I see Drogon as having a direwolf like bond with Dany, it can sense when they are in trouble or what will help them, ex; Grey wind discovering the goat path around the golden tooth, being suspicous of all the lords who were going to betray him, and Drogons coming to rescue Dany when she was most in need, and making sure she wind up in front of the biggest Khalasar in the Dothraki sea.
Edited by aryagonnakill, 29 January 2013 - 11:15 AM.
#10
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Posted 29 January 2013 - 12:26 PM
Make fun of me all you want for this...
In the Pokemon games and show, a Pokemon won't listen to a trainer it thinks is too weak to handle. I mention this because the way I interpreted aDwD was that she couldn't control them because she didn't want to be a fierce leader or "mad Targaryen." Therefore, she was afraid to take control of them. It takes a 'dragon' (as in what Viserys called himself) to control other dragons. Daenerys just needs to (let me channel her cousin Aemon here) kill the girl and let the dragon be born.
Once she shows assertiveness over the dragons, I feel like they will fall in line. Or maybe she just needs to do this to Drogon, and in turn he will control the other two.
In the Pokemon games and show, a Pokemon won't listen to a trainer it thinks is too weak to handle. I mention this because the way I interpreted aDwD was that she couldn't control them because she didn't want to be a fierce leader or "mad Targaryen." Therefore, she was afraid to take control of them. It takes a 'dragon' (as in what Viserys called himself) to control other dragons. Daenerys just needs to (let me channel her cousin Aemon here) kill the girl and let the dragon be born.
Once she shows assertiveness over the dragons, I feel like they will fall in line. Or maybe she just needs to do this to Drogon, and in turn he will control the other two.
#11
HouseBluth
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Posted 29 January 2013 - 08:00 PM
LordStoneheart, on 29 January 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:
Make fun of me all you want for this...
In the Pokemon games and show, a Pokemon won't listen to a trainer it thinks is too weak to handle. I mention this because the way I interpreted aDwD was that she couldn't control them because she didn't want to be a fierce leader or "mad Targaryen." Therefore, she was afraid to take control of them. It takes a 'dragon' (as in what Viserys called himself) to control other dragons. Daenerys just needs to (let me channel her cousin Aemon here) kill the girl and let the dragon be born.
Once she shows assertiveness over the dragons, I feel like they will fall in line. Or maybe she just needs to do this to Drogon, and in turn he will control the other two.
In the Pokemon games and show, a Pokemon won't listen to a trainer it thinks is too weak to handle. I mention this because the way I interpreted aDwD was that she couldn't control them because she didn't want to be a fierce leader or "mad Targaryen." Therefore, she was afraid to take control of them. It takes a 'dragon' (as in what Viserys called himself) to control other dragons. Daenerys just needs to (let me channel her cousin Aemon here) kill the girl and let the dragon be born.
Once she shows assertiveness over the dragons, I feel like they will fall in line. Or maybe she just needs to do this to Drogon, and in turn he will control the other two.
Couldn't have said it better myself (minus the Pokemon analogy).
#12
WiDMNDBAMMD
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Posted 01 February 2013 - 09:08 PM
Dany has sorcery protecting her. She got it at some point when she was little. Most likely from the place with the Red Door( red god)? No telling what other sort of enchantments she got but her high tolerance for heat, her not being able to get sick, her high resistance to fire.
Also what people were saying about her Dragons and their bond from when they were hatched. Similarly the direwolves were given to the Starks by the "old gods" to help them start growing their warging and other abilities.
The Starks have blood of the first men and pray to the old gods. That's why they were wargs/greenseers etc. but they needed the direwolves for those powers to awaken. The obvious evidence is that Sansa losing her wolf so young has made her powers not awaken, I'd also argue that she's more Tulley than Stark because she was concieved right after Ned came home with a bastard so the child became more Cat's than Ned's because of his (supposed) betrayal, but I digress.
The Targarens are blood of the Dragon but Dragons have been dead for many years, however being a warg is in your blood, it's not a skill that someone can learn, the same might be true for Dragon riders. Fire and Blood might be their bond.
Dany was reborn in fire and blood(son and husband) to hatch the Dragons( "only death can pay for life")
When she's riding she doesn't have complete control of the dragon because("a dragon is no slave"). There's a bond between them which allowed her to ride her dragon like a stallion with a horse whip. No one else is probably going to be able to copy her way of taming Drogon.
(I'm sorry for so much stuff that's not in the books and just my random ideas and thoughts)
Now as for the other two dragons if someone intends to ride them. Then yes, they will need something. I believe that they will need sorcery / horn / enchantments as well as having blood of the dragon.
Also what people were saying about her Dragons and their bond from when they were hatched. Similarly the direwolves were given to the Starks by the "old gods" to help them start growing their warging and other abilities.
The Starks have blood of the first men and pray to the old gods. That's why they were wargs/greenseers etc. but they needed the direwolves for those powers to awaken. The obvious evidence is that Sansa losing her wolf so young has made her powers not awaken, I'd also argue that she's more Tulley than Stark because she was concieved right after Ned came home with a bastard so the child became more Cat's than Ned's because of his (supposed) betrayal, but I digress.
The Targarens are blood of the Dragon but Dragons have been dead for many years, however being a warg is in your blood, it's not a skill that someone can learn, the same might be true for Dragon riders. Fire and Blood might be their bond.
Dany was reborn in fire and blood(son and husband) to hatch the Dragons( "only death can pay for life")
When she's riding she doesn't have complete control of the dragon because("a dragon is no slave"). There's a bond between them which allowed her to ride her dragon like a stallion with a horse whip. No one else is probably going to be able to copy her way of taming Drogon.
(I'm sorry for so much stuff that's not in the books and just my random ideas and thoughts)
Now as for the other two dragons if someone intends to ride them. Then yes, they will need something. I believe that they will need sorcery / horn / enchantments as well as having blood of the dragon.
Edited by WiDMNDBAMMD, 01 February 2013 - 09:09 PM.
#13
AManofManyFaces
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Posted 01 February 2013 - 10:48 PM
She should hire Quentyn Martell...he seems to think he's a pretty badass dragon tamer..........oh wait...
#14
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Posted 02 February 2013 - 05:01 PM
I thought it was kinda funny when Drogon was letting her ride but on his terms. They fly where he wants fly. On another note, he seemed to come to her aide when she called him. I'm guessing she'll tame Drogon and figure things out with or without Tyrion's help.
#15
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Posted 02 February 2013 - 06:16 PM
WiDMNDBAMMD, on 01 February 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:
Dany has sorcery protecting her. She got it at some point when she was little. Most likely from the place with the Red Door( red god)? No telling what other sort of enchantments she got but her high tolerance for heat, her not being able to get sick, her high resistance to fire.
Also what people were saying about her Dragons and their bond from when they were hatched. Similarly the direwolves were given to the Starks by the "old gods" to help them start growing their warging and other abilities.
The Starks have blood of the first men and pray to the old gods. That's why they were wargs/greenseers etc. but they needed the direwolves for those powers to awaken. The obvious evidence is that Sansa losing her wolf so young has made her powers not awaken, I'd also argue that she's more Tulley than Stark because she was concieved right after Ned came home with a bastard so the child became more Cat's than Ned's because of his (supposed) betrayal, but I digress.
The Targarens are blood of the Dragon but Dragons have been dead for many years, however being a warg is in your blood, it's not a skill that someone can learn, the same might be true for Dragon riders. Fire and Blood might be their bond.
Dany was reborn in fire and blood(son and husband) to hatch the Dragons( "only death can pay for life")
When she's riding she doesn't have complete control of the dragon because("a dragon is no slave"). There's a bond between them which allowed her to ride her dragon like a stallion with a horse whip. No one else is probably going to be able to copy her way of taming Drogon.
(I'm sorry for so much stuff that's not in the books and just my random ideas and thoughts)
Now as for the other two dragons if someone intends to ride them. Then yes, they will need something. I believe that they will need sorcery / horn / enchantments as well as having blood of the dragon.
Also what people were saying about her Dragons and their bond from when they were hatched. Similarly the direwolves were given to the Starks by the "old gods" to help them start growing their warging and other abilities.
The Starks have blood of the first men and pray to the old gods. That's why they were wargs/greenseers etc. but they needed the direwolves for those powers to awaken. The obvious evidence is that Sansa losing her wolf so young has made her powers not awaken, I'd also argue that she's more Tulley than Stark because she was concieved right after Ned came home with a bastard so the child became more Cat's than Ned's because of his (supposed) betrayal, but I digress.
The Targarens are blood of the Dragon but Dragons have been dead for many years, however being a warg is in your blood, it's not a skill that someone can learn, the same might be true for Dragon riders. Fire and Blood might be their bond.
Dany was reborn in fire and blood(son and husband) to hatch the Dragons( "only death can pay for life")
When she's riding she doesn't have complete control of the dragon because("a dragon is no slave"). There's a bond between them which allowed her to ride her dragon like a stallion with a horse whip. No one else is probably going to be able to copy her way of taming Drogon.
(I'm sorry for so much stuff that's not in the books and just my random ideas and thoughts)
Now as for the other two dragons if someone intends to ride them. Then yes, they will need something. I believe that they will need sorcery / horn / enchantments as well as having blood of the dragon.
GRRM has said already that Daenerys does not possess any magical resistance to fire. Her surviving the fire during the dragons birth was only due to the "ritual" taking place and not due to any innate abilities. Immunity to diseases is said to be a trait of all the dragonlords of old Valyria in the book (although that's Dany's presumption according to rumors she heard about her ancestors).
There is definitely magic around Dany but she doesn't wield any magic so far not even unknowingly in my opinion. That's not to say she won't learn some magic in the future, who knows? For a fantasy series these books do lack of a spellcaster hero. I am really anticipating GRRM's wizard POV. GRRM always makes sure that his characters are frail in some way. Even when they've got power and station they also have a fatal flaw that dooms them in the end. Imagine a wizard...
Edited by Anima, 02 February 2013 - 06:18 PM.
#16
Tyrant666
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Posted 02 February 2013 - 08:32 PM
What about Mel? She shot a killer shade out of her vagina, that's pretty magical imo.
#17
Fire Eater
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Posted 02 February 2013 - 08:39 PM
I think Tyrion and Marwyn's combined knowledge of dragons will help Dany. Moqorro may help bind one of the dragons to Dany through the horn Victarion brought, after Victarion finds that Moqorro left some things out.
Edited by Fire Eater, 02 February 2013 - 08:40 PM.
#18
WiDMNDBAMMD
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Posted 03 February 2013 - 04:03 AM
Anima, on 02 February 2013 - 06:16 PM, said:
GRRM has said already that Daenerys does not possess any magical resistance to fire.
The water was boiling hot, but Dany didn't mind. Her brother used to say it was never too hot for a Targeryen.
"Fire is in our blood"
Doesn't she also grab a hot egg out of a fire before she hatches them and it feels cold to her?
For someone with no magical abilities she sure likes a lot of prophecy
#19
Carey Snow
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Posted 03 February 2013 - 03:12 PM
LordStoneheart, on 27 January 2013 - 03:49 AM, said:
I don't know, the scene in the pit seemed to show that Drogon still had love for her. I think they'll listen to her as soon as she exerts more domineering control. Didn't she hit him and then he lets her climb on his back? I don't recall the scene very well.
Yes, Dany hits him with a whip in the fighting pit and commands Drogon to lie down, which he does and she climbs on his back and flies off. One of the great chapters in aDwD. The hero stepping forward to slay Drogon was great story telling.
Edited by Carey Snow, 03 February 2013 - 03:12 PM.
#20
Anima
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Posted 03 February 2013 - 03:23 PM
Tyrant666, on 02 February 2013 - 08:32 PM, said:
What about Mel? She shot a killer shade out of her vagina, that's pretty magical imo.
First, the way you put it is disgusting although I'm sure it was intentional. Second, so far as we know she's not a hero though she has had a few POVs. And third I was thinking more of a wizard along the lines of the old dragonlords of Valyria who could tame dragons with magic and conjure fire and lightning, I should have specified that bit.
