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[BOOK SPOILERS] Theon Greyjoy TV question


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#1 Ringer

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:22 AM

I really had no idea how to work this without spoiling anything for anyone who hasn't read the books, but this is directly linked to Theon in the TV show. My question is do you think they will handle Theon's situation different in the TV show then in the books? I think that the whole fleshing out of Theon and the inner turmoil he is facing has already completely changed his character, well not his actions in the big picture but how there actions effect him. To me TV Theon is a Stark with a Greyjoy name.

#2 King Tommen

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:14 PM

Not sure exactly what you mean by the statement: Theon is a Stark with a Greyjoy name. On the show, it has been clearly demonstrated that he feels he has no identity or home (which will dovetail nicely into the way his dignity and identity will end up being stripped from him by Ramsay). He voices his frustrations with any character attempting to paint his relationship to the Starks as positive by pointing out that he was still a captor who was never included within the inner circle. He absolutely longs for the acceptance of his father and even goes as far as eschewing his allegiance to Robb by siding with his father in order to gain his approval. But there is a great revelation before Theon leaves Pyke where he confronts Balon (after taking yet another emasculating brow-beating from him) and calls him on his bullshit regarding how Balon was the coward who gave up his own son and never came for him.

This all leads to the conversation with Luwin at Winterfell when Theon knows he's screwed. It's one of the best character discussions the show has done to date. Theon acknowledges to Luwin that he's a person without a family or an allegiance and the person that he is pretending to be now was his only option and that he had gone too far down the road to gain any kind of redemption. He decides there that his final decision will just be to go out fighting and die with some degree of honour and if his men hadn't turned on him, that's how his story would have ended. It sets him up perfectly to be the empty shell with no identity that Ramsay manipulates into being a wretch of a human who has no self-worth.

It's probably the most complete shading of any character that the show has done to date and improves on the book character immensely.

Edited by King Tommen, 11 February 2013 - 08:20 PM.


#3 Ringer

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:42 PM

Yeah, I meant that he is pretty much a man without a home he was raised by Stark's but not one of them, but he is not a Greyjoy either he lacks either characteristics he has "gone to far to pretend to be anything else" It's gonna to be tough seeing TV Theon go through the torture of Ramsey because hes really not a bad guy he just made bad decisions

Edited by Ringer, 11 February 2013 - 08:43 PM.


#4 The Dragon has three heads

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 10:25 PM

To keep him working they'll flesh out what happens to him after winterfell as opposed to having it as flash back and exposition.
It will hard, and brutal. But necessary.

#5 Nezzer

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 10:48 PM

As there are no flashbacks or voiced internal monologue in the show (thankfully, as both are almost always pretty terrible on TV IMHO), they will have to show what happens to him before completing his transformation into Reek. I hope HBO is not afraid of showing extreme forms of torture on screen.

Edited by Nezzer, 11 February 2013 - 10:48 PM.


#6 aFeastForDragons

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 05:10 AM

As there are no flashbacks or voiced internal monologue in the show (thankfully, as both are almost always pretty terrible on TV IMHO), they will have to show what happens to him before completing his transformation into Reek. I hope HBO is not afraid of showing extreme forms of torture on screen.


They have had some pretty heavy stuff already like Harrenhall and the tickler + Joffery and his birthday present. They may do a lot off screen but they will be able to do a pretty good job at showing Theon's degradation.

#7 Nezzer

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 05:23 AM

They have had some pretty heavy stuff already like Harrenhall and the tickler + Joffery and his birthday present. They may do a lot off screen but they will be able to do a pretty good job at showing Theon's degradation.

Yeah, but those torture scenes were not graphic. Flaying is no common graphic thing. It belongs to heavy movies like Hostel, Saw and Hellraiser. Will they dare to show it? I really, really hope they do /devil.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':devil:' />

#8 Pinkie Baelish

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 05:31 AM

Yeah, but those torture scenes were not graphic. Flaying is no common graphic thing. It belongs to heavy movies like Hostel, Saw and Hellraiser. Will they dare to show it? I really, really hope they do /devil.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':devil:' />


As long as they don't show anything happening to his cock, I can handle it.

#9 Ringer

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 11:08 PM

Well I mean they did show people getting literally cut in half in Blackwater so I think HBO will do the horror scenes hopefully well

#10 locke and key

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 04:12 PM

I think in this season they'll show theons descent into madness and then after (as we've seen in the trailer) he tries to escape ramsay in the hunt, the show will show ramsay about to torture him then cut away with him screaming in immense pain, then we won't see him for the reast of season 3 and probably season 4 leaving non-book readers thinking he's dead but then as cliffhanger in the first epsidoe dealing with ADWD they'll reveal he's survived.

At least this is how I'd do his storyline.

#11 DarkAndFullOfTurnips

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 05:11 PM

I prefer horror that's revealing enough that the viewer knows what's happening but doesn't have to see it graphically. Let the imagination do the work, as that's basically exactly how it's revealed in the books. But getting your dick flayed is no ordinary horror so I'm quite sure they'll skip some of the more brutal details.

#12 Mladen

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:28 PM

Even HBO has some boundaries...Theon`as story might be presented through Ramsey`s hunting games, his starvation and loss of fingers. I doubt we`ll see flying...

#13 Minsc

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:51 PM

Even HBO has some boundaries...Theon`as story might be presented through Ramsey`s hunting games, his starvation and loss of fingers. I doubt we`ll see flying...


I would expect that we would get mainly reaction shots of Theon's face while he is being flayed, then a close up of his hands/feet after the skin has been peeled away thus cluing in watches of the true horrors that he is experiencing.

#14 Lannister Hamster

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 04:58 AM

They could 'just' do the torture and questioning this season and have the escape and hunt at the end of the series - and then save the flaying and even darker stuff until season 4.

#15 Pinkie Baelish

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 05:36 PM

To be honest, they can only show maybe 2 torture scenes before it starts to feel redundant. A lot of it needs to be done offscreen-it's more unsettling that way.

#16 Shadow on the Wall

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:05 PM

I think this Seasons scenes with Theon will first have him being tortured by a mystery person. Perhaps even the fact that it's Theon will initially be kept a mystery.

By the end I expect them to reveal that the torturer is Ramsay Snow, and make it clear to the audience his connection with Roose Bolton who, at this point, we will absolutely despise. Of course, it's really important for HBO to keep Ramsay's identity secret as it naturally leads to big spoilers for the RW.

In Season 4, I'm not sure how they can progress further - further torturing will just be painful to watch. That said, Alfie Allen is a fantastic actor so I will be really fascinated to see the Reek transformation.

#17 Minsc

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:48 PM

In Season 4, I'm not sure how they can progress further - further torturing will just be painful to watch. That said, Alfie Allen is a fantastic actor so I will be really fascinated to see the Reek transformation.


Maybe for the 4 season, depending how far they get in ASOS in 3, might contain at the tail end some of the story foundations for AFOC and DWD. Therefore, viewers will be introduced to the beginnings of Theon's torture during season 3 only for him to disappear for the beginning of season 4 only towards the very end viewers are they once again reintroduced Theon as fully Reek. With the 5 season containing Reek's rise back into being Theon.

Edited by Minsc, 26 February 2013 - 07:48 PM.


#18 ServantOnIce

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:56 PM

I wish the TV show followed the books. Think about this

ACOK came out in 1998 you didn't hear from Theon again until 2011 in ADWD that is 13 years of no Theon POVs that made the Reek chapter more powerful.

I think D and D should have done the same thing, say good by to Alfie Allen for a few years, and then bring him back in season 5 or 6 if there is a season 6.

#19 Minsc

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 10:02 PM

I wish the TV show followed the books. Think about this

ACOK came out in 1998 you didn't hear from Theon again until 2011 in ADWD that is 13 years of no Theon POVs that made the Reek chapter more powerful.

I think D and D should have done the same thing, say good by to Alfie Allen for a few years, and then bring him back in season 5 or 6 if there is a season 6.


You cannot have an actor disappear for 3 years and expect them to come back, moreover as much of the horror that befallen upon Theon is only revealed in his head they have to show to the viewers some how unless Theon begins narrating his entire experience out load for no reason.

Moreover, as seen with his performance in season 2, Alfie is probably their best actor so they should keep him around.

#20 aFeastForDragons

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:15 AM

I wish the TV show followed the books. Think about this

ACOK came out in 1998 you didn't hear from Theon again until 2011 in ADWD that is 13 years of no Theon POVs that made the Reek chapter more powerful.

I think D and D should have done the same thing, say good by to Alfie Allen for a few years, and then bring him back in season 5 or 6 if there is a season 6.


So you would be happy to have a completely different actor appear when the open the door to Theon's cell? No thanks!!!!!!!!! If the dismiss an actor for that long he will have other commitments by the time that season comes. It would have little to no effect if a different actor was playing Reek since the shock factor of recognizing him wouldn't happen.

Why is everyone saying they are speeding up the Reek plot. Its happening in the exact same timeframe as the books but its going to take place on screen. Remember the gift Roose presents Cat with when the meet up at the Twins.