Is Joffrey more honorable than Robb?

[Blaer Dayle]

I'll start by saying this only applies to the show, as it wasn't this way in the books, but on watching this episode again I got to thinking a thought that diminishes Robb somewhat in this version.

Joffrey is in fact more honorable in some way, because he says that he can't marry Margaery, even if it's what he wants, and even continues after being urged to do so from his mother, by saying he made a holy vow. Only when he is pardoned by the high Septon does he actually give in and set Sansa aside.

Robb on the other hand will not listen to the good counsel of his mother and keep his promise to Walder frey, simply because he doesn't know if he will love the Frey girl. Instead he still goes ahead and marries Talisa, knowing that it was the wrong thing to do and that it was dangerous to cross Walder frey.

I wish this thought hadn't occurred to me, as I don't lie what it does to Robb, or that it elevates Joffrey above any other character morally. This was a very poor writing choice in my opinion.

Thoughts?

[Buster]

Wow. You're so right. Joffrey is a saint compared to that evil Robb. All hail King Joffrey, first of his name.

[Lady Seaworth]

I always got the sense that Joffrey wasn't being reluctant because he wanted to honour the vow, but rather out of spite for Sansa. I think the vow is an excuse to keep her suffering. When the Septon declares it void, Joffrey has no choice but to break the engagement because he can't produce another convincing reason to keep her.

[Twentythoughts]

Pay attention to how theatrical and rehearsed the whole scene is. It's Joffrey actually following instructions for once. Which makes sense, because Tyrell cleavage.

[Tony Soprano]

Oh yeah, Joffrey was definitely more honorable. I mean, what could be more honorable than beheading your betrothed's father and then beat her and humiliate her in the court?

But, that Robb...he broke his vows because of true love. Shame on him.

[Lady Hornwood]

Joffrey is in fact more honorable in some way, because he says that he can't marry Margaery, even if it's what he wants, and even continues after being urged to do so from his mother, by saying he made a holy vow. Only when he is pardoned by the high Septon does he actually give in and set Sansa aside.

Thoughts?

The Joffrey scene is, I believe, a play by everybody involved to present to the court that Joffrey is not an oath-breaker. In the books Sansa recalls Cersei preparing her for that scene, I guess it was pretty much the same in the show: Littlefinger and Tywin informed Cersei what Loras is going to ask, Cersei asked Pycelle to bribe the High Septon into saying that the vow does not apply and Joffrey is just playing along.

[Joyful Union]

The Joffrey scene is, I believe, a play by everybody involved to present to the court that Joffrey is not an oath-breaker. In the books Sansa recalls Cersei preparing her for that scene, I guess it was pretty much the same in the show: Littlefinger and Tywin informed Cersei what Loras is going to ask, Cersei asked Pycelle to bribe the High Septon into saying that the vow does not apply and Joffrey is just playing along.

I agree. I also thought that was a great scene, because it was so obviously rehearsed, you could see how Joffrey was visibly struggling to pretend it wasnt already arranged, very well done.

To the OP, I'm assuming your trolling, you cant seriously believe this. Show Robb is definitely less honorable than Book Robb, but I actually think I admire him for it. Everyone else on the show is calling out the bullshit on vows and honour, why is it wrong when Robb does it?

[Heir to the North]

The Joffrey scene is, I believe, a play by everybody involved to present to the court that Joffrey is not an oath-breaker. In the books Sansa recalls Cersei preparing her for that scene, I guess it was pretty much the same in the show: Littlefinger and Tywin informed Cersei what Loras is going to ask, Cersei asked Pycelle to bribe the High Septon into saying that the vow does not apply and Joffrey is just playing along.

:agree:

[oakenhelm]

Yup. It was complete theater and not a commentary on his character.

[Runaway Penguin]

I have to say that the scene is acted masterfully in the series - only good actors and directors can make such a piece of bad acting :D

Heck, even Joffrey's gestures are artfully unnatural unnatural.

As for the OP, clear piece of trolling I'm afraid :)

[mcb]

I'll start by saying this only applies to the show, as it wasn't this way in the books, but on watching this episode again I got to thinking a thought that diminishes Robb somewhat in this version.

Joffrey is in fact more honorable in some way, because he says that he can't marry Margaery, even if it's what he wants, and even continues after being urged to do so from his mother, by saying he made a holy vow. Only when he is pardoned by the high Septon does he actually give in and set Sansa aside.

Sounds perfectly reasoned. Then who's that little shit who had Joffrey's fiancee stripped and repeatedly beaten? young, blond, hangs out in King's Landing, sometimes wears a weird hat? Fuck, if only I could put a name to the face...