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Is Robert Baratheon an Overrated Warrior?


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382 replies to this topic

#1 Blackfyre the Bold

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:14 AM

He was a badass for sure; a capable commander and fighter. I won't dispute that. But IMO his hype is solely based on him slaying Prince Rhaegar on the Trident (his other notable victories in combat are against Randall Grafton and Lord Fell). Rhaegar was a capable fighter as well but he wasn't exceptionally great. Brandon Stark could very well have been the one to kill him and win all the notoriety.

As for his victories as a commander, Robert had a few notable wins. He won three battles in one day which certainly is impressive. But it was Ned Stark (and co.) that saved his ass at the Battle of the Bells and Ned Stark who lifted the siege at Storm's End (thus saving Stannis---Baratheons are in debt to the Starks---and ending the war).

From a writer's perspective it was fitting to make Robert kill Rhaegar but is that enough to deserve the recognition he gets?

#2 Theda Baratheon

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:25 AM

I don't think he was, to be honest.

Part of the tragedy of Robert is he had so much potential when he was younger. He WAS an amazing warrior, one worthy of songs. I mean, his weapon of choice is a gigantic fucking WARHAMMER?!?! You need SERIOUS strength for that. He was mirthful; that bit about him throwing Mya up into the air and catching her and laughing. So much so that when she was laughing, she laughed so much she peed herself. (as a little girl)

Young Robert seemed competent, an able warrior, a good friend and a man with a mirthful personality. And then he became a fat, abusive, incompetent drunken oaf.

That's the tragedy of his character, I think.

#3 E-Ro

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:44 AM

No Robert is not overrated in any way. In fact he may be underrated.

#4 Theda Baratheon

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:45 AM

No Robert is not overrated in any way. In fact he may be underrated.

I think young Robert might be.

I'm really fond of young Robert but I strongly dislike the man he became.

#5 Stormcloak

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:45 AM

As a commander, sure I think Ned was the real general of the rebellion too, Robert was just the figurehead.
As a warrior though, I think Robert really was top tier. He fought one handed with a war hammer Ned could barely life with two so strength wise I reckon he's second only to Gregor and going off his reputation and the feat of surviving all those battles and personally killing Rhaegar I reckon he had the skill to back it up.
I definitely believe Barristan when he said nothing would've stopped him cutting Robert down if he'd seen him smile at Rhaegar's dead children but besides Selmy & Dayne I'm not sure if there's anyone else that'd make me bet against Robert in his prime.

I reckon Theda's spot on saying Robert let his potential bleed away and when he suddenly had to be king and got stuck with Cersei.

Edited by Stormcloak, 26 March 2013 - 09:52 AM.


#6 therealbando

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:46 AM

Ned said that Robert`s warhammer was so heavy that he could barely lift it and Robert fought with it, so that says something.
Jaime says that Robert in his prime could outmatch almost anyone physically, so to answer your question: he was an excellent fighter. Was he a goof battle commander as well? That`s more Ned and I think that`s why the 2 of them worked so well together: Ned the tactician and Robert the fighter.

Edited by therealbando, 26 March 2013 - 09:48 AM.


#7 Fire and Lemoncakes

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:47 AM

The man is to fat for his own armor. He might have been good, in the past.

#8 E-Ro

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:48 AM

Robert was a good general as well, Ned was not around when he smashed those three seperate armies or when he took gulltown.

#9 andrew_

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:49 AM

Robert Baratheon in his prime is probably in the top 10 warriors from the entire aSoIaF series.

#10 Nyrhex

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:53 AM

As a commander? Yes, to some degree. As a warrior? No, he is not overrated.

Edited by Nyrhex, 26 March 2013 - 09:53 AM.


#11 Visen

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:56 AM

Robert Baratheon was a beast of a warrior, the kind that would make the Clegane boys nervous.

#12 Djinn

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:58 AM

I really wouldn't point the lifting of the siege of Storm's End as a great military feat, after all, Mace didn't put up any resistance.

Robert's achievements as a warrior were on the battlefield. I'll pick those over most in a competiton with set rules.

#13 Faithmemory

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:00 AM

He won't be King if he's overrated. He was just one o' a hell warriors back in his days.

#14 Son of a Harpy

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:14 AM

Robert Baratheon was a beast of a warrior, the kind that would make the Clegane boys nervous.


Sandor maybe; Gregor unlikely. 6'6 Robert wearing his Stag helm, that would probably have made him appear about 7-feet tall, still cowers under 8-foot Gregor.

Gotta say though, Rhaegar surely must have been batshit insane to face Robert 1v1.

I think Robert is properly rated. Theda's post really summed him up rather well.

#15 mcb

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:24 AM

He was a badass for sure; a capable commander and fighter. I won't dispute that. But IMO his hype is solely based on him slaying Prince Rhaegar on the Trident (his other notable victories in combat are against Randall Grafton and Lord Fell). Rhaegar was a capable fighter as well but he wasn't exceptionally great. Brandon Stark could very well have been the one to kill him and win all the notoriety.


Nope, it's not just from his one-on-one with Rhaegar. One doesn't get such reputation from only one fight (well, Rocky Balboa did after his match against Apollo Creed, but that's one exception). In-universe literally everybody agreed that a young Robert with his warhammer was an unstoppable destruction machine. He fought numerous battles, he was in the habit of leading from the front ranks, he probably slew his foes by the dozen. His fight with Rhaegar is understandably his crowning achievement, considering that the two most important princes in the realm dueled for all the marbles that day.

Whom did Jaime Lannister vanquish, to be considered one of the best swordsmen of the realm? I don't remember any big names. Ser Arthur Dayne was widely regarded as the finest knight of his times. He slew the Smiling Knight... and who else? I don't recall. That's somewhere in the backstory. We don't have all the details how they earned their street cred, but it's indisputable that they have it.

#16 The Doctor's Consort

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:34 AM

A very loud and clear NO!

Let's face it he was unstoppable and maybe one of the best warriors of his days.


In fact he may be underrated.

/agree.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':agree:' />

#17 TalalOfDorne

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:34 AM

Not really. He was easily one of the best of his time, and he had the personality and charisma to go with it. But just like the previous posts said he had the potential.

#18 danm_999

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:35 AM

These topics really bother me in that they don't really contribute anything to the discussion, they just seek to be provocative for the sake of being provocative. You're saying Robert is overrated, but you're not giving much of an argument on how he's overrated. All you're doing is pointing out victories his vassals achieved, but since nobody attributes these victories to Robert himself, this is irrelevant to an examination of Robert.

If you're going to say he's overrated, you have to elucidate what recognition he gets from either the characters or the readers that he doesn't deserve. Robert's skill as a warrior is based on his slaying of Rhaegar, and his victories at Summerhall, neither of which appear undeserved.

Edited by danm_999, 26 March 2013 - 10:36 AM.


#19 TalalOfDorne

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:40 AM

These topics really bother me in that they don't really contribute anything to the discussion, they just seek to be provocative for the sake of being provocative. You're saying Robert is overrated, but you're not giving much of an argument on how he's overrated.


Yes. This is off-topic but I must say that I have to agree with you that sometimes there are topics that just state something for provoking people to replying.

Examples: "Jaime More Honorable Than Ned" " there were MULTIPLE threads about it and they basically had very weak arguments.

#20 danm_999

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:44 AM

Yes. This is off-topic but I must say that I have to agree with you that sometimes there are topics that just state something for provoking people to replying.

Examples: "Jaime More Honorable Than Ned" " there were MULTIPLE threads about it and they basically had very weak arguments.


The one which called Jon Snow a baby murderer springs to mind.